{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":4.783,"endTime":8.0,"body":"Hello, and"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":4.783,"endTime":8.0,"body":"welcome to Season 5, Episode 5"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":8.0,"endTime":8.563,"body":"of the"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":8.563,"endTime":11.373,"body":"Virtual Coffee Podcast. I'm"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":8.563,"endTime":11.373,"body":"Bekah. And this is a podcast"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":11.373,"endTime":14.183,"body":"that"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":14.183,"endTime":17.993,"body":"features members of the Virtual"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":14.183,"endTime":17.993,"body":"Coffee community. Virtual Coffee"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":17.993,"endTime":19.298,"body":"is an intimate group of"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":17.993,"endTime":19.298,"body":"developers at all stages of"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":19.298,"endTime":20.603,"body":"their"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":20.603,"endTime":23.333,"body":"coding journey. And they're here"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":20.603,"endTime":23.333,"body":"on this podcast, sharing their"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":23.333,"endTime":24.956,"body":"stories and what they've"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":23.333,"endTime":24.956,"body":"learned. And we're here to share"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":24.956,"endTime":26.579,"body":"it with"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":26.579,"endTime":29.399,"body":"you. Here with me today is my"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":26.579,"endTime":29.399,"body":"cohost, Dan."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":30.074,"endTime":33.225,"body":"Hey, Bekah. Today we're"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":30.074,"endTime":33.225,"body":"talking with Roger Gentry. Roger"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":33.225,"endTime":35.655,"body":"has spent a lot of his career"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":33.225,"endTime":35.655,"body":"managing security and compliance"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":35.655,"endTime":38.445,"body":"for clients across the United"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":35.655,"endTime":38.445,"body":"States. And this episode, you'll"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":38.445,"endTime":40.844,"body":"hear from Roger about"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":38.445,"endTime":40.844,"body":"perseverance, his drive to solve"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":40.844,"endTime":42.509,"body":"problems, and his process for"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":40.844,"endTime":42.509,"body":"finding solutions. He shares"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":42.509,"endTime":44.174,"body":"some"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":44.174,"endTime":46.725,"body":"tips for working through"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":44.174,"endTime":46.725,"body":"frustrations and how to ask for"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":46.725,"endTime":47.115,"body":"help."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":47.695,"endTime":49.975,"body":"We start every episode of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":47.695,"endTime":49.975,"body":"the podcast like we start every"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":49.975,"endTime":52.975,"body":"Virtual Coffee. We introduce"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":49.975,"endTime":52.975,"body":"ourselves with our name, where"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":52.975,"endTime":54.85,"body":"we're from, what we do, and a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":52.975,"endTime":54.85,"body":"random check-in question. We"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":54.85,"endTime":56.725,"body":"hope"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":56.725,"endTime":68.802,"body":"you enjoy this episode. Today's"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":56.725,"endTime":68.802,"body":"random check-in question is, if"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":68.802,"endTime":73.783,"body":"you could be an article of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":68.802,"endTime":73.783,"body":"clothing, what would it be? My"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":73.783,"endTime":77.983,"body":"name is Bekah. I am a technical"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":73.783,"endTime":77.983,"body":"community builder from a small"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":77.983,"endTime":82.813,"body":"town in Ohio. And if I could be"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":77.983,"endTime":82.813,"body":"any article clothing, it'd"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":82.813,"endTime":87.313,"body":"probably be a sweatshirt, like a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":82.813,"endTime":87.313,"body":"hoodie. Because I have a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":87.313,"endTime":90.822,"body":"collection of them since the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":87.313,"endTime":90.822,"body":"pandemic started. I just keep"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":90.852,"endTime":95.112,"body":"buying them. I can't stop."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":90.852,"endTime":95.112,"body":"They're very comfortable and I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":95.112,"endTime":98.472,"body":"like them. So, I'll go with"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":95.112,"endTime":98.472,"body":"hoodie."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":100.287,"endTime":102.327,"body":"Yeah. Hoodies are good. Hi,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":100.287,"endTime":102.327,"body":"I'm Dan. I am a web"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":102.327,"endTime":104.367,"body":"developer"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":104.367,"endTime":109.528,"body":"from Cleveland, Ohio. And, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":104.367,"endTime":109.528,"body":"if I could be an article of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":109.528,"endTime":112.047,"body":"clothing ... I- I mean, hoodie"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":109.528,"endTime":112.047,"body":"was like, up there. I think- I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":112.047,"endTime":114.566,"body":"think"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":114.567,"endTime":119.188,"body":"I'm gonna go with like a- a rain"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":114.567,"endTime":119.188,"body":"shell. So, like a rain- yeah,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":119.197,"endTime":122.0,"body":"raincoat. So I say shell, cuz"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":119.197,"endTime":122.0,"body":"it's like -- that's- [chuckles]"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":122.0,"endTime":123.672,"body":"that's what you call it when"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":122.0,"endTime":123.672,"body":"it's camping, right? So shell is"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":123.672,"endTime":124.647,"body":"something that can go --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":124.0,"endTime":125.0,"body":"Nobody calls it that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":125.0,"endTime":127.528,"body":"Yeah, yeah, yeah. People-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":125.0,"endTime":127.528,"body":"people who know, who know."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":127.528,"endTime":130.018,"body":"And- and if you don't know them,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":127.528,"endTime":130.018,"body":"that's fine too. But it's, like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":130.018,"endTime":132.298,"body":"it's called a shell because you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":130.018,"endTime":132.298,"body":"can put it on top of, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":132.298,"endTime":134.068,"body":"know, if you have a hoodie or"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":132.298,"endTime":134.068,"body":"whatever, you can still wear it,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":134.127,"endTime":136.018,"body":"you know, your raincoat. It"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":134.127,"endTime":136.018,"body":"keeps you protected. But you can"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":136.018,"endTime":138.087,"body":"wear it in summer and stuff too."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":136.018,"endTime":138.087,"body":"But raincoat --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":138.393,"endTime":140.043,"body":"It goes over your"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":138.393,"endTime":140.043,"body":"raincoat?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":140.173,"endTime":142.242,"body":"No, no, no. It's a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":140.173,"endTime":142.242,"body":"raincoat, but like, not like a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":142.242,"endTime":144.311,"body":"fancy"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":144.312,"endTime":147.402,"body":"raincoat that looks nice. It's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":144.312,"endTime":147.402,"body":"like a raincoat that is, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":147.402,"endTime":150.312,"body":"know, a utility. You call it a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":147.402,"endTime":150.312,"body":"shell because you can put it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":150.312,"endTime":153.703,"body":"over, you know, you can, like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":150.312,"endTime":153.703,"body":"[laughs] bring the same raincoat"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":153.703,"endTime":155.7,"body":"camping in the summer, in the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":153.703,"endTime":155.7,"body":"winter, in whatever, you know?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":155.7,"endTime":156.103,"body":"So, in the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":156.103,"endTime":158.0,"body":"winter, I just put it over top"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":156.103,"endTime":158.0,"body":"of all my layers. And in the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":158.0,"endTime":159.103,"body":"summer, put over"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":159.103,"endTime":162.823,"body":"top of the t-shirt or whatever."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":159.103,"endTime":162.823,"body":"That's why it called a shell."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":163.543,"endTime":166.513,"body":"I would like it to look"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":163.543,"endTime":166.513,"body":"like a turtle shell."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":167.818,"endTime":171.0,"body":"[Chuckles] Okay. Well, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":167.818,"endTime":171.0,"body":"can have the turtle shell, rain-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":171.0,"endTime":172.798,"body":"rain shell, [laughs] and that'd"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":171.0,"endTime":172.798,"body":"be fine too."},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":173.598,"endTime":176.0,"body":"Hi, everyone. My"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":173.598,"endTime":176.0,"body":"name's Roger, and I'm a full"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":176.0,"endTime":180.0,"body":"stack developer in sunny"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":176.0,"endTime":180.0,"body":"Southern California. And if I"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":180.0,"endTime":183.0,"body":"was an article of clothing, I'd"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":180.0,"endTime":183.0,"body":"have to be a zip-up hoodie."},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":183.0,"endTime":184.578,"body":"Specifically,"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":184.758,"endTime":187.997,"body":"a zip-up hoodie. Because"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":184.758,"endTime":187.997,"body":"everything else just sort of a"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":187.997,"endTime":191.3,"body":"you get caught in the- in the"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":187.997,"endTime":191.3,"body":"web of the- the sweater. But the"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":191.3,"endTime":191.987,"body":"zip-up, you"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":191.987,"endTime":193.832,"body":"can just go quickly from hot to"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":191.987,"endTime":193.832,"body":"cold. And, you know, I love"},{"speaker":"Roger Gentry","startTime":193.832,"endTime":195.677,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":196.072,"endTime":200.3,"body":"Yeah. I- I like the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":196.072,"endTime":200.3,"body":"zip-up hoodie too. It just"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":200.3,"endTime":201.65,"body":"depends on my"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":201.651,"endTime":204.7,"body":"mood. But also, like, sometimes"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":201.651,"endTime":204.7,"body":"it's hot and sometimes it's"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":204.7,"endTime":207.322,"body":"cold. And it's much easier to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":204.7,"endTime":207.322,"body":"remove one that has a zipper."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":207.724,"endTime":210.3,"body":"Yeah. I mean, zip-up"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":207.724,"endTime":210.3,"body":"hoodies are clearly better than"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":210.3,"endTime":212.5,"body":"pullover, it seems [??]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":210.3,"endTime":212.5,"body":"There's- [chuckles] there's-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":212.5,"endTime":212.501,"body":"there's no contest."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":213.479,"endTime":216.9,"body":"Not all the time. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":213.479,"endTime":216.9,"body":"zippers are cold too. So, if"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":216.9,"endTime":219.7,"body":"it's cold outside, and they"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":216.9,"endTime":219.7,"body":"touch your skin, then it's cold."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":219.7,"endTime":223.0,"body":"Roger, thanks for being here."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":219.7,"endTime":223.0,"body":"We're very glad to have you on"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":223.0,"endTime":227.7,"body":"the podcast. And when we start"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":223.0,"endTime":227.7,"body":"the podcast, everyone, we like"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":227.7,"endTime":231.5,"body":"to get people's origin stories."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":227.7,"endTime":231.5,"body":"So, how -- what brought you to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":231.5,"endTime":234.073,"body":"where you are today in life?"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":236.052,"endTime":238.842,"body":"You know, it's kind of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":236.052,"endTime":238.842,"body":"funny. I- I kind of remember the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":238.842,"endTime":242.443,"body":"first time that I saw somebody"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":238.842,"endTime":242.443,"body":"building a website, and it was"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":242.443,"endTime":247.527,"body":"some friends of mine in the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":242.443,"endTime":247.527,"body":"school library. And they just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":247.527,"endTime":252.508,"body":"-- we're having fun. And I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":247.527,"endTime":252.508,"body":"wanted to do that as well. So, I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":252.568,"endTime":257.307,"body":"kind of acquired a free computer"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":252.568,"endTime":257.307,"body":"and just set that up in my"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":257.307,"endTime":260.0,"body":"room. Like, you know, this is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":257.307,"endTime":260.0,"body":"... I can't even remember the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":260.0,"endTime":264.608,"body":"year. Early two thousands. So,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":260.0,"endTime":264.608,"body":"you know, it wasn't that ... I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":264.617,"endTime":268.747,"body":"advanced to have a laptop quite"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":264.617,"endTime":268.747,"body":"yet for me. And once I kind of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":268.747,"endTime":273.278,"body":"figured out how I could build a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":268.747,"endTime":273.278,"body":"website with HTML, and CSS, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":273.367,"endTime":279.5,"body":"Notepad on the Windows, I kind"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":273.367,"endTime":279.5,"body":"of was hooked. And it just sort"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":279.5,"endTime":284.017,"body":"of became almost like a hobby"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":279.5,"endTime":284.017,"body":"that just kept me going all the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":284.017,"endTime":290.637,"body":"time. And I took that skill set"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":284.017,"endTime":290.637,"body":"and immediately did the thing"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":290.637,"endTime":293.968,"body":"that I've done, kind of forever"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":290.637,"endTime":293.968,"body":"now, is turned it into a way to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":293.968,"endTime":299.098,"body":"make money, which I did by going"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":293.968,"endTime":299.098,"body":"to just the businesses that were"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":299.098,"endTime":301.7,"body":"in my town, and finding the one"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":299.098,"endTime":301.7,"body":"that just had a terrible"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":301.7,"endTime":303.5,"body":"website, and convincing them"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":301.7,"endTime":303.5,"body":"that they needed a new one, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":303.5,"endTime":308.5,"body":"I could be the person to build"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":303.5,"endTime":308.5,"body":"it. Kind of -- as I went along"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":308.5,"endTime":309.543,"body":"in school, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":309.603,"endTime":312.242,"body":"eventually high school, I had an"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":309.603,"endTime":312.242,"body":"opportunity to take kind of a- a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":312.242,"endTime":315.843,"body":"multimedia course, which taught"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":312.242,"endTime":315.843,"body":"me a lot of like Photoshop,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":316.173,"endTime":321.423,"body":"Illustrator, just a lot of photo"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":316.173,"endTime":321.423,"body":"editing and video editing"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":321.423,"endTime":323.598,"body":"skills that I kind of combined"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":321.423,"endTime":323.598,"body":"into this, you know, love of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":323.598,"endTime":325.773,"body":"code"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":325.773,"endTime":330.333,"body":"with the web design side of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":325.773,"endTime":330.333,"body":"things. And, you know, that kind"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":330.333,"endTime":335.072,"body":"of propelled me forward and I've"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":330.333,"endTime":335.072,"body":"always had a knack for fixing"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":335.072,"endTime":340.242,"body":"things. So, I kind of landed in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":335.072,"endTime":340.242,"body":"this weird place of fixing a lot"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":340.242,"endTime":344.622,"body":"more things than I was building."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":340.242,"endTime":344.622,"body":"But then, using the skill set"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":344.622,"endTime":349.033,"body":"of being, you know, a developer"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":344.622,"endTime":349.033,"body":"at heart to build a solutions to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":349.182,"endTime":353.0,"body":"solve problems in ways that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":349.182,"endTime":353.0,"body":"people weren't thinking about."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":353.0,"endTime":353.733,"body":"And that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":353.733,"endTime":355.802,"body":"excited me more and more, and,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":353.733,"endTime":355.802,"body":"you know, I'm kind of a- a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":355.802,"endTime":357.871,"body":"person"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":357.872,"endTime":360.872,"body":"in necessity. If I- if I see"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":357.872,"endTime":360.872,"body":"something that I- I really need,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":360.872,"endTime":364.233,"body":"I'll figure out a way to get it."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":360.872,"endTime":364.233,"body":"And I wanted to build a SaaS"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":364.502,"endTime":367.417,"body":"product for fun. I -- and then"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":364.502,"endTime":367.417,"body":"kind of managed to make that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":367.417,"endTime":370.332,"body":"possible"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":370.452,"endTime":374.892,"body":"with a- a company I was working"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":370.452,"endTime":374.892,"body":"at, and we- we had a lot of fun"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":374.923,"endTime":378.132,"body":"putting it together. 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And that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":405.343,"endTime":407.308,"body":"led me to just to kind of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":407.308,"endTime":409.273,"body":"absorb"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":409.273,"endTime":412.603,"body":"into building iOS and Android"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":409.273,"endTime":412.603,"body":"applications, and then, a web"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":412.603,"endTime":417.012,"body":"backend and, you know, combining"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":412.603,"endTime":417.012,"body":"everything together and finding"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":417.012,"endTime":421.783,"body":"the glue that works the best."