{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3.875,"endTime":6.5,"body":"Hello and"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3.875,"endTime":6.5,"body":"welcome to Season 6, Episode 7"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":6.5,"endTime":6.695,"body":"of the"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":6.695,"endTime":9.403,"body":"Virtual Coffee Podcast. I'm"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":6.695,"endTime":9.403,"body":"Bekah, and this is a podcast"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":9.403,"endTime":12.111,"body":"that"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":12.111,"endTime":16.221,"body":"features members of the Virtual"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":12.111,"endTime":16.221,"body":"Coffee community. Virtual Coffee"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":16.221,"endTime":17.631,"body":"is an intimate group of"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":16.221,"endTime":17.631,"body":"developers at all stages of"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":17.631,"endTime":19.041,"body":"their"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":19.045,"endTime":21.951,"body":"coding journey. And they're"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":19.045,"endTime":21.951,"body":"here, on this podcast, sharing"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":21.951,"endTime":24.0,"body":"their stories and what they've"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":21.951,"endTime":24.0,"body":"learned. And we are here to"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":24.0,"endTime":27.67,"body":"share it with you. Here with me"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":24.0,"endTime":27.67,"body":"today is my co-host, Dan."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":28.041,"endTime":29.69,"body":"Wuddup, Bek? How's it"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":28.041,"endTime":29.69,"body":"going?"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":30.44,"endTime":32.75,"body":"It is- it is going well."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":30.44,"endTime":32.75,"body":"How's it going with you?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":33.875,"endTime":37.7,"body":"[Chuckles] It's going okay."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":33.875,"endTime":37.7,"body":"Yeah, we have a great episode"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":37.7,"endTime":37.926,"body":"today. We"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":37.926,"endTime":41.286,"body":"met with Ryan Kahn, who has done"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":37.926,"endTime":41.286,"body":"a lot of things through his"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":41.286,"endTime":44.453,"body":"career. He was a teacher, he's a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":41.286,"endTime":44.453,"body":"developer, and now, Ryan is a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":44.457,"endTime":45.969,"body":"consultant who comes and helps"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":44.457,"endTime":45.969,"body":"teams improve their"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":45.969,"endTime":47.481,"body":"collaboration"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":47.482,"endTime":49.103,"body":"and their communication skills."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":49.447,"endTime":51.996,"body":"I loved how Ryan talked"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":49.447,"endTime":51.996,"body":"about the importance of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":52.002,"endTime":57.741,"body":"empathizing with your teammates"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":52.002,"endTime":57.741,"body":"and treating each person as an"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":57.741,"endTime":59.751,"body":"individual human being who makes"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":57.741,"endTime":59.751,"body":"up your team. I think that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":59.751,"endTime":61.761,"body":"that's"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":61.762,"endTime":66.352,"body":"a really great approach in order"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":61.762,"endTime":66.352,"body":"to, you know, empower your team"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":66.352,"endTime":70.792,"body":"to do what they can do and the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":66.352,"endTime":70.792,"body":"best ways that they can do it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":71.602,"endTime":75.906,"body":"Yeah, absolutely. I- I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":71.602,"endTime":75.906,"body":"mean, it was- it was -- Ryan's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":75.906,"endTime":79.477,"body":"-- I mean, Ryan's always great"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":75.906,"endTime":79.477,"body":"to talk to, and, yeah. And that-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":79.477,"endTime":82.477,"body":"that, like, that- that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":79.477,"endTime":82.477,"body":"philosophy, I think, I don't"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":82.477,"endTime":84.576,"body":"know, lines up a lot with a lot"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":82.477,"endTime":84.576,"body":"of the stuff we talk about here"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":84.581,"endTime":87.277,"body":"at Virtual Coffee. So, it was"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":84.581,"endTime":87.277,"body":"nice to hear him talk about it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":87.277,"endTime":92.647,"body":"And it's nice that he is -- he's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":87.277,"endTime":92.647,"body":"doing this, like, he's -- I wa-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":92.652,"endTime":95.917,"body":"I was very interested to hear"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":92.652,"endTime":95.917,"body":"about his consultancy, and his-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":96.367,"endTime":98.0,"body":"and his, like, sort of new"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":96.367,"endTime":98.0,"body":"journey that he is doing"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":98.0,"endTime":99.337,"body":"because it's a little"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":99.337,"endTime":100.882,"body":"bit of a different approach"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":99.337,"endTime":100.882,"body":"than, you know, most people."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":100.882,"endTime":102.427,"body":"I'm- I'm a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":102.427,"endTime":106.177,"body":"consultant myself, but I just"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":102.427,"endTime":106.177,"body":"kinda come in and I do, like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":106.177,"endTime":109.087,"body":"the work, right? Or like, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":106.177,"endTime":109.087,"body":"know, the kind of stuff you- you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":109.087,"endTime":112.3,"body":"think about, right? And this is"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":109.087,"endTime":112.3,"body":"more, Ryan's gonna come in and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":112.3,"endTime":116.046,"body":"help teams improve their whole"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":112.3,"endTime":116.046,"body":"situation, right? And then leave"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":116.527,"endTime":118.3,"body":"[chuckles], you know? And I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":116.527,"endTime":118.3,"body":"think that's really great. I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":118.3,"endTime":121.3,"body":"think it's a- I think it's a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":118.3,"endTime":121.3,"body":"very cool thing to do. And I was"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":121.3,"endTime":122.197,"body":"excited to hear about it."