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":417.012,"endTime":421.783,"body":"Which, surprisingly, there's no"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":421.783,"endTime":423.237,"body":"really good fit all solution"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":421.783,"endTime":423.237,"body":"despite any of the marketing"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":423.237,"endTime":424.691,"body":"that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":424.692,"endTime":426.874,"body":"you'll see on anybody's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":424.692,"endTime":426.874,"body":"products. And getting"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":426.874,"endTime":429.056,"body":"everything together,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":429.267,"endTime":432.807,"body":"and finally seeing, like, an API"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":429.267,"endTime":432.807,"body":"that I wrote, and connect to the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":432.807,"endTime":434.922,"body":"apps that I helped build with"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":432.807,"endTime":434.922,"body":"the website that I put together"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":434.922,"endTime":437.037,"body":"for a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":437.038,"endTime":440.637,"body":"customer that I sold an idea to,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":437.038,"endTime":440.637,"body":"like, that was the moment that I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":440.637,"endTime":444.418,"body":"really kind of found, like, the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":440.637,"endTime":444.418,"body":"group that I liked to exist in,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":444.418,"endTime":448.288,"body":"and it- it's always propelled me"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":444.418,"endTime":448.288,"body":"to have ideas and projects that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":448.288,"endTime":451.3,"body":"I like working on. But, you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":448.288,"endTime":451.3,"body":"know, going back, I still think"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":451.3,"endTime":452.158,"body":"of the dorky kid"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":452.158,"endTime":456.658,"body":"that was sitting in his room,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":452.158,"endTime":456.658,"body":"reading the \"HTML and CSS For"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":456.658,"endTime":459.387,"body":"Dummies\" book that he bought at"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":456.658,"endTime":459.387,"body":"the thrift store for 50 cents."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":459.418,"endTime":462.778,"body":"And, you know, that's propelled"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":459.418,"endTime":462.778,"body":"me into a lifelong period of not"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":462.778,"endTime":467.247,"body":"only learning, but also figuring"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":462.778,"endTime":467.247,"body":"things out and solving problems"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":467.278,"endTime":471.7,"body":"in just a different way. Because"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":467.278,"endTime":471.7,"body":"you know, I've come from a- a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":471.7,"endTime":472.708,"body":"place where"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":473.908,"endTime":477.358,"body":"I've been building out a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":473.908,"endTime":477.358,"body":"necessity. And if you tell me if"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":477.358,"endTime":479.278,"body":"that there's a problem, I'll"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":477.358,"endTime":479.278,"body":"figure out a way to fix it. The"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":479.278,"endTime":482.278,"body":"way to fix it might not be the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":479.278,"endTime":482.278,"body":"best way. But it's working."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":482.834,"endTime":486.968,"body":"I love that. I- I love that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":482.834,"endTime":486.968,"body":"you're -- and- and like, I- I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":486.978,"endTime":489.5,"body":"think ... maybe not where you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":486.978,"endTime":489.5,"body":"ended up in your career path,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":489.5,"endTime":490.7,"body":"but the beginnings of [chuckles]"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":489.5,"endTime":490.7,"body":"your career started off, this"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":490.7,"endTime":492.198,"body":"very similar to mine,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":492.199,"endTime":495.738,"body":"right? I think I had that exact"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":492.199,"endTime":495.738,"body":"same for dummies book that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":495.738,"endTime":500.0,"body":"I bought at the thrift store as"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":495.738,"endTime":500.0,"body":"well. And, yeah, that -- I mean,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":500.0,"endTime":502.0,"body":"like, the- the- the cool thing"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":500.0,"endTime":502.0,"body":"that -- for me is- is that,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":502.0,"endTime":507.3,"body":"like, how- how you ... sort of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":502.0,"endTime":507.3,"body":"organically followed, right,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":507.3,"endTime":509.748,"body":"what you- what you found"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":507.3,"endTime":509.748,"body":"interesting,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":509.749,"endTime":511.8,"body":"what you saw, you know, need --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":509.749,"endTime":511.8,"body":"like, you saw there- there was a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":511.8,"endTime":513.287,"body":"need for"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":513.318,"endTime":515.868,"body":"different pieces to different"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":513.318,"endTime":515.868,"body":"puzzles, right? And the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":515.868,"endTime":518.418,"body":"idea"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":518.418,"endTime":521.268,"body":"that you don't have to stay in"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":518.418,"endTime":521.268,"body":"one lane, or- or- or one"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":521.268,"endTime":524.118,"body":"specialty,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":524.119,"endTime":526.969,"body":"or anything like that, right? I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":524.119,"endTime":526.969,"body":"mean, fu- full stack developer's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":526.969,"endTime":532.5,"body":"a pretty common phrase these"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":526.969,"endTime":532.5,"body":"days, I think. But I-I-I think"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":532.5,"endTime":536.0,"body":"that- I think that my favorite"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":532.5,"endTime":536.0,"body":"part about that — the full stack"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":536.0,"endTime":540.0,"body":"ideas — is- is the idea that,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":536.0,"endTime":540.0,"body":"like, you- you have the power --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":540.0,"endTime":542.5,"body":"I mean, like, any person has the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":540.0,"endTime":542.5,"body":"power to [chuckles] kinda go"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":542.5,"endTime":544.5,"body":"and- and chase down, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":542.5,"endTime":544.5,"body":"something that they wanna --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":544.5,"endTime":546.203,"body":"that they find interesting and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":544.5,"endTime":546.203,"body":"wanna- and wanna build,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":546.203,"endTime":548.913,"body":"or wanna fix, or wanna solve."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":546.203,"endTime":548.913,"body":"Like, that's really cool."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":548.913,"endTime":552.033,"body":"Something that would"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":548.913,"endTime":552.033,"body":"happen when I was working as a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":552.033,"endTime":553.818,"body":"technician is, you know, I'd"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":552.033,"endTime":553.818,"body":"come in and I'd fix a- a problem"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":553.818,"endTime":555.603,"body":"that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":555.604,"endTime":559.624,"body":"for the user was really, really"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":555.604,"endTime":559.624,"body":"difficult. And I made it seem"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":559.714,"endTime":562.923,"body":"impossibly easy. And a lot of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":559.714,"endTime":562.923,"body":"them would say, \"Wow, you're a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":562.923,"endTime":567.274,"body":"wizard. You fix it like magic.\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":562.923,"endTime":567.274,"body":"And when you sit in front of,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":567.423,"endTime":572.043,"body":"you know, a- a- a terminal for"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":567.423,"endTime":572.043,"body":"the first time, so to speak, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":572.043,"endTime":574.5,"body":"you run that code, and it does"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":572.043,"endTime":574.5,"body":"the thing that you told it to,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":574.5,"endTime":578.433,"body":"like, it feels like magic. It"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":574.5,"endTime":578.433,"body":"feels like you cast a spell and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":578.433,"endTime":581.0,"body":"something cool happened. And,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":578.433,"endTime":581.0,"body":"you know, I feel like that-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":581.0,"endTime":582.178,"body":"that magic is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":582.178,"endTime":585.178,"body":"captivating for- for a lot of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":582.178,"endTime":585.178,"body":"people. And like, once you- once"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":585.178,"endTime":588.5,"body":"you see it, once you realize"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":585.178,"endTime":588.5,"body":"that you can cast that spell and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":588.5,"endTime":589.0,"body":"make that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":589.0,"endTime":591.928,"body":"magic happen, like, it's almost"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":589.0,"endTime":591.928,"body":"an addiction. Like, you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":591.928,"endTime":594.0,"body":"like, \"Oh, what other things can"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":591.928,"endTime":594.0,"body":"I do?\" It's like, \"Oh, yeah."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":594.0,"endTime":594.358,"body":"This"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":594.359,"endTime":597.239,"body":"doorbell is no longer supported."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":594.359,"endTime":597.239,"body":"Let's see if we can, you know,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":597.239,"endTime":600.538,"body":"hack it and make it something-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":597.239,"endTime":600.538,"body":"something useful again.\" Like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":601.078,"endTime":604.198,"body":"it's just, you find solutions to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":601.078,"endTime":604.198,"body":"problems that, you know, you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":604.198,"endTime":607.438,"body":"didn't even know were problems"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":604.198,"endTime":607.438,"body":"because now, you know the magic"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":607.438,"endTime":608.458,"body":"behind how it all works."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":608.831,"endTime":612.85,"body":"Yeah, I love how you talk"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":608.831,"endTime":612.85,"body":"so much about the- the magic and"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":612.85,"endTime":615.1,"body":"the problem solving. And I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":612.85,"endTime":615.1,"body":"think, that's one of the things"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":615.1,"endTime":617.98,"body":"that interest so many people"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":615.1,"endTime":617.98,"body":"about being in tech, and it's"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":617.98,"endTime":620.7,"body":"simultaneously one of the most"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":617.98,"endTime":620.7,"body":"frustrating things about being"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":620.7,"endTime":624.221,"body":"in tech, right? Like, it can get"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":620.7,"endTime":624.221,"body":"hard and you're stuck on those"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":624.221,"endTime":628.0,"body":"problems in ... it -- sometimes,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":624.221,"endTime":628.0,"body":"it causes feelings of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":628.0,"endTime":629.305,"body":"self-doubt, like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":629.365,"endTime":632.7,"body":"\"Oh, what kind of programmer am"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":629.365,"endTime":632.7,"body":"I? I can't figure this out.\""},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":632.7,"endTime":633.205,"body":"So, how"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":633.206,"endTime":637.525,"body":"do you approach problem solving"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":633.206,"endTime":637.525,"body":"and- and maybe avoid those"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":637.525,"endTime":640.466,"body":"feelings? Or do you have tips on"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":637.525,"endTime":640.466,"body":"how to avoid those feelings?"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":641.505,"endTime":645.946,"body":"You know, so much of what"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":641.505,"endTime":645.946,"body":"I've been able to figure out has"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":645.946,"endTime":649.605,"body":"been a, \"Let me just change this"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":645.946,"endTime":649.605,"body":"line of code, refresh, and see"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":649.605,"endTime":652.7,"body":"if it fixes the problem.\" And,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":649.605,"endTime":652.7,"body":"you know, I come from a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":652.7,"endTime":653.671,"body":"background of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":653.76,"endTime":656.941,"body":"fixing a lot of weird problems"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":653.76,"endTime":656.941,"body":"that I never had a- a -- say, in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":656.941,"endTime":660.0,"body":"creating. And so, a lot of the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":656.941,"endTime":660.0,"body":"times, it was like, \"Okay, this"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":660.0,"endTime":664.0,"body":"was doing a thing correctly ..."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":660.0,"endTime":664.0,"body":"before, and this is how we got"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":664.0,"endTime":664.35,"body":"to there."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":664.681,"endTime":667.23,"body":"Now, when I try to do these"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":664.681,"endTime":667.23,"body":"steps, this is what happens."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":667.561,"endTime":669.7,"body":"Well, now, I know how to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":667.561,"endTime":669.7,"body":"replicate the problem. And I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":669.7,"endTime":670.259,"body":"gonna just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":670.26,"endTime":671.64,"body":"work backwards from there and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":670.26,"endTime":671.64,"body":"try to figure out why it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":671.64,"endTime":673.02,"body":"failing in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":673.02,"endTime":676.5,"body":"that step. And okay. Well, now"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":673.02,"endTime":676.5,"body":"we know it's this problem. Let's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":676.5,"endTime":679.201,"body":"search around and see if we can"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":676.5,"endTime":679.201,"body":"figure out if there's a solution"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":679.201,"endTime":683.245,"body":"for this somewhere that we can"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":679.201,"endTime":683.245,"body":"use or if we just keep having to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":683.245,"endTime":686.5,"body":"dig further down.\" So, it's kind"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":683.245,"endTime":686.5,"body":"of more of a beat it with a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":686.5,"endTime":690.3,"body":"hammer until it shows you, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":686.5,"endTime":690.3,"body":"something that's useful, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":690.3,"endTime":690.894,"body":"then, you take"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":690.895,"endTime":693.416,"body":"that little spec and it's like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":690.895,"endTime":693.416,"body":"\"Okay, let's analyze this, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":693.416,"endTime":696.0,"body":"go down a rabbit hole, and solve"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":693.416,"endTime":696.0,"body":"that problem, and then move on"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":696.0,"endTime":696.446,"body":"to the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":696.446,"endTime":699.5,"body":"next error.\" And eventually,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":696.446,"endTime":699.5,"body":"you'll find kind of the answer."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":699.5,"endTime":700.196,"body":"And then,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":700.196,"endTime":703.676,"body":"once you have, like, that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":700.196,"endTime":703.676,"body":"experiences to that one problem,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":704.166,"endTime":706.3,"body":"you- you know that that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":704.166,"endTime":706.3,"body":"networking piece equip- of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":706.3,"endTime":707.375,"body":"equipment in the closet"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":707.375,"endTime":709.846,"body":"was actually the faulty, you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":707.375,"endTime":709.846,"body":"know, problem the whole thing."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":709.846,"endTime":713.0,"body":"And it was a bad ethernet cable"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":709.846,"endTime":713.0,"body":"that somebody, you know, broken"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":713.0,"endTime":713.566,"body":"the door"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":713.566,"endTime":717.466,"body":"that caused everybody's issues"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":713.566,"endTime":717.466,"body":"for the day. And now, in the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":717.466,"endTime":719.895,"body":"future, when you're sitting in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":717.466,"endTime":719.895,"body":"there looking at that similar,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":719.895,"endTime":720.255,"body":"you know,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":720.255,"endTime":722.895,"body":"problem, you know, your mind is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":720.255,"endTime":722.895,"body":"thinking about these things as"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":722.895,"endTime":725.7,"body":"well, whereas before, it may"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":722.895,"endTime":725.7,"body":"have taken you hours to get"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":725.7,"endTime":725.926,"body":"there."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":726.196,"endTime":728.716,"body":"Well, now I know I can overcome"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":726.196,"endTime":728.716,"body":"that because I had to do it in a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":728.716,"endTime":731.956,"body":"time of crisis. And I can -- if"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":728.716,"endTime":731.956,"body":"I can overcome that, this little"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":731.956,"endTime":733.816,"body":"error that I'm dealing with I'll"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":731.956,"endTime":733.816,"body":"figure out eventually. And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":733.816,"endTime":735.676,"body":"it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":735.676,"endTime":739.005,"body":"the same thing with programming."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":735.676,"endTime":739.005,"body":"Like, I was dealing with, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":739.485,"endTime":744.451,"body":"just ... some data formats that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":739.485,"endTime":744.451,"body":"I wasn't familiar with. And I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":744.541,"endTime":747.721,"body":"wanted to just sort of see if I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":744.541,"endTime":747.721,"body":"could figure it out. It took a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":747.721,"endTime":749.25,"body":"little while, but eventually,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":747.721,"endTime":749.25,"body":"you know, I put enough pieces to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":749.25,"endTime":750.779,"body":"the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":750.78,"endTime":752.715,"body":"puzzle together and I got the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":750.78,"endTime":752.715,"body":"answer I needed. And, like, it-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":752.715,"endTime":754.65,"body":"it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":754.65,"endTime":757.441,"body":"was one of those moments where"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":754.65,"endTime":757.441,"body":"it's like, I overcame something"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":757.441,"endTime":759.376,"body":"that was only existed because"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":757.441,"endTime":759.376,"body":"the way that I formatted the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":759.376,"endTime":761.311,"body":"first"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":761.311,"endTime":764.16,"body":"time wasn't necessarily the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":761.311,"endTime":764.16,"body":"correct way to parse that data."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":764.49,"endTime":767.7,"body":"But then once I figured out the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":764.49,"endTime":767.7,"body":"right way, it, like, it worked."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":767.7,"endTime":768.005,"body":"And then"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":768.005,"endTime":770.0,"body":"I'm sitting there, being like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":768.005,"endTime":770.0,"body":"\"Ha! And now it works.\" And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":770.0,"endTime":773.076,"body":"instantly, I was trying to find"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":770.0,"endTime":773.076,"body":"the next problem to solve."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":773.626,"endTime":778.147,"body":"Yeah. That dopamine rush"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":773.626,"endTime":778.147,"body":"from actually solving the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":778.147,"endTime":780.3,"body":"thing, right? And it- it- it's,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":778.147,"endTime":780.3,"body":"like, greater -- I feel like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":780.3,"endTime":780.996,"body":"for me, at"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":780.996,"endTime":784.0,"body":"least, most of the time, anyway"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":780.996,"endTime":784.0,"body":"[chuckles], it's- it's greater."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":784.0,"endTime":785.5,"body":"The harder it is, you know, the-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":785.5,"endTime":788.527,"body":"the deeper down the rabbit hole"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":785.5,"endTime":788.527,"body":"you go, right? There's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":788.527,"endTime":792.0,"body":"sometimes where ... I get all"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":788.527,"endTime":792.0,"body":"the way down and I figured it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":792.0,"endTime":795.3,"body":"out. But it's just taken me so"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":792.0,"endTime":795.3,"body":"long, [chuckles] that- that I'm"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":795.3,"endTime":797.7,"body":"just, like, \"I- I just hate"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":795.3,"endTime":797.7,"body":"this.\" Like, \"Finally, it's --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":797.7,"endTime":801.0,"body":"this bug is squashed,\" you know?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":797.7,"endTime":801.0,"body":"[Laughs] But I think, lots of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":801.0,"endTime":801.936,"body":"times, I get that- I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":801.937,"endTime":805.547,"body":"get that same- that same, like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":801.937,"endTime":805.547,"body":"spike of just feels good. I'm"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":805.557,"endTime":807.216,"body":"like, \"Okay, let's find out"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":805.557,"endTime":807.216,"body":"what's next,\" you know?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":807.216,"endTime":809.0,"body":"I think it's so cool."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":809.856,"endTime":813.756,"body":"I've had times where I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":809.856,"endTime":813.756,"body":"spent a- a lot of the night in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":813.756,"endTime":817.057,"body":"networking closet, trying to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":813.756,"endTime":817.057,"body":"solve some weird networking"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":817.057,"endTime":820.0,"body":"problem, and trying to get"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":817.057,"endTime":820.0,"body":"something that was on the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":820.0,"endTime":820.417,"body":"network"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":820.417,"endTime":823.3,"body":"that was working before I got"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":820.417,"endTime":823.3,"body":"there wasn't working now, to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":823.3,"endTime":823.715,"body":"back"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":823.716,"endTime":826.836,"body":"to that working state. And it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":823.716,"endTime":826.836,"body":"hot, and it's terrible, and I'm"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":826.836,"endTime":829.927,"body":"hungry. And so, anytime that I'm"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":826.836,"endTime":829.927,"body":"sitting in front of my computer"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":829.927,"endTime":832.5,"body":"working on a hard coding"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":829.927,"endTime":832.5,"body":"problem, I think back. I think"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":832.5,"endTime":833.281,"body":"back to myself"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":833.282,"endTime":836.042,"body":"and the networking closet. And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":833.282,"endTime":836.042,"body":"remember, I'm not there, and I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":836.042,"endTime":839.0,"body":"can't eat something, and I can't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":836.042,"endTime":839.0,"body":"step away, and it is fine."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":839.0,"endTime":841.0,"body":"Because I will figure it out."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":841.0,"endTime":843.361,"body":"And it's- it's kind of, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":841.0,"endTime":843.361,"body":"the sense of encouragement"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":843.361,"endTime":845.552,"body":"that I tell myself when I'm"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":843.361,"endTime":845.552,"body":"dealing with the hard problem."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":845.552,"endTime":847.922,"body":"Just knowing that eventually it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":845.552,"endTime":847.922,"body":"will be solved one way or"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":847.922,"endTime":851.3,"body":"another. And there's only so"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":847.922,"endTime":851.3,"body":"much I can worry about with it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":851.3,"endTime":851.73,"body":"right"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":851.731,"endTime":854.5,"body":"now. And eventually, you just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":851.731,"endTime":854.5,"body":"have to say enough's enough,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":854.5,"endTime":857.0,"body":"walk away, and come back to it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":854.5,"endTime":857.0,"body":"later. And you're like, \"Oh,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":857.0,"endTime":859.0,"body":"yeah! You know what? I don't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":857.0,"endTime":859.0,"body":"know why this is so hard"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":859.0,"endTime":860.432,"body":"earlier. I was just grumpy.\""},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":861.361,"endTime":864.0,"body":"I think that's great"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":861.361,"endTime":864.0,"body":"advice. And I- I like -- I wanna"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":864.0,"endTime":865.351,"body":"reiterate"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":865.351,"endTime":867.0,"body":"that cuz that's the -- one of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":865.351,"endTime":867.0,"body":"the hardest things to remember."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":867.0,"endTime":871.0,"body":"And it's so easy to get stuck in"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":867.0,"endTime":871.0,"body":"that. Like, it's- it's so easy"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":871.0,"endTime":871.282,"body":"-- it's-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":871.461,"endTime":875.032,"body":"it's like when you're down in"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":871.461,"endTime":875.032,"body":"some hole, you know, trying to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":875.032,"endTime":877.942,"body":"figure something out and nothing"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":875.032,"endTime":877.942,"body":"makes sense. It's hard to step"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":877.942,"endTime":881.0,"body":"away. It's -- at least for me,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":877.942,"endTime":881.0,"body":"it's hard. I ca- I have a hard"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":881.0,"endTime":882.142,"body":"time stepping away."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":882.201,"endTime":886.761,"body":"And -- but you're right, Roger."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":882.201,"endTime":886.761,"body":"Like, every time that I do, it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":886.761,"endTime":888.5,"body":"helpful. Like, it's always"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":886.761,"endTime":888.5,"body":"helpful. And I'm always like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":888.5,"endTime":891.7,"body":"\"Why didn't I just do this an"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":888.5,"endTime":891.7,"body":"hour ago?\" [Chuckles] Like, \"Why"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":891.7,"endTime":894.0,"body":"didn't I just go walk around the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":891.7,"endTime":894.0,"body":"building, or go get it --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":894.0,"endTime":896.5,"body":"you know, across the street, get"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":894.0,"endTime":896.5,"body":"a cup of coffee or something?\""},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":896.5,"endTime":899.7,"body":"Like, that- that -- it -- every"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":896.5,"endTime":899.7,"body":"time -- you know, not every"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":899.7,"endTime":900.412,"body":"time, but it-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":900.412,"endTime":902.871,"body":"it happens to me so often, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":900.412,"endTime":902.871,"body":"know? And it- it's like, I don't"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":902.871,"endTime":905.481,"body":"know, almost physically hard to-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":902.871,"endTime":905.481,"body":"to get myself to step away. I'm"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":905.481,"endTime":907.192,"body":"like, \"I know I can get this if"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":905.481,"endTime":907.192,"body":"I just --\""},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":907.626,"endTime":909.667,"body":"I always get annoyed when"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":907.626,"endTime":909.667,"body":"people are like, \"Just step up-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":909.667,"endTime":910.3,"body":"Yeah. Right."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":909.817,"endTime":911.5,"body":"-you just need to go for"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":909.817,"endTime":911.5,"body":"a walk.\" I'm like, \"You just"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":911.5,"endTime":914.3,"body":"don't need to tell me what to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":911.5,"endTime":914.3,"body":"do,\" right? And then, like an"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":914.3,"endTime":916.5,"body":"hour and a half later, I'm doing"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":914.3,"endTime":916.5,"body":"it. I'm like, \"Oh, go- okay."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":916.5,"endTime":918.667,"body":"Fine.\" Like, \"Yes, now I- I get"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":916.5,"endTime":918.667,"body":"it.\" Like [laughs] --"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":920.767,"endTime":923.407,"body":"I think, part of that is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":920.767,"endTime":923.407,"body":"you know that there's, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":923.407,"endTime":926.256,"body":"that dopamine rush when you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":923.407,"endTime":926.256,"body":"gonna solve the problem. And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":926.256,"endTime":929.0,"body":"so, you're like, \"I -- if I just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":926.256,"endTime":929.0,"body":"do this a little bit longer, it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":929.0,"endTime":932.3,"body":"will be solved, and I'm gonna"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":929.0,"endTime":932.3,"body":"feel good about it. So, you're-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":932.3,"endTime":932.797,"body":"you're- you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":932.797,"endTime":935.976,"body":"so in the middle of, like, that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":932.797,"endTime":935.976,"body":"frustrating piece where you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":935.976,"endTime":938.586,"body":"just, like, you know the payoff"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":935.976,"endTime":938.586,"body":"is gonna be so much better"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":938.586,"endTime":940.626,"body":"than more frustrated at the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":938.586,"endTime":940.626,"body":"problem that you're gonna -- you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":940.626,"endTime":943.5,"body":"are, that you just wanna finish"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":940.626,"endTime":943.5,"body":"it. And stepping away is almost"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":943.5,"endTime":944.076,"body":"like a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":944.076,"endTime":948.0,"body":"sign of defeat into yourself. No"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":944.076,"endTime":948.0,"body":"one else cares. But you- but you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":948.0,"endTime":949.596,"body":"do. At -- but even so,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":949.596,"endTime":954.517,"body":"like, that- that step away is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":949.596,"endTime":954.517,"body":"what you need. And yet, doing it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":954.517,"endTime":956.797,"body":"is so f-frustratingly difficult."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":957.927,"endTime":960.3,"body":"Yeah. There's -- I was"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":957.927,"endTime":960.3,"body":"working on this problem last"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":960.3,"endTime":961.677,"body":"week. And I knew that I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":961.677,"endTime":966.2,"body":"was close, right? Like, I could"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":961.677,"endTime":966.2,"body":"feel it, there's something"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":966.2,"endTime":966.506,"body":"wrong."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":966.567,"endTime":971.001,"body":"And I- I just needed to spend"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":966.567,"endTime":971.001,"body":"more time going over line by"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":971.001,"endTime":974.062,"body":"line, which I had already done."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":971.001,"endTime":974.062,"body":"I had already done with other"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":974.062,"endTime":979.5,"body":"people too. And then, finally, I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":974.062,"endTime":979.5,"body":"-- well, then I go into this"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":979.5,"endTime":979.97,"body":"mode of,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":980.001,"endTime":983.5,"body":"\"All right. I know that one of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":980.001,"endTime":983.5,"body":"these things is wrong.\" And then"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":983.5,"endTime":988.0,"body":"I just start, like, throwing"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":983.5,"endTime":988.0,"body":"code at it, chaotically. It just"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":988.0,"endTime":990.0,"body":"not what you should do"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":988.0,"endTime":990.0,"body":"[chuckles]."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":990.0,"endTime":996.621,"body":"Because somewhere in there, I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":990.0,"endTime":996.621,"body":"had the right piece. But then, I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":996.652,"endTime":1001.0,"body":"messed up the other piece that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":996.652,"endTime":1001.0,"body":"connected it, and so -- then, it"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1001.0,"endTime":1004.3,"body":"still didn't work. And then I- I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1001.0,"endTime":1004.3,"body":"was debugging it with a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1004.3,"endTime":1008.0,"body":"coworker. And they're -- they"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1004.3,"endTime":1008.0,"body":"said, \"Oh, yeah. It's this"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1008.0,"endTime":1010.0,"body":"thing. This is what I expected"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1008.0,"endTime":1010.0,"body":"it was,\" you know?"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1010.0,"endTime":1013.591,"body":"\"You- you forgot to ...\" I was"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1010.0,"endTime":1013.591,"body":"like, \"I did have that. I had"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1013.591,"endTime":1017.7,"body":"it at one point. I just deleted"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1013.591,"endTime":1017.7,"body":"it, okay?\" And- and so,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1017.7,"endTime":1022.0,"body":"instead, I had this mess of a- a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1017.7,"endTime":1022.0,"body":"codebase that -- that's not what"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1022.0,"endTime":1023.7,"body":"you want. So, like, taking,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1023.7,"endTime":1030.632,"body":"I think, that -- taking that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1023.7,"endTime":1030.632,"body":"advice of walking away, thinking"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1030.632,"endTime":1034.051,"body":"through the problem, rather than"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1030.632,"endTime":1034.051,"body":"just, like, throwing all of the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1034.051,"endTime":1038.402,"body":"things at it is a- a skill I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1034.051,"endTime":1038.402,"body":"need to learn, maybe? [Chuckles]"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1040.277,"endTime":1043.876,"body":"Yeah. Other approach that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1040.277,"endTime":1043.876,"body":"I like to the mingled codebase"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1043.876,"endTime":1045.7,"body":"is the burn it all to the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1043.876,"endTime":1045.7,"body":"ground, take what we know is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1045.7,"endTime":1047.057,"body":"good, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1047.057,"endTime":1049.426,"body":"let's just start over for a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1047.057,"endTime":1049.426,"body":"little bit. Cuz we learned a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1049.426,"endTime":1053.027,"body":"lot and throwing all of this"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1049.426,"endTime":1053.027,"body":"spaghetti against the wall, but"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1053.027,"endTime":1055.606,"body":"yet nothing really stucks. But"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1053.027,"endTime":1055.606,"body":"we've learned some stuff in the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1055.606,"endTime":1058.0,"body":"process. So we gonna take what"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1055.606,"endTime":1058.0,"body":"the good bits that we know, go"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1058.0,"endTime":1058.516,"body":"back to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1058.517,"endTime":1061.936,"body":"where we know the data is good,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1058.517,"endTime":1061.936,"body":"and try to do what fit, what we"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1061.936,"endTime":1065.721,"body":"want. And probably, starting"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1061.936,"endTime":1065.721,"body":"over with a fresh slate is gonna"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1065.721,"endTime":1069.0,"body":"give us the answers we need,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1065.721,"endTime":1069.0,"body":"because we were not good when we"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1069.0,"endTime":1070.852,"body":"were writing that other code. We"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1069.0,"endTime":1070.852,"body":"were frustrated."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1071.987,"endTime":1074.5,"body":"Yeah. And I think that's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1071.987,"endTime":1074.5,"body":"great advice and- and it helps"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1074.5,"endTime":1075.075,"body":"sort of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1075.076,"endTime":1077.747,"body":"isolate, you know, you can still"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1075.076,"endTime":1077.747,"body":"add things a bit at a time, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1077.747,"endTime":1080.7,"body":"know? So, starting from that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1077.747,"endTime":1080.7,"body":"fresh -- the fresh, like ... the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1080.7,"endTime":1081.106,"body":"fresh,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1081.106,"endTime":1084.396,"body":"like, you know, add things step"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1081.106,"endTime":1084.396,"body":"by step, you know? And- and you-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1084.396,"endTime":1088.396,"body":"you very, like, you know how you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1084.396,"endTime":1088.396,"body":"want it to work. So, maybe the-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1088.576,"endTime":1090.5,"body":"the route will be a little bit"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1088.576,"endTime":1090.5,"body":"more straight forward this way,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1090.5,"endTime":1090.796,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1090.886,"endTime":1094.527,"body":"Cuz you have, like, a plan in"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1090.886,"endTime":1094.527,"body":"your head. But it'll help you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1094.616,"endTime":1098.217,"body":"sort of isolate the problem too."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1094.616,"endTime":1098.217,"body":"And that's good advice. The"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1098.217,"endTime":1099.926,"body":"spaghetti on the wall method,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1098.217,"endTime":1099.926,"body":"right? [Chuckles]"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1102.497,"endTime":1106.5,"body":"My favorite method. So,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1102.497,"endTime":1106.5,"body":"one of the things that we"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1106.5,"endTime":1110.5,"body":"talk a lot about at Virtual"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1106.5,"endTime":1110.5,"body":"Coffee is asking questions."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1110.5,"endTime":1144.7,"body":"And I think that this kind of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1110.5,"endTime":1144.7,"body":"goes along with the conversation"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1144.7,"endTime":1144.701,"body":"about, you know, how"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1115.707,"endTime":1119.487,"body":"do you ask questions? How do you"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1115.707,"endTime":1119.487,"body":"ask for help? Like, what is the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1119.487,"endTime":1122.457,"body":"right approach to doing that?"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1119.487,"endTime":1122.457,"body":"And it can be in your codebase,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1122.457,"endTime":1125.3,"body":"it could be when you're"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1122.457,"endTime":1125.3,"body":"interviewing for a job, but what"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1125.3,"endTime":1125.845,"body":"do you think"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1125.846,"endTime":1130.616,"body":"is a good approach to asking"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1125.846,"endTime":1130.616,"body":"questions or asking for support"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1130.616,"endTime":1132.267,"body":"or help for finding it?"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1134.067,"endTime":1137.0,"body":"So, it kind of- kind of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1134.067,"endTime":1137.0,"body":"depends on the problem,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1137.0,"endTime":1137.575,"body":"right? If"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1137.576,"endTime":1140.487,"body":"you're talking about, you know,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1137.576,"endTime":1140.487,"body":"you're sitting on an interview"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1140.487,"endTime":1145.332,"body":"and you wanna know if they do X,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1140.487,"endTime":1145.332,"body":"Y, or Z, right? You just ask."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1145.422,"endTime":1149.471,"body":"And like, it seems scary at"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1145.422,"endTime":1149.471,"body":"first, but every company that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1149.471,"endTime":1151.3,"body":"I've been in the first interview"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1149.471,"endTime":1151.3,"body":"with, and I've been like, \"So,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1151.3,"endTime":1151.691,"body":"what"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1151.692,"endTime":1154.751,"body":"kind of like hardware stack are"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1151.692,"endTime":1154.751,"body":"we dealing with?\" They're always"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1154.751,"endTime":1157.0,"body":"like, \"Wait. Why do you care?