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":123.081,"endTime":126.0,"body":"Yeah. It is really"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":123.081,"endTime":126.0,"body":"something that I think is"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":126.0,"endTime":127.311,"body":"undervalued too."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":127.311,"endTime":130.252,"body":"So I think that a lot of teams"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":127.311,"endTime":130.252,"body":"experience these problems and"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":130.252,"endTime":134.8,"body":"they just end up having a lot of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":130.252,"endTime":134.8,"body":"turnover, or burnout, or things"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":134.8,"endTime":135.201,"body":"like that."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":135.201,"endTime":139.912,"body":"And there's not a huge focus on"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":135.201,"endTime":139.912,"body":"what Ryan's doing, but I think"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":139.912,"endTime":141.291,"body":"it's something that should be"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":139.912,"endTime":141.291,"body":"focused on. It's really needed"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":141.291,"endTime":142.67,"body":"in"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":142.671,"endTime":143.301,"body":"the industry."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":144.701,"endTime":145.896,"body":"Yeah, I agree."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":147.562,"endTime":150.051,"body":"Well, we start every"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":147.562,"endTime":150.051,"body":"episode of the podcast like we"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":150.056,"endTime":152.651,"body":"start every Virtual Coffee. We"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":150.056,"endTime":152.651,"body":"introduce ourselves with our"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":152.651,"endTime":155.532,"body":"name, where we're from, what we"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":152.651,"endTime":155.532,"body":"do, and a random check-in"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":155.532,"endTime":167.187,"body":"question. We hope you enjoy this"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":155.532,"endTime":167.187,"body":"episode. Today's intro question"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":167.187,"endTime":171.537,"body":"is, if you could remove one task"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":167.187,"endTime":171.537,"body":"from your day, what would it be?"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":172.646,"endTime":175.826,"body":"My name is Bekah. I am a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":172.646,"endTime":175.826,"body":"technical community builder from"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":175.826,"endTime":181.3,"body":"a small town in Ohio, and if I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":175.826,"endTime":181.3,"body":"could remove one task I --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":181.3,"endTime":185.306,"body":"email, or -- no. Meetings. Can I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":181.3,"endTime":185.306,"body":"remove meetings? That's kind of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":185.306,"endTime":189.387,"body":"like general, but I would get"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":185.306,"endTime":189.387,"body":"rid of most of them."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":190.387,"endTime":193.812,"body":"So, all meetings? All"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":190.387,"endTime":193.812,"body":"right."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":194.081,"endTime":194.5,"body":"Only the-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":194.5,"endTime":195.3,"body":"I'm used -- I mean [laughs]"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":194.5,"endTime":195.3,"body":"--"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":194.7,"endTime":198.852,"body":"-only the ones I wanna"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":194.7,"endTime":198.852,"body":"get rid of. The ones without"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":198.852,"endTime":201.312,"body":"agendas. Those ones."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":201.762,"endTime":202.122,"body":"Sure."},{"speaker":"Ryan Kahn","startTime":202.197,"endTime":202.377,"body":"Not this one, I hope."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":202.602,"endTime":205.766,"body":"Well, this isn't a meeting,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":202.602,"endTime":205.766,"body":"this is- this is an event,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":205.766,"endTime":206.157,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":206.372,"endTime":207.981,"body":"Mm-hmm. This is an event."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":208.766,"endTime":212.787,"body":"Yeah. Alright. Hi, I'm Dan."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":208.766,"endTime":212.787,"body":"I am in Cleveland. I do website"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":212.787,"endTime":216.387,"body":"development. And, yeah, I think"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":212.787,"endTime":216.387,"body":"-- the first thing that popped"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":216.387,"endTime":219.537,"body":"into my mind was like bedtime"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":216.387,"endTime":219.537,"body":"stuff with the kids. I- I don't"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":219.542,"endTime":222.236,"body":"mind like the all the way at the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":219.542,"endTime":222.236,"body":"end reading books and stuff, but"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":222.241,"endTime":225.176,"body":"it's all the, you know, bath and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":222.241,"endTime":225.176,"body":"whatever, all that nonsense. But"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":225.176,"endTime":228.227,"body":"then, I think, actually, it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":225.176,"endTime":228.227,"body":"getting them in the car."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":228.956,"endTime":229.056,"body":"Oh."