\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1154.751,"endTime":1157.0,"body":"Like, \"You're interviewing for"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1157.0,"endTime":1157.5,"body":"this role.\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1157.5,"endTime":1159.221,"body":"And it's like, \"Well, no. I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1157.5,"endTime":1159.221,"body":"genuinely wanna make sure it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1159.221,"endTime":1160.991,"body":"something that I'm gonna be"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1159.221,"endTime":1160.991,"body":"interested in dealing with,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1160.991,"endTime":1164.0,"body":"before, like, I get excited and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1160.991,"endTime":1164.0,"body":"we waste everybody's time, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1164.0,"endTime":1169.0,"body":"then I get to the job, and it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1164.0,"endTime":1169.0,"body":"not exciting.\" Like -- and each"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1169.0,"endTime":1169.422,"body":"time that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1169.422,"endTime":1172.7,"body":"I've asked, like, weird,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1169.422,"endTime":1172.7,"body":"difficult questions or just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1172.7,"endTime":1173.291,"body":"something that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1173.291,"endTime":1176.561,"body":"I was just curious about, i-it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1173.291,"endTime":1176.561,"body":"always needed a good result in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1176.561,"endTime":1180.162,"body":"the interview. Like, I remember"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1176.561,"endTime":1180.162,"body":"in one, where I asked"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1180.162,"endTime":1183.0,"body":"the ... founder of the company,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1180.162,"endTime":1183.0,"body":"where he sees himself in the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1183.0,"endTime":1184.122,"body":"organization in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1184.122,"endTime":1189.041,"body":"five years. And that was a- that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1184.122,"endTime":1189.041,"body":"was a fun question to see the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1189.041,"endTime":1191.294,"body":"last on [??] all of the other"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1189.041,"endTime":1191.294,"body":"managers, where they're just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1191.294,"endTime":1193.547,"body":"like ... [chuckles]. But the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1193.547,"endTime":1197.176,"body":"answer that he gave me was more"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1193.547,"endTime":1197.176,"body":"about the vision of the company"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1197.176,"endTime":1200.0,"body":"and where they wanted to take"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1197.176,"endTime":1200.0,"body":"it, which was really exciting."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1200.0,"endTime":1203.5,"body":"And so you- you kind of take"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1200.0,"endTime":1203.5,"body":"that same approach when you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1203.5,"endTime":1204.912,"body":"dealing with code, right?"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1205.332,"endTime":1207.786,"body":"If you have a problem, you look"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1205.332,"endTime":1207.786,"body":"at your message. And I just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1207.786,"endTime":1208.5,"body":"start by taking"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1208.5,"endTime":1210.991,"body":"your message, copying and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1208.5,"endTime":1210.991,"body":"pasting to the search engine,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1210.991,"endTime":1213.731,"body":"and then say, \"Stack Overflow,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1210.991,"endTime":1213.731,"body":"give me the great answers to my"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1213.731,"endTime":1217.4,"body":"problem.\" And combining that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1213.731,"endTime":1217.4,"body":"with whatever language you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1217.4,"endTime":1217.781,"body":"writing"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1217.781,"endTime":1221.291,"body":"it in, and what you're trying to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1217.781,"endTime":1221.291,"body":"do, typically nets somebody else"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1221.291,"endTime":1225.207,"body":"on the internet who has the same"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1221.291,"endTime":1225.207,"body":"problem. And there's probably an"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1225.207,"endTime":1228.5,"body":"XKCD that's relevant to that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1225.207,"endTime":1228.5,"body":"exact topic because I've s-s-s"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1228.5,"endTime":1230.517,"body":"-- [Dan chuckles] linked"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1230.517,"endTime":1234.237,"body":"to it many times. And it's just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1230.517,"endTime":1234.237,"body":"-- it's kind of that. Like, you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1234.237,"endTime":1236.096,"body":"know, it doesn't matter what the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1234.237,"endTime":1236.096,"body":"problem you're dealing with,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1236.096,"endTime":1238.376,"body":"there- there's an answer out"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1236.096,"endTime":1238.376,"body":"there somewhere. Somebody knows"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1238.376,"endTime":1240.5,"body":"that answer to the problem"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1238.376,"endTime":1240.5,"body":"you're dealing with. And it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1240.5,"endTime":1241.706,"body":"just how do we"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1241.707,"endTime":1245.457,"body":"get there? And sometimes, the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1241.707,"endTime":1245.457,"body":"answer is you need to call the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1245.457,"endTime":1249.5,"body":"vendor or email the person that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1245.457,"endTime":1249.5,"body":"wrote it. And it seems"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1249.5,"endTime":1249.991,"body":"terrifying"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1249.991,"endTime":1253.142,"body":"the first dozen times that you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1249.991,"endTime":1253.142,"body":"email somebody that wrote some"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1253.142,"endTime":1257.0,"body":"piece of code, but something"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1253.142,"endTime":1257.0,"body":"that I've learned about"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1257.0,"endTime":1262.0,"body":"developers and people that work"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1257.0,"endTime":1262.0,"body":"in technology is given an"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1262.0,"endTime":1263.432,"body":"opportunity to talk about"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1263.432,"endTime":1266.0,"body":"something nerdy. We're gonna"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1263.432,"endTime":1266.0,"body":"waste as much time as we"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1266.642,"endTime":1269.0,"body":"possibly can, because it's so"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1266.642,"endTime":1269.0,"body":"rare that we get somebody who's,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1269.0,"endTime":1269.73,"body":"like, excited"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1269.731,"endTime":1272.402,"body":"about the same thing that we're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1269.731,"endTime":1272.402,"body":"doing. And then, it's just like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1272.912,"endTime":1275.852,"body":"\"Okay. Yeah. That took so much"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1272.912,"endTime":1275.852,"body":"effort to write that email. But"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1275.852,"endTime":1277.981,"body":"now, like, I know this guy and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1275.852,"endTime":1277.981,"body":"we're gonna totally meet for"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1277.981,"endTime":1280.082,"body":"drinks when he's at this"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1277.981,"endTime":1280.082,"body":"conference, because, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1280.082,"endTime":1283.5,"body":"that's the connection we made.\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1280.082,"endTime":1283.5,"body":"And it's just about asking the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1283.5,"endTime":1283.892,"body":"questions, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1283.892,"endTime":1288.207,"body":"just finding the right person."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1283.892,"endTime":1288.207,"body":"And ... everybody's got an email"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1288.207,"endTime":1291.5,"body":"address on their code, or you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1288.207,"endTime":1291.5,"body":"can message them in Twitter,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1291.5,"endTime":1293.5,"body":"which is still a weird"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1293.5,"endTime":1296.307,"body":"experience, just to be able to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1293.5,"endTime":1296.307,"body":"message some random company and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1296.396,"endTime":1299.0,"body":"being like, \"Hey, I have this"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1296.396,"endTime":1299.0,"body":"thing. Would you be interested?\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1299.0,"endTime":1302.0,"body":"And then next thing you know,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1299.0,"endTime":1302.0,"body":"you on a meeting to, you know,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1302.0,"endTime":1305.0,"body":"meet the person that posted that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1302.0,"endTime":1305.0,"body":"tweet."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1305.0,"endTime":1308.5,"body":"And ... that's kind of the whole"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1305.0,"endTime":1308.5,"body":"power that we have today where"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1308.5,"endTime":1311.3,"body":"we didn't have life [??] in --"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1308.5,"endTime":1311.3,"body":"like, when I got started in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1311.3,"endTime":1313.092,"body":"technology, there was- there was"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1311.3,"endTime":1313.092,"body":"no"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1313.092,"endTime":1315.761,"body":"Facebook, there was no MySpace."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1313.092,"endTime":1315.761,"body":"It seems like a weird time"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1315.761,"endTime":1319.0,"body":"because I'm not that old. But in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1315.761,"endTime":1319.0,"body":"the- in the age of tech, you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1319.0,"endTime":1321.5,"body":"know, you -- it moves at such a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1319.0,"endTime":1321.5,"body":"rapid pace"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1321.5,"endTime":1324.311,"body":"that you are ... [chuckles] you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1321.5,"endTime":1324.311,"body":"get dated very"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1324.311,"endTime":1327.402,"body":"quickly if you haven't paying"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1324.311,"endTime":1327.402,"body":"attention. And at that time"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1327.402,"endTime":1330.0,"body":"period, like, finding"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1327.402,"endTime":1330.0,"body":"information was a lot harder."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1330.0,"endTime":1334.0,"body":"But now, it's just ... at -- it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1330.0,"endTime":1334.0,"body":"just depends on how persistent"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1334.0,"endTime":1337.436,"body":"you are and how bad you want"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1334.0,"endTime":1337.436,"body":"that thing or ..."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1337.436,"endTime":1340.257,"body":"in that answer. If you really,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1337.436,"endTime":1340.257,"body":"really want the answer to the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1340.257,"endTime":1342.717,"body":"question, you'll find it. It"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1340.257,"endTime":1342.717,"body":"just might take some time."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1343.946,"endTime":1345.0,"body":"Sorry. I was- I was-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1345.0,"endTime":1345.3,"body":"Yeah [chuckles]."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1345.3,"endTime":1346.557,"body":"-I was thinking. I was"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1345.3,"endTime":1346.557,"body":"deep in thought [laughs]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1346.557,"endTime":1348.791,"body":"I don't know. Yeah. I was"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1346.557,"endTime":1348.791,"body":"just reminiscing back when there"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1348.791,"endTime":1350.006,"body":"was no Stack Overflow [laughs]."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1350.721,"endTime":1352.791,"body":"My kids like to refer to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1350.721,"endTime":1352.791,"body":"that as the olden days. We"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1352.791,"endTime":1355.192,"body":"watched the s- \"The Amazing"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1352.791,"endTime":1355.192,"body":"Spider-Man\", the one with Andrew"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1355.192,"endTime":1357.561,"body":"Garfield this weekend. And"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1355.192,"endTime":1357.561,"body":"they're like, \"Oh, we didn't"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1357.561,"endTime":1360.7,"body":"know that you had movies with"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1357.561,"endTime":1360.7,"body":"this good CGI back in the olden"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1360.7,"endTime":1364.392,"body":"days.\" I was like, \"It's not"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1360.7,"endTime":1364.392,"body":"even that old!\" [Chuckles]"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1365.696,"endTime":1366.176,"body":"[Chuckles] Kids."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1368.314,"endTime":1370.594,"body":"Yeah, well, okay. And so,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1368.314,"endTime":1370.594,"body":"I think that making those"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1370.594,"endTime":1374.0,"body":"connections is so important and"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1370.594,"endTime":1374.0,"body":"then like asking- asking"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1374.0,"endTime":1374.492,"body":"informed"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1374.493,"endTime":1378.663,"body":"questions too, right? Because"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1374.493,"endTime":1378.663,"body":"when you're DM-ing someone or"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1378.693,"endTime":1384.0,"body":"emailing someone, you- you let"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1378.693,"endTime":1384.0,"body":"them know what you've been"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1384.0,"endTime":1384.814,"body":"working on"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1384.814,"endTime":1387.5,"body":"or how you've been approaching"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1384.814,"endTime":1387.5,"body":"that thing. Or, you know, I --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1387.5,"endTime":1391.3,"body":"one of the things that I like"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1387.5,"endTime":1391.3,"body":"about our Virtual Coffee"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1391.3,"endTime":1396.0,"body":"repository is we have issue"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1391.3,"endTime":1396.0,"body":"templates, we have PR templates,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1396.0,"endTime":1398.7,"body":"or ... is that what they're"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1396.0,"endTime":1398.7,"body":"called? Templates? Forms?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1398.7,"endTime":1399.3,"body":"Tem-"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1399.3,"endTime":1400.159,"body":"Issue forms?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1400.673,"endTime":1401.003,"body":"-plates? [Laughs]"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1402.878,"endTime":1405.3,"body":"Oh. Templates? Am- am I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1402.878,"endTime":1405.3,"body":"saying it wrong? Well, I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1405.3,"endTime":1406.7,"body":"dunno. I wasn't asking the-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1406.7,"endTime":1407.7,"body":"I don't get that -- I don't"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1406.7,"endTime":1407.7,"body":"think-"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1406.8,"endTime":1408.7,"body":"-correct choice to say"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1406.8,"endTime":1408.7,"body":"it. I was just been wondering-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1408.0,"endTime":1409.0,"body":"-I don't think that's a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1408.0,"endTime":1409.0,"body":"wrong-"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1409.148,"endTime":1410.739,"body":"-if they are called"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1409.148,"endTime":1410.739,"body":"templates."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1410.963,"endTime":1414.0,"body":"-right/wrong situation. But"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1410.963,"endTime":1414.0,"body":"... I think that's more of a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1414.0,"endTime":1415.324,"body":"local dialect situation"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1414.0,"endTime":1415.324,"body":"[laughs]."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1416.499,"endTime":1423.098,"body":"It's not what I was"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1416.499,"endTime":1423.098,"body":"asking [laughs]. Forms issue?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1424.203,"endTime":1426.7,"body":"Issue form. Yeah, forms."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1424.203,"endTime":1426.7,"body":"Issue forms. That's what they're"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1426.7,"endTime":1431.673,"body":"called [inaudible]. Well, I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1426.7,"endTime":1431.673,"body":"dunno. They started as"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1431.673,"endTime":1433.594,"body":"templates and the other, forms."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1431.673,"endTime":1433.594,"body":"That's it. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1433.713,"endTime":1435.544,"body":"[Laughs] Well, one of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1433.713,"endTime":1435.544,"body":"them is a form, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1435.903,"endTime":1437.763,"body":"Right. Right. No, that's --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1435.903,"endTime":1437.763,"body":"I mean, that, the issue ones."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1437.763,"endTime":1439.7,"body":"Yeah. They use- they used to be"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1437.763,"endTime":1439.7,"body":"-- we used to have issue"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1439.7,"endTime":1442.173,"body":"templates, and now we converted"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1439.7,"endTime":1442.173,"body":"them to the issue forms."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1442.398,"endTime":1443.898,"body":"And now he just has an"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1442.398,"endTime":1443.898,"body":"issues everywhere."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1444.124,"endTime":1446.854,"body":"Now there's just --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1444.124,"endTime":1446.854,"body":"[laughs] I mean, lots of issues."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1448.433,"endTime":1452.543,"body":"But it breaks -- it kind"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1448.433,"endTime":1452.543,"body":"of, like, breaks down how to ask"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1452.544,"endTime":1455.723,"body":"questions. And because we work"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1452.544,"endTime":1455.723,"body":"with so many developers at all"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1455.723,"endTime":1459.3,"body":"stages of the journey, it- it's"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1455.723,"endTime":1459.3,"body":"nice to kind of create a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1459.3,"endTime":1460.193,"body":"methodical"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1460.193,"endTime":1465.953,"body":"process for question asking, or"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1460.193,"endTime":1465.953,"body":"helping people to go through"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1465.953,"endTime":1469.3,"body":"this process of, \"This is what I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1465.953,"endTime":1469.3,"body":"see. This is what I've done."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1469.3,"endTime":1472.3,"body":"This is what I want to see"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1469.3,"endTime":1472.3,"body":"done,\" you know? And providing"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1472.3,"endTime":1473.137,"body":"some evidence"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1473.138,"endTime":1481.0,"body":"for that. Because sometimes, you"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1473.138,"endTime":1481.0,"body":"have a random question, and ..."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1481.0,"endTime":1485.0,"body":"it feels exhausting or"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1481.0,"endTime":1485.0,"body":"overwhelming to try and answer"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1485.0,"endTime":1486.5,"body":"a question if there's no context"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1486.5,"endTime":1489.729,"body":"there, right? If you already"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1486.5,"endTime":1489.729,"body":"have a full slate of work"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1489.729,"endTime":1495.5,"body":"on your desk and somebody asks"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1489.729,"endTime":1495.5,"body":"you, \"Hey, have you ...\" I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1495.5,"endTime":1498.0,"body":"don't- don't know. I can't think"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1495.5,"endTime":1498.0,"body":"of a good example right now. But"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1498.0,"endTime":1505.0,"body":"like, \"Did I use this thing"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1498.0,"endTime":1505.0,"body":"right?\" \"Okay. Well, walk me"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1505.0,"endTime":1505.528,"body":"through your"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1505.528,"endTime":1507.598,"body":"code,\" right? And I think that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1505.528,"endTime":1507.598,"body":"that's one of those things that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1507.853,"endTime":1510.5,"body":"kind of -- it's a skill that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1507.853,"endTime":1510.5,"body":"takes time to develop that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1510.5,"endTime":1510.929,"body":"question"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1510.929,"endTime":1514.0,"body":"asking ability. And a-another"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1510.929,"endTime":1514.0,"body":"reason why I love the- the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1514.0,"endTime":1518.0,"body":"coworking room too, because you"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1514.0,"endTime":1518.0,"body":"have the time to have those"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1518.0,"endTime":1518.519,"body":"conversations."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1518.519,"endTime":1520.769,"body":"And Roger, I know that you've"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1518.519,"endTime":1520.769,"body":"spent some time in the coworking"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1520.769,"endTime":1521.608,"body":"room as well."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1523.939,"endTime":1526.5,"body":"Yeah. It's -- I- I always"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1523.939,"endTime":1526.5,"body":"love just kind of hanging out in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1526.5,"endTime":1529.3,"body":"there cuz you never know what"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1526.5,"endTime":1529.3,"body":"kind of conversations are going"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1529.3,"endTime":1529.999,"body":"to have."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1529.999,"endTime":1533.3,"body":"And it definitely feels like"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1529.999,"endTime":1533.3,"body":"you're at work, and these are"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1533.3,"endTime":1533.643,"body":"your"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1533.644,"endTime":1537.544,"body":"coworkers. Because, you know,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1533.644,"endTime":1537.544,"body":"there's- there's a sense of- of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1537.903,"endTime":1540.574,"body":"community to it. But at the same"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1537.903,"endTime":1540.574,"body":"time, you know, like, the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1540.574,"endTime":1543.3,"body":"conversations aren't going to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1540.574,"endTime":1543.3,"body":"take a- a weird turn. They're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1543.3,"endTime":1546.723,"body":"gonna typically stay around a- a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1543.3,"endTime":1546.723,"body":"centralized set of topics. And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1547.413,"endTime":1550.0,"body":"it- it's comforting to be able"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1547.413,"endTime":1550.0,"body":"-- to be just around other"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1550.0,"endTime":1551.253,"body":"people who are"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1551.253,"endTime":1554.733,"body":"programmers, and nerds, and just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1551.253,"endTime":1554.733,"body":"generally interested in pretty"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1554.733,"endTime":1557.344,"body":"much the same thing as you are."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1554.733,"endTime":1557.344,"body":"And just being like, \"Hey, I'm"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1557.344,"endTime":1560.0,"body":"working on this, like, weird"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1557.344,"endTime":1560.0,"body":"code. Like, is there anybody"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1560.0,"endTime":1561.7,"body":"that wants to jump in and, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1561.7,"endTime":1564.259,"body":"give me some advice on what I'm"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1561.7,"endTime":1564.259,"body":"doing wrong or"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1564.259,"endTime":1567.828,"body":"how I can make it better?\" And,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1564.259,"endTime":1567.828,"body":"you know, it's kind of exciting"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1567.828,"endTime":1570.7,"body":"just to see the problem solving"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1567.828,"endTime":1570.7,"body":"that other people go through."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1570.7,"endTime":1574.999,"body":"And sometimes, it's just the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1570.7,"endTime":1574.999,"body":"patients that some people have"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1574.999,"endTime":1578.0,"body":"mentoring people. It- it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1574.999,"endTime":1578.0,"body":"really amazing and- and kind of,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1578.0,"endTime":1579.679,"body":"you know, a l- a lead by"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1579.679,"endTime":1582.528,"body":"example in some places where you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1579.679,"endTime":1582.528,"body":"see these things happen and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1582.528,"endTime":1585.199,"body":"you're just like, \"Wow! I wanna-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1582.528,"endTime":1585.199,"body":"I wanna improve how I instruct"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1585.199,"endTime":1588.828,"body":"people based off of, like, what"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1585.199,"endTime":1588.828,"body":"I just kinda saw.\" And it's just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1589.443,"endTime":1592.3,"body":"kind of a cool place just to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1589.443,"endTime":1592.3,"body":"meet people from kind of all"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1592.3,"endTime":1592.923,"body":"around"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1592.923,"endTime":1597.0,"body":"the world who just are hanging"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1592.923,"endTime":1597.0,"body":"out, just wanting to -- just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1597.423,"endTime":1597.423,"body":"chill"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1597.423,"endTime":1600.423,"body":"for a few minutes, and just talk"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1597.423,"endTime":1600.423,"body":"about whatever- whatever you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1600.423,"endTime":1603.0,"body":"talking about, jumping into the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1600.423,"endTime":1603.0,"body":"conversation, and jump out."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1603.0,"endTime":1608.0,"body":"It's- it's really, like, been a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1603.0,"endTime":1608.0,"body":"great sense of community since,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1608.0,"endTime":1608.433,"body":"you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1608.433,"endTime":1611.104,"body":"know, honestly, I found Virtual"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1608.433,"endTime":1611.104,"body":"Coffee when the pandemic kind of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1611.104,"endTime":1614.013,"body":"was going on and, like, I dived"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1611.104,"endTime":1614.013,"body":"into there and I became kind of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1615.364,"endTime":1617.0,"body":"... a lot of the close"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1615.364,"endTime":1617.0,"body":"friendships that I had. Because"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1617.0,"endTime":1621.0,"body":"it was just always open and you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1617.0,"endTime":1621.0,"body":"meet a lot of really cool,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1621.0,"endTime":1622.053,"body":"interesting people."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1622.054,"endTime":1626.074,"body":"And actually, my current- my"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1622.054,"endTime":1626.074,"body":"current job, I was actually"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1626.104,"endTime":1629.884,"body":"interviewed, originally, in the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1626.104,"endTime":1629.884,"body":"coworking room, which led me"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1629.884,"endTime":1632.554,"body":"to being interviewed by the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1629.884,"endTime":1632.554,"body":"company and accepting the role"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1632.554,"endTime":1635.0,"body":"with their -- so, I always think"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1632.554,"endTime":1635.0,"body":"that's a- that's a fun little"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1635.0,"endTime":1638.044,"body":"story with the Virtual Coffee,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1635.0,"endTime":1638.044,"body":"because, you know, there's so"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1638.044,"endTime":1642.1,"body":"many of these people that joined"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1638.044,"endTime":1642.1,"body":"looking for a job and -- or"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1642.1,"endTime":1643.7,"body":"hoping to find something."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1643.7,"endTime":1646.5,"body":"But sometimes, you end up"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1643.7,"endTime":1646.5,"body":"finding something in the same"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1646.5,"endTime":1648.483,"body":"room that you're just hanging"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1646.5,"endTime":1648.483,"body":"out with. And then for fun,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1648.483,"endTime":1651.183,"body":"sharing just some project that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1648.483,"endTime":1651.183,"body":"you had an idea about or"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1651.183,"endTime":1652.203,"body":"passionate about. So --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1654.118,"endTime":1659.0,"body":"I love that. That's such"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1654.118,"endTime":1659.0,"body":"a fun story. Okay. So, you -- I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1659.0,"endTime":1663.263,"body":"-- we're talking about problem"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1659.0,"endTime":1663.263,"body":"solving and- and ..."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1663.263,"endTime":1666.3,"body":"navigating through -- like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1663.263,"endTime":1666.3,"body":"enjoying that part -- that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1666.3,"endTime":1672.0,"body":"aspect of coding. So, what is"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1666.3,"endTime":1672.0,"body":"the ... maybe strangest or most"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1672.0,"endTime":1674.888,"body":"complicated problem you've had"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1672.0,"endTime":1674.888,"body":"navigate?"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1676.098,"endTime":1680.239,"body":"So, I think this goes"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1676.098,"endTime":1680.239,"body":"back to the days when I was"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1680.239,"endTime":1684.318,"body":"working in a support role at a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1680.239,"endTime":1684.318,"body":"managed service provider, which"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1684.318,"endTime":1687.378,"body":"means, we ran their whole help"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1684.318,"endTime":1687.378,"body":"desk. And this is one of my"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1687.378,"endTime":1690.919,"body":"favorite stories to tell because"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1687.378,"endTime":1690.919,"body":"it's just so weird. So, the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1690.919,"endTime":1697.7,"body":"customer I was supporting is a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1690.919,"endTime":1697.7,"body":"company that does -- that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1698.009,"endTime":1698.009,"body":"paints"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1698.009,"endTime":1701.128,"body":"boats. When I'm talking about"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1698.009,"endTime":1701.128,"body":"boats, I'm talking about big"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1701.159,"endTime":1705.298,"body":"ships that are, you know, the-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1701.159,"endTime":1705.298,"body":"the- the ships that they have at"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1705.298,"endTime":1709.648,"body":"Disneyland type size. And they"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1705.298,"endTime":1709.648,"body":"have an oven that is the size of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1709.648,"endTime":1712.943,"body":"a literal warehouse, where they"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1709.648,"endTime":1712.943,"body":"put these boats and to have the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1712.943,"endTime":1716.273,"body":"paint cure. And all of this data"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1712.943,"endTime":1716.273,"body":"from all of these temperature"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1716.273,"endTime":1719.574,"body":"sensors from all around that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1716.273,"endTime":1719.574,"body":"warehouse get fed into one"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1719.574,"endTime":1724.163,"body":"computer. And what happened is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1719.574,"endTime":1724.163,"body":"that aging desktop, which was"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1724.163,"endTime":1727.884,"body":"running ... probably Windows 98"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1724.163,"endTime":1727.884,"body":"or something similar, and some"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1727.884,"endTime":1733.534,"body":"version of Excel, it died. And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1727.884,"endTime":1733.534,"body":"suddenly, their whole business"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1733.804,"endTime":1737.0,"body":"wasn't able to operate because"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1733.804,"endTime":1737.0,"body":"the computer that ran the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1737.0,"endTime":1737.402,"body":"sensors"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1737.403,"endTime":1740.523,"body":"that gave them the data to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1737.403,"endTime":1740.523,"body":"certify all of their work wasn't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1740.523,"endTime":1744.663,"body":"working. And I remember trying"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1740.523,"endTime":1744.663,"body":"everything that I could to build"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1744.663,"endTime":1748.054,"body":"a virtual machine that had that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1744.663,"endTime":1748.054,"body":"operating system to run this"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1748.054,"endTime":1752.0,"body":"thing and just constant"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1748.054,"endTime":1752.0,"body":"problems. And eventually, I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1752.0,"endTime":1752.884,"body":"solved that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1753.183,"endTime":1756.5,"body":"problem by getting it stood up"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1753.183,"endTime":1756.5,"body":"with a new version of Windows"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1756.5,"endTime":1756.993,"body":"and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1757.173,"endTime":1761.584,"body":"everything working inside it."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1757.173,"endTime":1761.584,"body":"And- and a version of Excel that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1761.644,"endTime":1764.973,"body":"I found on an abandoned ware"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1761.644,"endTime":1764.973,"body":"website that was like a release"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1764.973,"endTime":1768.394,"body":"candidate that they didn't put"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1764.973,"endTime":1768.394,"body":"any product activations in. And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1768.394,"endTime":1771.003,"body":"it was the least to the current"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1768.394,"endTime":1771.003,"body":"version of Excel that I could"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1771.003,"endTime":1774.3,"body":"find to run the macro that this"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1771.003,"endTime":1774.3,"body":"business relied on to capture"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1774.3,"endTime":1775.084,"body":"this data"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1775.084,"endTime":1779.403,"body":"from the sensor. It was- it was"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1775.084,"endTime":1779.403,"body":"a lot! We had adapters with the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1779.403,"endTime":1781.5,"body":"serial cables pulling in this"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1779.403,"endTime":1781.5,"body":"data into a macro and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1781.5,"endTime":1782.733,"body":"an excited [??] Excel."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1783.213,"endTime":1787.114,"body":"And eventually, this all got"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1783.213,"endTime":1787.114,"body":"ran- ran into a Windows 10 box,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1787.203,"endTime":1791.374,"body":"eventually, and virtualized, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1787.203,"endTime":1791.374,"body":"ran indefinitely, but it was"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1791.374,"endTime":1795.0,"body":"just the- the amount of sheer"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1791.374,"endTime":1795.0,"body":"... what is going on and how are"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1795.0,"endTime":1797.0,"body":"we gonna fix this, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1797.0,"endTime":1801.608,"body":"to get over the finish line? It"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1797.0,"endTime":1801.608,"body":"was just astronomical. And like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1801.729,"endTime":1804.5,"body":"I look back and I think to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1801.729,"endTime":1804.5,"body":"myself, like, \"You know, if I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1804.5,"endTime":1807.5,"body":"could fix a boat of him, none of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1804.5,"endTime":1807.5,"body":"these other problems"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1807.5,"endTime":1808.568,"body":"seem that hard. A little"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1808.568,"endTime":1811.0,"body":"figure it out.\" Like, it's the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1808.568,"endTime":1811.0,"body":"same thing about being in a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1811.0,"endTime":1816.0,"body":"network closet. Like, that's --"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1811.0,"endTime":1816.0,"body":"that -- you just remember, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1816.0,"endTime":1817.483,"body":"all of these problems have"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1816.0,"endTime":1817.483,"body":"solutions. You're gonna"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1817.483,"endTime":1821.173,"body":"get there eventually. It's just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1817.483,"endTime":1821.173,"body":"a matter of [chuckles]"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1821.173,"endTime":1823.693,"body":"what ridiculous thing you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1821.173,"endTime":1823.693,"body":"gonna need to get it across"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1823.693,"endTime":1827.233,"body":"the finish line in the moment."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1823.693,"endTime":1827.233,"body":"And I- I feel like, when"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1827.233,"endTime":1831.0,"body":"programming, it's a lot of ..."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1827.233,"endTime":1831.0,"body":"more -- a lot more critical"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1831.0,"endTime":1831.769,"body":"thinking, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1831.769,"endTime":1834.679,"body":"sometimes, you just need more"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1831.769,"endTime":1834.679,"body":"information. And just like, if"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1835.429,"endTime":1837.409,"body":"you dealing with the problem"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1835.429,"endTime":1837.409,"body":"with databases you can't really"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1837.409,"endTime":1840.919,"body":"figure out what the heck you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1837.409,"endTime":1840.919,"body":"doing, stop and, like, go look"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1840.919,"endTime":1844.0,"body":"at some completed databases. And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1840.919,"endTime":1844.0,"body":"then, you're like, \"Oh, that's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1844.0,"endTime":1847.0,"body":"what I was do it. Gronk [??].\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1844.0,"endTime":1847.0,"body":"And suddenly, things click into"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1847.0,"endTime":1849.077,"body":"place. And, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1849.078,"endTime":1852.858,"body":"just remember so many times as a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1849.078,"endTime":1852.858,"body":"technician where there wasn't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1852.858,"endTime":1857.388,"body":"documentation or somebody to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1852.858,"endTime":1857.388,"body":"ask. It was figure it out to the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1857.689,"endTime":1859.7,"body":"best that you can. Because"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1857.689,"endTime":1859.7,"body":"they're -- the vendor that built"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1859.7,"endTime":1864.0,"body":"this system went out of business"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1859.7,"endTime":1864.0,"body":"before you were born. And ..."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1864.0,"endTime":1864.963,"body":"[Dan chuckles] and that's-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1864.963,"endTime":1867.7,"body":"and that's a fun- that's a fun"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1864.963,"endTime":1867.7,"body":"place to exist. But the thing"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1867.7,"endTime":1870.544,"body":"that I've learned the most about"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1867.7,"endTime":1870.544,"body":"programming, and programming"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1870.544,"endTime":1874.5,"body":"languages specifically, is once"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1870.544,"endTime":1874.5,"body":"you learn the basics, they all"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1874.5,"endTime":1878.5,"body":"start to kind of merge together."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1874.5,"endTime":1878.5,"body":"And if you know how an if loop"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1878.5,"endTime":1878.943,"body":"and a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1878.943,"endTime":1882.723,"body":"while loop works well, you can"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1878.943,"endTime":1882.723,"body":"pretty much program like 90% of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1882.723,"endTime":1886.338,"body":"the crap you need to get the job"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1882.723,"endTime":1886.338,"body":"done. A-and that's really what"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1886.338,"endTime":1889.5,"body":"it takes. Like, a few- a few if"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1886.338,"endTime":1889.5,"body":"statements, and you've got most"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1889.5,"endTime":1889.788,"body":"of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1889.788,"endTime":1892.909,"body":"the programs that are running"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1889.788,"endTime":1892.909,"body":"some of the largest systems are"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1893.028,"endTime":1897.5,"body":"just simple things. And when you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1893.028,"endTime":1897.5,"body":"can look at a coding language"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1897.5,"endTime":1900.7,"body":"that's written in something that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1897.5,"endTime":1900.7,"body":"some random developer came up"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1900.7,"endTime":1901.909,"body":"with and you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1901.909,"endTime":1904.7,"body":"just able to read thoroughly and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1901.909,"endTime":1904.7,"body":"understand it because -- not"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1904.7,"endTime":1907.5,"body":"because you understand the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1904.7,"endTime":1907.5,"body":"programming language, but"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1907.5,"endTime":1908.769,"body":"because you understand that a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1908.769,"endTime":1911.378,"body":"loop's going to keep going back"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1908.769,"endTime":1911.378,"body":"through these things, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1911.378,"endTime":1913.758,"body":"eventually it's gonna do this,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1911.378,"endTime":1913.758,"body":"so now I'm looking for"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1913.758,"endTime":1917.0,"body":"this problem, you can pretty"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1913.758,"endTime":1917.0,"body":"much go down any rabbit hole and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1917.0,"endTime":1920.0,"body":"find what you're looking for."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1917.0,"endTime":1920.0,"body":"Just as long as you're just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1920.0,"endTime":1922.0,"body":"willing to keep ... looking."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1923.5,"endTime":1925.0,"body":"It's the same thing with the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1923.5,"endTime":1925.0,"body":"boat [unintelligible]. I just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1925.0,"endTime":1927.3,"body":"kept looking and then I found --"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1925.0,"endTime":1927.3,"body":"eventually found a way to fix"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1927.3,"endTime":1927.638,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1928.729,"endTime":1931.5,"body":"Yeah. I love that. And I-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1928.729,"endTime":1931.5,"body":"and I think that -- and I feel"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1931.5,"endTime":1933.618,"body":"like I've said this, probably,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1931.5,"endTime":1933.618,"body":"before. But that's, like, one of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1933.618,"endTime":1936.7,"body":"the biggest things that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1933.618,"endTime":1936.7,"body":"separates somebody that has more"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1936.7,"endTime":1937.338,"body":"experience"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1937.338,"endTime":1941.419,"body":"from somebody who is more"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1937.338,"endTime":1941.419,"body":"starting out is not necessarily"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1941.419,"endTime":1948.0,"body":"the knowledge accrued, but more"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1941.419,"endTime":1948.0,"body":"the sort of confidence that you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1948.0,"endTime":1950.5,"body":"can do the thing. You -- like --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1948.0,"endTime":1950.5,"body":"that- that, like, you can"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1950.5,"endTime":1953.7,"body":"probably solve pretty much"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1950.5,"endTime":1953.7,"body":"anything given, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1953.7,"endTime":1956.5,"body":"enough time, I suppose. But"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1953.7,"endTime":1956.5,"body":"like, you know, like- like you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1956.5,"endTime":1959.898,"body":"said, like that -- if you- if"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1956.5,"endTime":1959.898,"body":"you have less experience, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1959.898,"endTime":1963.409,"body":"just have less plack- practice"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1959.898,"endTime":1963.409,"body":"reading code and being used"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1963.409,"endTime":1968.0,"body":"to loops, and- and if"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1963.409,"endTime":1968.0,"body":"statements, and stuff. Then"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1968.0,"endTime":1969.209,"body":"jumping -- trying to read"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1969.209,"endTime":1971.278,"body":"some other code in a different"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1969.209,"endTime":1971.278,"body":"language that you're not used to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1971.278,"endTime":1974.098,"body":"is gonna seem ... probably a lot"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1971.278,"endTime":1974.098,"body":"more daunting, you know? But"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1974.128,"endTime":1977.729,"body":"having done it for a long time,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1974.128,"endTime":1977.729,"body":"it's -- i-is a sec- that- that's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1977.729,"endTime":1980.0,"body":"a practice, you know? The"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1977.729,"endTime":1980.0,"body":"practice of just, like ..."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1980.0,"endTime":1982.5,"body":"[chuckles] yeah, I mean, it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1980.0,"endTime":1982.5,"body":"just like you said, you know?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1982.5,"endTime":1984.179,"body":"Like, I have solved this huge"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1982.5,"endTime":1984.179,"body":"bug in the -- in- in- in the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1984.689,"endTime":1987.0,"body":"past. So I just kind of know"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1984.689,"endTime":1987.0,"body":"that any other bug that comes"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1987.0,"endTime":1989.459,"body":"up, I'm gonna be fine, [laughs]"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1987.0,"endTime":1989.459,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1991.808,"endTime":1994.3,"body":"Or, on the- on the other"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1991.808,"endTime":1994.3,"body":"side of it is, like, \"I know"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1994.3,"endTime":1996.0,"body":"I've taken down production"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1994.3,"endTime":1996.0,"body":"once.\""},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1996.0,"endTime":1996.5,"body":"[Chuckles] Oh, god."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1996.5,"endTime":1998.679,"body":"\"So if I do it again, I-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1996.5,"endTime":1998.679,"body":"I know what to expect.\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1998.679,"endTime":2003.959,"body":"It's sort of like, \"I've been"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":1998.679,"endTime":2003.959,"body":"chewed out. Let's just get"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2003.959,"endTime":2004.739,"body":"chewed out again.\" [Dan laughs]"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2006.798,"endTime":2007.0,"body":"It's all-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2007.0,"endTime":2007.3,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2007.1,"endTime":2009.959,"body":"-feel like terrifying"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2007.1,"endTime":2009.959,"body":"experience to me [laughs]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2009.959,"endTime":2011.548,"body":"Have- have you done it live"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2009.959,"endTime":2011.548,"body":"on a Twitch stream though?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2011.548,"endTime":2013.854,"body":"[Laughs]"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2013.854,"endTime":2015.653,"body":"There's still time."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2013.854,"endTime":2015.653,"body":"There's still time."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2017.148,"endTime":2018.108,"body":"[Laughs] No. No, thank"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2017.148,"endTime":2018.108,"body":"you."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2018.503,"endTime":2022.644,"body":"Yeah. That was ... not my"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2018.503,"endTime":2022.644,"body":"best moment. But I got"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2022.644,"endTime":2023.153,"body":"through it, right? [Laughs]"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2024.179,"endTime":2028.0,"body":"You- you did. You -- I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2024.179,"endTime":2028.0,"body":"think I would just ... I ..."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2028.0,"endTime":2030.0,"body":"want to crawl under the bed and-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2030.0,"endTime":2031.0,"body":"Yeah. Mm."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2030.2,"endTime":2030.628,"body":"-stay there."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2031.699,"endTime":2034.788,"body":"I- I think this is a good"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2031.699,"endTime":2034.788,"body":"point to mention how important"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2034.788,"endTime":2039.138,"body":"backups and version control are."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2034.788,"endTime":2039.138,"body":"And don't be afraid to commit"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2039.138,"endTime":2042.528,"body":"that code, even if you're not"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2039.138,"endTime":2042.528,"body":"quite ready for it. Just having"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2042.528,"endTime":2044.5,"body":"like something in there that you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2042.528,"endTime":2044.5,"body":"can go back and look at and be"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2044.5,"endTime":2047.148,"body":"like, \"That's what I did four"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2044.5,"endTime":2047.148,"body":"and half hours ago.\""},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2047.578,"endTime":2048.028,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2048.829,"endTime":2049.369,"body":"It's still helpful. It's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2048.829,"endTime":2049.369,"body":"so helpful."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2050.268,"endTime":2050.838,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2051.474,"endTime":2053.0,"body":"Yeah. Even like that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2051.474,"endTime":2053.0,"body":"project that I was just talking"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2053.0,"endTime":2053.934,"body":"about, I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2053.934,"endTime":2058.704,"body":"was talking through it with Kirk"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2053.934,"endTime":2058.704,"body":"one day. He's like, \"Well, you"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2058.704,"endTime":2062.0,"body":"know, have you committed"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2058.704,"endTime":2062.0,"body":"recently?\" And I was like, \"I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2062.0,"endTime":2063.159,"body":"don- I don't have any commits"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2062.0,"endTime":2063.159,"body":"[laughs].\""},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2065.0,"endTime":2067.688,"body":"But just like, you know, I -- it"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2065.0,"endTime":2067.688,"body":"wasn't going to be a big"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2067.688,"endTime":2071.139,"body":"project. I thought that I could"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2067.688,"endTime":2071.139,"body":"do it really quickly and get it"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2071.139,"endTime":2072.849,"body":"done. And then, it was like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2071.139,"endTime":2072.849,"body":"\"Ooh.\""},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2073.798,"endTime":2074.068,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2074.068,"endTime":2076.0,"body":"\"This was a mistake.\""},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2074.068,"endTime":2076.0,"body":"Yeah. That would have been that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2076.0,"endTime":2078.099,"body":"-- for sure, would have been"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2076.0,"endTime":2078.099,"body":"useful."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2078.509,"endTime":2081.509,"body":"Yeah, no. That's very good"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2078.509,"endTime":2081.509,"body":"advice too. I-it's, like, at the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2081.509,"endTime":2082.739,"body":"times that I've done it, it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2081.509,"endTime":2082.739,"body":"been- it's been super helpful."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2083.969,"endTime":2086.099,"body":"And it helps with that -- and it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2083.969,"endTime":2086.099,"body":"gives you more confidence with"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2086.099,"endTime":2089.179,"body":"that -- the approach of just"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2086.099,"endTime":2089.179,"body":"kind of trying stuff out, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2089.289,"endTime":2093.0,"body":"Throwing stuff at the problem."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2089.289,"endTime":2093.0,"body":"Because, you know, that -- it --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2093.0,"endTime":2093.414,"body":"I mean,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2093.414,"endTime":2096.083,"body":"it's easy- it's easy to go back,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2093.414,"endTime":2096.083,"body":"right? It's easy to throw things"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2096.083,"endTime":2098.873,"body":"out, it's easy to go and look at"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2096.083,"endTime":2098.873,"body":"your history. And you can"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2098.873,"endTime":2100.0,"body":"always, like, if you're"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2098.873,"endTime":2100.0,"body":"embarassed by that [chuckles],"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2100.0,"endTime":2104.0,"body":"the commits or the commi- like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2100.0,"endTime":2104.0,"body":"you know, it's just kind of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2104.0,"endTime":2107.0,"body":"squashed them, right, into --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2104.0,"endTime":2107.0,"body":"like, once you finally solve it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2107.0,"endTime":2110.3,"body":"into one commit, you know? But"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2107.0,"endTime":2110.3,"body":"I- I mean, I'll have commits"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2110.3,"endTime":2112.5,"body":"that are just like, \"Well, let's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2110.3,"endTime":2112.5,"body":"try this, try this, try this."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2112.5,"endTime":2113.303,"body":"That didn't work. Try this,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2113.304,"endTime":2115.0,"body":"try this,\" you know? [Chuckles]"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2113.304,"endTime":2115.0,"body":"And that's, like, that's not"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2115.0,"endTime":2115.643,"body":"what you wanna"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2115.643,"endTime":2119.963,"body":"push up ... ultimately. But it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2115.643,"endTime":2119.963,"body":"perfectly fine when you're in"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2119.963,"endTime":2122.5,"body":"your -- when you're like, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2119.963,"endTime":2122.5,"body":"know, trying to work your way"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2122.5,"endTime":2123.083,"body":"through-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2123.143,"endTime":2126.623,"body":"through a problem. At least- at"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2123.143,"endTime":2126.623,"body":"least I think it is. I don't"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2126.623,"endTime":2128.963,"body":"know [chuckles]. Other people"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2126.623,"endTime":2128.963,"body":"might disagree with me. But --"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2129.764,"endTime":2132.764,"body":"I am definitely afraid to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2129.764,"endTime":2132.764,"body":"commit until, like, the code is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2133.063,"endTime":2135.5,"body":"per- perfect, just because I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2133.063,"endTime":2135.5,"body":"feel like so many people are"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2135.5,"endTime":2135.943,"body":"gonna be"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2135.943,"endTime":2139.304,"body":"judging me based off of what"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2135.943,"endTime":2139.304,"body":"they're saying. But at the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2139.304,"endTime":2142.5,"body":"same time, that causes me to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2139.304,"endTime":2142.5,"body":"forget to commit my changes."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2142.5,"endTime":2147.0,"body":"And I have a habit of doing that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2142.5,"endTime":2147.0,"body":"frequently, which the best part"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2147.0,"endTime":2151.5,"body":"about being a developer is you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2147.0,"endTime":2151.5,"body":"can always automate solutions to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2151.5,"endTime":2156.7,"body":"your problems. One of mine has"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2151.5,"endTime":2156.7,"body":"been every 15 minutes, take a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2156.7,"endTime":2159.648,"body":"git commit, and just go ahead,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2156.7,"endTime":2159.648,"body":"and just save that with the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2159.648,"endTime":2164.5,"body":"timestamp. And I've written that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2159.648,"endTime":2164.5,"body":"as a bash script, because that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2164.5,"endTime":2164.918,"body":"was the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2164.918,"endTime":2168.639,"body":"easiest, lowest hanging fruit"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2164.918,"endTime":2168.639,"body":"that I could do. And it works"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2168.668,"endTime":2173.079,"body":"marvelously. And I've used that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2168.668,"endTime":2173.079,"body":"for a number of other projects"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2173.079,"endTime":2177.3,"body":"where I wrote a whole- a whole"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2173.079,"endTime":2177.3,"body":"set of scripts that took and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2177.3,"endTime":2181.3,"body":"used them as a note-taking"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2177.3,"endTime":2181.3,"body":"application with an auto-save"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2181.3,"endTime":2186.009,"body":"and sync functionality powered"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2181.3,"endTime":2186.009,"body":"by git and bash that just was a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2186.009,"endTime":2188.5,"body":"few hours of just starting"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2186.009,"endTime":2188.5,"body":"things together because I was"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2188.5,"endTime":2189.813,"body":"annoyed that I forgot to save"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2189.813,"endTime":2192.123,"body":"something important into the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2189.813,"endTime":2192.123,"body":"thing that I was using as a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2192.123,"endTime":2196.0,"body":"notepad. So I'm like, \"I'm never"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2192.123,"endTime":2196.0,"body":"gonna do this again!\" And it,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2196.0,"endTime":2197.703,"body":"you know, you solve a problem,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2196.0,"endTime":2197.703,"body":"and you just use the tools that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2197.703,"endTime":2201.0,"body":"were available, and ... yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2201.5,"endTime":2202.0,"body":"I love that."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2201.824,"endTime":2205.123,"body":"Do you have a blog post"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2201.824,"endTime":2205.123,"body":"or a tutorial on the things that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2205.123,"endTime":2206.954,"body":"you've done? Cuz that would be"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2205.123,"endTime":2206.954,"body":"super [unintelligible]."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2207.329,"endTime":2210.0,"body":"I definitely should write"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2207.329,"endTime":2210.0,"body":"this one up because I think I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2210.0,"endTime":2210.207,"body":"had"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2210.208,"endTime":2213.748,"body":"intended to, but then I, again,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2210.208,"endTime":2213.748,"body":"got distracted and forgot to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2213.748,"endTime":2217.648,"body":"complete it, which I- I- I could"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2213.748,"endTime":2217.648,"body":"say that a lot about a lot of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2217.648,"endTime":2219.7,"body":"the domains that I purchased."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2217.648,"endTime":2219.7,"body":"It's about being like, \"Hey,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2219.7,"endTime":2220.558,"body":"this is an idea.\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2220.588,"endTime":2224.0,"body":"\"Ooh, the domain's available.\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2220.588,"endTime":2224.0,"body":"\"Oh, I should build this.\" And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2224.0,"endTime":2225.838,"body":"then, I get the renewal notice a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2224.0,"endTime":2225.838,"body":"year later."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2228.498,"endTime":2229.0,"body":"You have-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2229.0,"endTime":2229.7,"body":"[Chuckles] That's alright."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2229.3,"endTime":2232.009,"body":"-a domain with an emoji"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2229.3,"endTime":2232.009,"body":"in it, right?"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2233.114,"endTime":2237.0,"body":"So, I am actually the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2233.114,"endTime":2237.0,"body":"proud owner of the email"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2237.0,"endTime":2238.784,"body":"emoji.fm. And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2238.784,"endTime":2243.463,"body":"I have been trying to figure out"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2238.784,"endTime":2243.463,"body":"the best way to create an emoji"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2243.463,"endTime":2247.603,"body":"base, social networking, email"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2243.463,"endTime":2247.603,"body":"platform around that. That is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2247.603,"endTime":2253.079,"body":"just purely nothing but emojis."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2247.603,"endTime":2253.079,"body":"But amazingly enough, it is a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2253.168,"endTime":2256.048,"body":"surprisingly difficult to get"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2253.168,"endTime":2256.048,"body":"emails delivered that contain"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2256.048,"endTime":2260.099,"body":"emojis. So, I have been trying"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2256.048,"endTime":2260.099,"body":"to overcome a lot of fun"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2260.128,"endTime":2265.108,"body":"technical problems getting that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2260.128,"endTime":2265.108,"body":"service spun up. But ... yeah."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2265.409,"endTime":2269.0,"body":"That's- that's a lot of [laughs]"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2265.409,"endTime":2269.0,"body":"entertainment in itself. It is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2269.0,"endTime":2273.0,"body":"just, \"Hey, go check out this"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2269.0,"endTime":2273.0,"body":"emoji email and -- or domain.\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2273.0,"endTime":2274.7,"body":"And you're just like, \"I didn't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2273.0,"endTime":2274.7,"body":"even know emojis could be"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2274.7,"endTime":2280.0,"body":"domains.\" And ... it- it causes"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2274.7,"endTime":2280.0,"body":"a lot of things that you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2280.0,"endTime":2282.384,"body":"shouldn't be buying two interior"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2280.0,"endTime":2282.384,"body":"... credit card bill."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2285.563,"endTime":2289.7,"body":"I love that. I always ..."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2285.563,"endTime":2289.7,"body":"love hearing stories. You tell"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2289.7,"endTime":2290.5,"body":"stories about"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2290.5,"endTime":2293.094,"body":"the things that you're doing,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2290.5,"endTime":2293.094,"body":"because like, one, they're super"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2293.094,"endTime":2295.704,"body":"entertaining, but then also, you"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2293.094,"endTime":2295.704,"body":"come out with stuff like that."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2295.704,"endTime":2299.0,"body":"Like, \"Yeah, I've bought an"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2295.704,"endTime":2299.0,"body":"emoji domain [chuckles] that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2299.0,"endTime":2301.884,"body":"never would have crossed my mind"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2299.0,"endTime":2301.884,"body":"to even try doing.\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2302.713,"endTime":2305.3,"body":"I don't just have one. I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2302.713,"endTime":2305.3,"body":"have a- a specific one that I've"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2305.3,"endTime":2308.744,"body":"been putting together for a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2305.3,"endTime":2308.744,"body":"authentication service that is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2308.744,"endTime":2313.0,"body":"themed about a wizard. And it --"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2308.744,"endTime":2313.0,"body":"the link is literally the link"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2313.0,"endTime":2317.5,"body":"emoji with the magic wand"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2313.0,"endTime":2317.5,"body":"because they're magic links. And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2317.5,"endTime":2319.0,"body":"so the whole idea"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2319.0,"endTime":2322.333,"body":"is making a- a- a single sign on"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2319.0,"endTime":2322.333,"body":"magic link service that uses"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2322.333,"endTime":2326.264,"body":"emojis as the links, just"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2322.333,"endTime":2326.264,"body":"because, like -- in- in the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2326.264,"endTime":2329.0,"body":"right audience, it's- it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2326.264,"endTime":2329.0,"body":"really entertaining. But it-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2329.0,"endTime":2332.0,"body":"it's also, you know, a lot"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2329.0,"endTime":2332.0,"body":"harder the -- to forge those"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2332.0,"endTime":2335.0,"body":"because, you know, how many"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2332.0,"endTime":2335.0,"body":"people are gonna be using emojis"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2335.0,"endTime":2335.469,"body":"in their thing? [Chuckles]"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2338.048,"endTime":2338.5,"body":"Well-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2338.5,"endTime":2339.0,"body":"[Chuckles] That's pretty"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2338.5,"endTime":2339.0,"body":"cool."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2338.7,"endTime":2342.0,"body":"-once you- you get"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2338.7,"endTime":2342.0,"body":"investors, everybody's gonna be"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2342.0,"endTime":2344.5,"body":"using it. It's gonna be the next"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2342.0,"endTime":2344.5,"body":"big thing. It won't- it won't be"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2344.5,"endTime":2347.139,"body":"something of the olden days."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2344.5,"endTime":2347.139,"body":"It'll be of the newen days."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2348.358,"endTime":2350.418,"body":"Well, the thing that I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2348.358,"endTime":2350.418,"body":"love about emojis is —"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2350.418,"endTime":2352.478,"body":"especially"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2352.478,"endTime":2354.3,"body":"like in Virtual Coffee — it's a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2352.478,"endTime":2354.3,"body":"good example. We have an"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2354.3,"endTime":2355.058,"body":"international"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2355.059,"endTime":2357.3,"body":"community of developers that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2355.059,"endTime":2357.3,"body":"come together. But the thing"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2357.3,"endTime":2361.7,"body":"that is most universal is the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2357.3,"endTime":2361.7,"body":"wave emoji. Like, everybody"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2361.7,"endTime":2362.3,"body":"knows what that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2362.3,"endTime":2366.5,"body":"means. Everybody can react and,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2362.3,"endTime":2366.5,"body":"like, emojis in- in themself"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2366.5,"endTime":2369.5,"body":"almost a universal language."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2366.5,"endTime":2369.5,"body":"Doesn't matter which one you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2369.5,"endTime":2372.0,"body":"speak or read, the emojis are"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2369.5,"endTime":2372.0,"body":"pretty much being the same"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2372.0,"endTime":2372.518,"body":"thing."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2373.088,"endTime":2375.5,"body":"Okay. So- so you have --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2373.088,"endTime":2375.5,"body":"I was gonna ask, one- one of my"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2375.5,"endTime":2376.568,"body":"questions was, like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2376.597,"endTime":2380.3,"body":"what is the- the coolest problem"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2376.597,"endTime":2380.3,"body":"that you want to solve? And"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2380.3,"endTime":2383.0,"body":"you're- you're talking about"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2380.3,"endTime":2383.0,"body":"some cool things. So I dunno if"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2383.0,"endTime":2386.0,"body":"you've already mentioned it, or"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2383.0,"endTime":2386.0,"body":"if you've got another big idea"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2386.0,"endTime":2387.097,"body":"you wanna share."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2388.228,"endTime":2391.648,"body":"I think- I think the one"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2388.228,"endTime":2391.648,"body":"that when I talked about the-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2391.648,"endTime":2394.5,"body":"the eyes light up of behind"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2391.648,"endTime":2394.5,"body":"everybody being like, \"Why I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2394.5,"endTime":2397.0,"body":"didn't even know that that was,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2394.5,"endTime":2397.0,"body":"like, something that people were"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2397.0,"endTime":2399.1,"body":"thinking about?\" And it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2399.1,"endTime":2402.538,"body":"kind of one of the things that I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2399.1,"endTime":2402.538,"body":"found, like, that I first love"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2402.538,"endTime":2405.7,"body":"of communities and it- it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2402.538,"endTime":2405.7,"body":"surrounds zombies actually,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2405.7,"endTime":2409.0,"body":"which is kind of, like, what"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2405.7,"endTime":2409.0,"body":"makes everybody laugh. And I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2409.0,"endTime":2411.293,"body":"want -- and I am building a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2411.322,"endTime":2414.7,"body":"whole platform that does,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2411.322,"endTime":2414.7,"body":"essentially, a distributed"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2414.7,"endTime":2415.222,"body":"network"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2415.282,"endTime":2419.693,"body":"of servers that cash basically a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2415.282,"endTime":2419.693,"body":"copy of, like, the internet"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2419.693,"endTime":2422.7,"body":"archive, the public domain"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2419.693,"endTime":2422.7,"body":"knowledge. And stores them in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2422.7,"endTime":2425.7,"body":"kind of a way that makes it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2422.7,"endTime":2425.7,"body":"accessible in, like -- the idea"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2425.7,"endTime":2431.0,"body":"behind it is this- this whole"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2425.7,"endTime":2431.0,"body":"nonprofit in self-sufficiency,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2431.0,"endTime":2432.853,"body":"rebuilding, and being"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2432.853,"endTime":2436.963,"body":"resourceful with just what you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2432.853,"endTime":2436.963,"body":"have. And part of it comes from"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2437.592,"endTime":2442.032,"body":"my desire just to wanna host"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2437.592,"endTime":2442.032,"body":"what I call Zombie Con and where"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2442.032,"endTime":2446.023,"body":"you got a junk pile of computers"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2442.032,"endTime":2446.023,"body":"and a challenge. And you throw a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2446.023,"endTime":2448.603,"body":"bunch of nerds that say, \"Okay,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2446.023,"endTime":2448.603,"body":"rebuild the internet. And here's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2448.603,"endTime":2451.693,"body":"what you get to use for it.\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2448.603,"endTime":2451.693,"body":"Because I think, when you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2451.693,"endTime":2454.0,"body":"building out of necessity, the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2451.693,"endTime":2454.0,"body":"solutions that you come to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2454.0,"endTime":2457.401,"body":"problems become so much"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2454.0,"endTime":2457.401,"body":"different"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2457.463,"endTime":2463.402,"body":"than when you have the luxury of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2457.463,"endTime":2463.402,"body":"both time and resources. And I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2463.402,"endTime":2465.922,"body":"feel like something special will"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2463.402,"endTime":2465.922,"body":"come out of that, that I don't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2465.922,"endTime":2470.0,"body":"even realize. But I just --"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2465.922,"endTime":2470.0,"body":"every time that I kinda talk"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2470.0,"endTime":2470.353,"body":"about"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2470.413,"endTime":2473.353,"body":"that particular side of things,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2470.413,"endTime":2473.353,"body":"like, it gets people excited"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2473.353,"endTime":2477.193,"body":"because, you know, there's a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2473.353,"endTime":2477.193,"body":"sense in all of us that I feel"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2477.193,"endTime":2480.0,"body":"like you want that dopamine"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2477.193,"endTime":2480.0,"body":"effect of being like, \"I did"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2480.0,"endTime":2483.012,"body":"it,\" whether it's solving a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2480.0,"endTime":2483.012,"body":"problem with your code, it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2483.012,"endTime":2484.662,"body":"fixing a server, or if it's,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2484.663,"endTime":2485.982,"body":"like, just simpling -- simple as"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2484.663,"endTime":2485.982,"body":"patching that drywall, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2485.982,"endTime":2489.0,"body":"looking back, and be like, \"You"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2485.982,"endTime":2489.0,"body":"can't even tell!\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2489.0,"endTime":2490.813,"body":"[Bekah and Dan laugh] It's that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2489.0,"endTime":2490.813,"body":"sense of pride and, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2490.813,"endTime":2493.123,"body":"accomplishment that you get out"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2490.813,"endTime":2493.123,"body":"of, like, the work that you do"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2493.123,"endTime":2496.3,"body":"that drives all of us. And the-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2493.123,"endTime":2496.3,"body":"the thing that I've really"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2496.3,"endTime":2496.813,"body":"wanted to build"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2496.813,"endTime":2499.693,"body":"is the -- just the way that we"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2496.813,"endTime":2499.693,"body":"can share that and, like, make"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2499.693,"endTime":2502.5,"body":"these things being like, \"This"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2499.693,"endTime":2502.5,"body":"is how you patch a drywall, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2502.5,"endTime":2505.523,"body":"open sourcing those, and making"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2502.5,"endTime":2505.523,"body":"them available as many people"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2505.523,"endTime":2508.5,"body":"that are interested in it.\" And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2505.523,"endTime":2508.5,"body":"just trying to figure out ways"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2508.5,"endTime":2510.131,"body":"to, again, make it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2510.132,"endTime":2513.222,"body":"accessible and last through the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2510.132,"endTime":2513.222,"body":"apocalypse. Because I feel like"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2513.222,"endTime":2515.922,"body":"that's the hardest challenge you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2513.222,"endTime":2515.922,"body":"could ever possibly think about."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2516.402,"endTime":2521.0,"body":"And ... thinking about ways to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2516.402,"endTime":2521.0,"body":"solve that, to just make your"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2521.0,"endTime":2521.562,"body":"... I don't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2521.563,"endTime":2523.693,"body":"know. It just keeps me up at"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2521.563,"endTime":2523.693,"body":"night [chuckles]."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2526.313,"endTime":2527.353,"body":"Yeah. That's really"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2526.313,"endTime":2527.353,"body":"interesting."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2527.697,"endTime":2530.936,"body":"Like, our most valuable"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2527.697,"endTime":2530.936,"body":"resource is our knowledge. And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2530.936,"endTime":2535.077,"body":"if we have to start over, losing"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2530.936,"endTime":2535.077,"body":"our knowledge base as a humanity"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2535.077,"endTime":2538.617,"body":"would be the most detrimental"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2535.077,"endTime":2538.617,"body":"thing. And so, the more that we"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2538.617,"endTime":2541.3,"body":"work through figure out a way to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2538.617,"endTime":2541.3,"body":"not only maintain that, but"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2541.3,"endTime":2542.7,"body":"also use that data."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2542.7,"endTime":2545.277,"body":"And- and part of what drives the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2542.7,"endTime":2545.277,"body":"fun on this is, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2545.277,"endTime":2549.476,"body":"you can download the entirety of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2545.277,"endTime":2549.476,"body":"Stack Overflow as a SQL database"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2550.032,"endTime":2554.382,"body":"to your computer. And now you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2550.032,"endTime":2554.382,"body":"have the entirety of all of the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2554.382,"endTime":2557.7,"body":"question and answers that you've"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2554.382,"endTime":2557.7,"body":"needed to fix your programming"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2557.7,"endTime":2557.98,"body":"at"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2557.981,"endTime":2562.302,"body":"your fingertips. It's only up to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2557.981,"endTime":2562.302,"body":"you to figure out how to query"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2562.302,"endTime":2565.5,"body":"that data to find the answers"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2562.302,"endTime":2565.5,"body":"you need. And I think, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2565.5,"endTime":2567.7,"body":"doing that offline, where you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2565.5,"endTime":2567.7,"body":"don't have connection to the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2567.7,"endTime":2568.242,"body":"internet,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2568.242,"endTime":2572.291,"body":"like, makes you more resourceful"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2568.242,"endTime":2572.291,"body":"and, like, you- you solve the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2572.291,"endTime":2576.7,"body":"problems in a different way. And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2572.291,"endTime":2576.7,"body":"I feel like, just -- I feel so"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2576.7,"endTime":2577.161,"body":"excited"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2577.161,"endTime":2580.461,"body":"when I do it on my own. So, I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2577.161,"endTime":2580.461,"body":"just, like, trying to build the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2580.461,"endTime":2583.0,"body":"platforms, and giving the people"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2580.461,"endTime":2583.0,"body":"the encouragement, and, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2583.0,"endTime":2586.0,"body":"the support to know that, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2583.0,"endTime":2586.0,"body":"all of this stuff's possible."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2586.0,"endTime":2587.481,"body":"Here- here's the way to get"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2586.0,"endTime":2587.481,"body":"started."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2589.137,"endTime":2589.766,"body":"That's awesome."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2591.597,"endTime":2594.177,"body":"Like I said, it causes-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2591.597,"endTime":2594.177,"body":"causes everybody to just go down"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2594.177,"endTime":2596.487,"body":"that rabbit hole, and you start"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2594.177,"endTime":2596.487,"body":"thinking about these things, and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2596.487,"endTime":2599.7,"body":"you're just like, \"Man, I don't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2596.487,"endTime":2599.7,"body":"even know how to store p- you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2599.7,"endTime":2603.5,"body":"know, flower for longer than a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2599.7,"endTime":2603.5,"body":"couple of days.\" Like, \"How am I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2603.5,"endTime":2606.5,"body":"gonna store for years?\" And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2603.5,"endTime":2606.5,"body":"there- there different problems"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2606.5,"endTime":2607.766,"body":"you have to try to solve."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2608.318,"endTime":2608.708,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2609.293,"endTime":2613.3,"body":"Yeah. I've -- I really"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2609.293,"endTime":2613.3,"body":"liked that idea about things get"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2613.3,"endTime":2617.784,"body":"done differently if it's out of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2613.3,"endTime":2617.784,"body":"necessity. There's a very"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2617.784,"endTime":2622.7,"body":"different approach and a lot of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2617.784,"endTime":2622.7,"body":"... I don't know- I don't"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2622.7,"endTime":2623.482,"body":"know if I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2623.483,"endTime":2626.483,"body":"wanna say like innovation that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2623.483,"endTime":2626.483,"body":"comes out of it, but, you know,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2626.483,"endTime":2631.494,"body":"when you have to do something,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2626.483,"endTime":2631.494,"body":"you're going to think about it"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2631.494,"endTime":2635.3,"body":"in a different way. And you- and"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2631.494,"endTime":2635.3,"body":"you are going to change ..."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2635.3,"endTime":2637.284,"body":"things to make"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2637.284,"endTime":2640.0,"body":"sure that it gets accomplished."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2637.284,"endTime":2640.0,"body":"At -- that -- I feel --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2640.0,"endTime":2642.7,"body":"[chuckles] in my mind, I'm"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2640.0,"endTime":2642.7,"body":"building, like, a scientific"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2642.7,"endTime":2645.353,"body":"trial on what that looks like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2642.7,"endTime":2645.353,"body":"you know? Like, \"Let's make"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2645.353,"endTime":2647.7,"body":"these people do it out of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2645.353,"endTime":2647.7,"body":"necessity. And then, these"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2647.7,"endTime":2651.143,"body":"people can brainstorm.\" How does"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2647.7,"endTime":2651.143,"body":"that turn out?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2652.534,"endTime":2655.923,"body":"I -- yeah. But I mean, I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2652.534,"endTime":2655.923,"body":"think that's a -- it's a really"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2655.923,"endTime":2658.7,"body":"interesting point. And i-it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2655.923,"endTime":2658.7,"body":"one of the, like, sort of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2658.7,"endTime":2659.043,"body":"through"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2659.043,"endTime":2661.233,"body":"lines of the way you've been"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2659.043,"endTime":2661.233,"body":"talking, you know? Especially"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2661.233,"endTime":2663.244,"body":"about your career and, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2661.233,"endTime":2663.244,"body":"the choice you made, right? Is-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2663.244,"endTime":2666.153,"body":"is that- is that doing by"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2663.244,"endTime":2666.153,"body":"necessity? And it's a much"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2666.153,"endTime":2670.929,"body":"different ... learning path than"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2666.153,"endTime":2670.929,"body":"school, like a norm- like a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2670.929,"endTime":2673.539,"body":"sort of traditional school or"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2670.929,"endTime":2673.539,"body":"even a bootcamp, right, where"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2673.898,"endTime":2678.0,"body":"you're learning because somebody"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2673.898,"endTime":2678.0,"body":"told you to learn this thing,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2678.0,"endTime":2681.3,"body":"right? So, maybe somebody that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2678.0,"endTime":2681.3,"body":"comes out of -- if there was"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2682.268,"endTime":2682.268,"body":"some f-f-f- -- I don't"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2682.268,"endTime":2684.0,"body":"know if there is these days or"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2682.268,"endTime":2684.0,"body":"not, a front-end development,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2684.0,"endTime":2687.5,"body":"like, actual degree, these --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2684.0,"endTime":2687.5,"body":"[chuckles] I -- who knows? But,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2687.5,"endTime":2690.3,"body":"you know, like, somebody who"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2687.5,"endTime":2690.3,"body":"graduated school with that sort"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2690.3,"endTime":2694.0,"body":"of thing will have a ... sort of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2690.3,"endTime":2694.0,"body":"a -- maybe a different knowledge"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2694.0,"endTime":2696.0,"body":"set than somebody who was"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2694.0,"endTime":2696.0,"body":"working for four years, right,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2696.0,"endTime":2699.0,"body":"in- in that field. And there's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2696.0,"endTime":2699.0,"body":"gonna be things that they do"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2699.0,"endTime":2700.252,"body":"know, that the other person"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2700.253,"endTime":2705.0,"body":"doesn't, and vice versa, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2700.253,"endTime":2705.0,"body":"know? But that necessity ..."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2705.0,"endTime":2709.0,"body":"driving force is- is ... I don't"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2705.0,"endTime":2709.0,"body":"know. It's an important and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2709.0,"endTime":2710.423,"body":"interesting- interesting thing."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2710.623,"endTime":2713.983,"body":"You know, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2710.623,"endTime":2713.983,"body":"And- and I started- I started in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2713.983,"endTime":2717.0,"body":"my call [??] career before I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2713.983,"endTime":2717.0,"body":"feel, like, bootca- camps were a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2717.0,"endTime":2718.273,"body":"thing. I- I tried"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2718.273,"endTime":2722.923,"body":"going to school to learn IT. But"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2718.273,"endTime":2722.923,"body":"by that point, I understood more"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2723.103,"endTime":2726.3,"body":"than they were trying to teach"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2723.103,"endTime":2726.3,"body":"me. And I- I couldn't -- it was-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2726.3,"endTime":2730.784,"body":"it was- it was a difficult time."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2726.3,"endTime":2730.784,"body":"And when I realized that I can"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2730.784,"endTime":2735.0,"body":"just sort of get the job without"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2730.784,"endTime":2735.0,"body":"needing anything more than being"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2735.0,"endTime":2736.298,"body":"able to do it, like,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2736.539,"endTime":2739.0,"body":"that just caused me just to,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2736.539,"endTime":2739.0,"body":"\"Oh, I'm gonna learn this. Okay."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2739.0,"endTime":2741.7,"body":"Yeah, I can do that.\" And it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2739.0,"endTime":2741.7,"body":"just, for me, it's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2741.7,"endTime":2745.0,"body":"self-propelled. Because I always"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2741.7,"endTime":2745.0,"body":"had the tools to figure it out,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2745.0,"endTime":2746.048,"body":"because that's how I started."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2746.048,"endTime":2749.0,"body":"I started, you know, not having"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2746.048,"endTime":2749.0,"body":"the luxury of being able to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2749.0,"endTime":2751.0,"body":"search the internet for"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2749.0,"endTime":2751.0,"body":"something cuz I didn't have the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2751.0,"endTime":2752.3,"body":"internet to search. I had"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2752.3,"endTime":2755.648,"body":"\"HTML and CSS For Dummies\". I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2752.3,"endTime":2755.648,"body":"had to find it in that"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2755.679,"endTime":2761.009,"body":"book and you use that resource."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2755.679,"endTime":2761.009,"body":"And so, going from that to- to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2761.018,"endTime":2764.688,"body":"now, like, and having to be able"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2761.018,"endTime":2764.688,"body":"to figure things out, out of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2764.688,"endTime":2767.3,"body":"necessity, because there are"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2764.688,"endTime":2767.3,"body":"people that couldn't work"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2767.3,"endTime":2770.0,"body":"because their technology wasn't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2767.3,"endTime":2770.0,"body":"working and you're responsible"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2770.0,"endTime":2770.659,"body":"to fix it, to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2771.199,"endTime":2774.498,"body":"being like, \"Okay. Now we have"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2771.199,"endTime":2774.498,"body":"these massive sets of problems."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2774.498,"endTime":2778.458,"body":"How can we resolve all of them"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2774.498,"endTime":2778.458,"body":"with automation? Or how can we"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2778.458,"endTime":2781.7,"body":"solve an unknown problem or"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2778.458,"endTime":2781.7,"body":"build new problems with code?\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2781.7,"endTime":2782.858,"body":"And that's-"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2782.858,"endTime":2787.0,"body":"that's kind of exciting because"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2782.858,"endTime":2787.0,"body":"like, for me, I never learned"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2787.0,"endTime":2790.0,"body":"the fundamentals like you would"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2787.0,"endTime":2790.0,"body":"in school. And, like, there's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2790.0,"endTime":2792.7,"body":"great benefit to going through"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2790.0,"endTime":2792.7,"body":"because, like, different people"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2792.7,"endTime":2797.7,"body":"learn different ways. And I feel"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2792.7,"endTime":2797.7,"body":"like I had an understanding from"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2797.7,"endTime":2798.323,"body":"what I learned"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2798.324,"endTime":2802.494,"body":"on how- how all the programming"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2798.324,"endTime":2802.494,"body":"language kind of overlapped. But"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2802.494,"endTime":2804.5,"body":"when you're in school or you go"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2802.494,"endTime":2804.5,"body":"through bootcamp, you learn"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2804.5,"endTime":2804.982,"body":"those"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2804.983,"endTime":2807.983,"body":"same things. You get that same"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2804.983,"endTime":2807.983,"body":"sense of encouragement that, you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2807.983,"endTime":2811.434,"body":"know, \"I had to go through and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2807.983,"endTime":2811.434,"body":"overcome kind of in the life- in"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2811.943,"endTime":2815.0,"body":"the life field, where there were"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2811.943,"endTime":2815.0,"body":"real consequences if things"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2815.0,"endTime":2815.454,"body":"didn't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2815.454,"endTime":2819.224,"body":"work out.\" But going through a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2815.454,"endTime":2819.224,"body":"traditional or going through a"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2819.224,"endTime":2822.463,"body":"school or a bootcamp, you know,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2819.224,"endTime":2822.463,"body":"you get kind of battle-tested"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2822.494,"endTime":2824.5,"body":"early on because they're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2822.494,"endTime":2824.5,"body":"shifting you through all of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2824.5,"endTime":2825.372,"body":"these ideas"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2825.373,"endTime":2828.373,"body":"and concepts, and you learn"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2825.373,"endTime":2828.373,"body":"fundamentally how all these"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2828.373,"endTime":2830.983,"body":"things work, which gives you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2828.373,"endTime":2830.983,"body":"enough confidence to sort of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2831.014,"endTime":2834.5,"body":"jumpstart where you need to be."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2831.014,"endTime":2834.5,"body":"Because you go from having no"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2834.5,"endTime":2835.0,"body":"idea how"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2835.0,"endTime":2837.853,"body":"any of this technology works, to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2835.0,"endTime":2837.853,"body":"being like, \"I know how magic"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2837.853,"endTime":2841.5,"body":"works, and I will figure out how"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2837.853,"endTime":2841.5,"body":"to cast a spell. Dagnabbit.\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2841.5,"endTime":2843.583,"body":"And- and that in itself is"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2841.5,"endTime":2843.583,"body":"power."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2844.094,"endTime":2846.7,"body":"It is power. It's awesome."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2844.094,"endTime":2846.7,"body":"It's such a good feeling, right,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2846.7,"endTime":2849.0,"body":"whether -- it doesn't matter how"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2846.7,"endTime":2849.0,"body":"you- how you learn, like, that-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2849.0,"endTime":2850.243,"body":"that feeling of-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2850.804,"endTime":2853.635,"body":"of knowing how to do the thing,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2850.804,"endTime":2853.635,"body":"knowing how to cast the magic"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2853.635,"endTime":2854.894,"body":"spell. I lo- I- I love it."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2855.181,"endTime":2858.0,"body":"I's great. Well, Roger,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2855.181,"endTime":2858.0,"body":"we're just about out of time."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2858.0,"endTime":2858.901,"body":"So I wanna"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2858.902,"endTime":2863.251,"body":"thank you for being here. Is"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2858.902,"endTime":2863.251,"body":"there any last bits of advice or"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2863.251,"endTime":2865.282,"body":"things you want our listeners to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2863.251,"endTime":2865.282,"body":"hear?"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2867.362,"endTime":2870.521,"body":"Ooh. I never -- I didn't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2867.362,"endTime":2870.521,"body":"think about this. I should have"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2870.521,"endTime":2874.7,"body":"come prepared. I- I just think,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2870.521,"endTime":2874.7,"body":"like, i-if you're looking at"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2874.7,"endTime":2877.7,"body":"something and you feel ... out"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2874.7,"endTime":2877.7,"body":"of place, or you feel like you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2877.7,"endTime":2879.941,"body":"can't do it, or you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2879.942,"endTime":2883.0,"body":"not good enough, or what have"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2879.942,"endTime":2883.0,"body":"you, like, don't feel"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2883.0,"endTime":2886.7,"body":"discouraged. Because at some"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2883.0,"endTime":2886.7,"body":"point, everybody has been at"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2886.7,"endTime":2890.3,"body":"that point [??], and has looked"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2886.7,"endTime":2890.3,"body":"through, and has gotten over it."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2890.3,"endTime":2894.072,"body":"And i-it's just a matter of you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2890.3,"endTime":2894.072,"body":"getting to it. You just have to"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2894.072,"endTime":2898.032,"body":"do it. And then once you've done"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2894.072,"endTime":2898.032,"body":"it, it's easy. And I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2898.032,"endTime":2901.061,"body":"try to avoid saying things are"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2898.032,"endTime":2901.061,"body":"easy because it wasn't easy for"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2901.061,"endTime":2905.5,"body":"me when I started. But once I"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2901.061,"endTime":2905.5,"body":"did it, it became easy. And so,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2905.5,"endTime":2908.3,"body":"just remembering, like, getting"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2905.5,"endTime":2908.3,"body":"over that first hurdle and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2908.3,"endTime":2909.5,"body":"having the confidence"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2909.5,"endTime":2912.461,"body":"of doing the thing, doesn't"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2909.5,"endTime":2912.461,"body":"matter what that thing is,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2912.942,"endTime":2915.5,"body":"eventually you're going to do"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2912.942,"endTime":2915.5,"body":"it. Doesn't matter how long you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2915.5,"endTime":2918.7,"body":"wait to do it. But you'll get"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2915.5,"endTime":2918.7,"body":"over that hurdle, and it's gonna"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2918.7,"endTime":2922.5,"body":"get easier from there. Because"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2918.7,"endTime":2922.5,"body":"once you do it, you figured it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2922.5,"endTime":2926.0,"body":"out. You can't un-figure it out."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2922.5,"endTime":2926.0,"body":"It only goes one direction. It's"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2926.0,"endTime":2929.831,"body":"a one-way street. Once you start"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2926.0,"endTime":2929.831,"body":"walking it, that's it. You're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2929.831,"endTime":2933.161,"body":"just gonna keep figuring things"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2929.831,"endTime":2933.161,"body":"out. And when you start- when"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2933.251,"endTime":2936.5,"body":"you start out, I feel like"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2933.251,"endTime":2936.5,"body":"everything is overwhelming and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2936.5,"endTime":2936.956,"body":"... you"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2936.956,"endTime":2940.226,"body":"know, there's just a lot of"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2936.956,"endTime":2940.226,"body":"information coming in. And when"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2940.226,"endTime":2942.657,"body":"you first sit down and you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2940.226,"endTime":2942.657,"body":"falling all of these, you know,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2942.666,"endTime":2944.8,"body":"tutorials like, \"Hey, it works!\""},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2942.666,"endTime":2944.8,"body":"But then, when you try to do it"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2944.8,"endTime":2947.0,"body":"on your own and it doesn't,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2944.8,"endTime":2947.0,"body":"that's frustrating. Cuz you're"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2947.0,"endTime":2950.0,"body":"like, \"I should be able to have"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2947.0,"endTime":2950.0,"body":"this thing do the thing.\" And"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2950.0,"endTime":2952.7,"body":"it's not that you're ever wrong."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2950.0,"endTime":2952.7,"body":"It's just that you have to take"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2952.7,"endTime":2955.0,"body":"a little bit more time to figure"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2952.7,"endTime":2955.0,"body":"out which step that you missed"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2955.0,"endTime":2955.466,"body":"in the"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2955.467,"endTime":2958.706,"body":"process because it's somewhere."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2955.467,"endTime":2958.706,"body":"And when you do it once, you can"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2958.706,"endTime":2961.3,"body":"do it again. And once you've"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2958.706,"endTime":2961.3,"body":"done it a dozen times, suddenly"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2961.3,"endTime":2963.0,"body":"they're calling you a senior"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2961.3,"endTime":2963.0,"body":"developer."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2963.0,"endTime":2966.181,"body":"And that's just how it goes. It"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2963.0,"endTime":2966.181,"body":"just takes time and"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2966.181,"endTime":2968.492,"body":"persistence. And eventually,"},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2966.181,"endTime":2968.492,"body":"you'll overcome everything."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2970.431,"endTime":2973.0,"body":"Love that. It's a great"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2970.431,"endTime":2973.0,"body":"way to end. Thanks so much,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2973.0,"endTime":2974.456,"body":"Roger, for being here with us."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2974.456,"endTime":2975.3,"body":"Yeah. Thanks, Roger."},{"speaker":"Roger","startTime":2974.692,"endTime":2975.411,"body":"Thanks for having me."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2976.286,"endTime":2976.737,"body":"Bye."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2979.844,"endTime":2981.943,"body":"Thank you for listening to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2979.844,"endTime":2981.943,"body":"this episode of the Virtual"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2981.943,"endTime":2985.69,"body":"Coffee Podcast. This episode was"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2981.943,"endTime":2985.69,"body":"produced by Dan Ott and Bekah"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2985.69,"endTime":2988.0,"body":"Hawrot Weigel. If you have"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2985.69,"endTime":2988.0,"body":"questions or comments, you can"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2988.0,"endTime":2991.48,"body":"hit us up on Twitter at"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2988.0,"endTime":2991.48,"body":"VirtualCoffeeIO, or email us at"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2991.48,"endTime":2994.7,"body":"podcast@virtualcoffee.io. You"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2991.48,"endTime":2994.7,"body":"can find the show notes, sign up"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2994.7,"endTime":2996.989,"body":"for the newsletter, check out"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2994.7,"endTime":2996.989,"body":"any of our other resources on"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2996.989,"endTime":3000.0,"body":"our website, virtualcoffee.io."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2996.989,"endTime":3000.0,"body":"If you're interested in"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3000.0,"endTime":3000.38,"body":"sponsoring"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3000.38,"endTime":3002.78,"body":"Virtual Coffee, you can find out"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3000.38,"endTime":3002.78,"body":"more information on our website"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3003.05,"endTime":3007.489,"body":"at virtualcoffee.io/sponsorship."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3003.05,"endTime":3007.489,"body":"Please subscribe to our podcast"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3007.519,"endTime":3010.5,"body":"and be sure to leave us a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3007.519,"endTime":3010.5,"body":"review. Thanks for listening,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3010.5,"endTime":3011.57,"body":"and we'll see you next week!"}]}