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":229.287,"endTime":231.5,"body":"There's -- I -- my, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":229.287,"endTime":231.5,"body":"know, I still have a 3-year-old"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":231.5,"endTime":231.806,"body":"and a 6-year-old,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":231.806,"endTime":234.986,"body":"and so they're still all, both"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":231.806,"endTime":234.986,"body":"in car seats, you know, and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":234.986,"endTime":237.236,"body":"all that stuff. And doesn't"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":234.986,"endTime":237.236,"body":"matter where we're going, what"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":237.236,"endTime":240.417,"body":"we're doing, it takes just for,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":237.236,"endTime":240.417,"body":"like, ever. Like, I sell them to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":240.417,"endTime":242.667,"body":"go outside cuz they can get into"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":240.417,"endTime":242.667,"body":"the car by themselves, you know?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":243.086,"endTime":243.971,"body":"And I tell 'em to go outside and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":243.086,"endTime":243.971,"body":"get in the car. And I go"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":243.971,"endTime":244.856,"body":"outside,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":244.856,"endTime":246.086,"body":"and they're just like wandering"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":244.856,"endTime":246.086,"body":"around in the garage or"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":246.086,"endTime":247.316,"body":"whatever,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":247.317,"endTime":250.0,"body":"you know [laughs]? I'm like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":247.317,"endTime":250.0,"body":"\"Just- just get in the car. We"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":250.0,"endTime":250.407,"body":"just need to go."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":250.407,"endTime":252.327,"body":"This is -- we don't have to do"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":250.407,"endTime":252.327,"body":"this every time.\" And like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":252.327,"endTime":254.247,"body":"playing"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":254.247,"endTime":255.177,"body":"with toys while I'm trying to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":254.247,"endTime":255.177,"body":"get them buckled and all this"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":255.177,"endTime":256.107,"body":"stuff."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":256.112,"endTime":258.5,"body":"So, that's gonna be my answer."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":256.112,"endTime":258.5,"body":"Yeah. Putting the kids-"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":258.0,"endTime":258.776,"body":"That's a good one."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":258.5,"endTime":261.627,"body":"-in the car. They could"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":258.5,"endTime":261.627,"body":"just, like, snap [fingers snap],"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":261.627,"endTime":261.956,"body":"and they would just be strapped"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":261.627,"endTime":261.956,"body":"in the car. That would be --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":262.646,"endTime":264.357,"body":"With their shoes on too,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":262.646,"endTime":264.357,"body":"right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":264.507,"endTime":266.276,"body":"Sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":264.507,"endTime":266.276,"body":"Exactly. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":266.672,"endTime":268.916,"body":"I don't know how many"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":266.672,"endTime":268.916,"body":"times we've been in the car and"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":268.916,"endTime":272.0,"body":"a kid doesn't have shoes. Like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":268.916,"endTime":272.0,"body":"my kids are all ... older. My"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":272.0,"endTime":272.336,"body":"youngest is"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":272.336,"endTime":276.836,"body":"five and a half, but frequently,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":272.336,"endTime":276.836,"body":"we end up in the car, and, like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":276.836,"endTime":280.3,"body":"one kid's like, \"Oh, I did -- I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":276.836,"endTime":280.3,"body":"didn't bring any shoes.\" Like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":280.3,"endTime":281.5,"body":"\"Why? What? How is that a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":280.3,"endTime":281.5,"body":"thing?\" [Dan laughs]"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":281.5,"endTime":283.857,"body":"Like, \"You just always ...\" \"You"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":281.5,"endTime":283.857,"body":"didn't tell me I needed to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":283.862,"endTime":285.224,"body":"put on shoes.\" \"You always put"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":283.862,"endTime":285.224,"body":"on shoes if you're getting in"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":285.224,"endTime":286.586,"body":"the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":286.586,"endTime":287.396,"body":"car.\" Like --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":287.992,"endTime":289.7,"body":"Standard operating"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":287.992,"endTime":289.7,"body":"procedure."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":289.7,"endTime":290.0,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":290.0,"endTime":291.0,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":292.0,"endTime":294.312,"body":"Okay. Well, I'm Ryan."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":294.401,"endTime":297.701,"body":"I am a developer experience"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":294.401,"endTime":297.701,"body":"consultant and productivity"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":297.701,"endTime":300.432,"body":"consultant in New York City. A"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":297.701,"endTime":300.432,"body":"little- little town in New York"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":300.432,"endTime":304.451,"body":"called New York City. My"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":300.432,"endTime":304.451,"body":"daughter is little over one year"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":304.451,"endTime":306.056,"body":"old. So getting her in the car"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":304.451,"endTime":306.056,"body":"is very easy. We just pick her"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":306.056,"endTime":307.661,"body":"up,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":307.661,"endTime":309.762,"body":"and put her in, and she doesn't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":307.661,"endTime":309.762,"body":"have much of a choice about it."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":309.762,"endTime":313.002,"body":"And if she needs shoes, we put"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":309.762,"endTime":313.002,"body":"'em on. And, yeah, meetings."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":313.031,"endTime":315.221,"body":"I actually like meetings. I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":313.031,"endTime":315.221,"body":"think that that's when I do my"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":315.221,"endTime":319.857,"body":"best work. So I won't say that."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":315.221,"endTime":319.857,"body":"I will say dishes. That is the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":319.857,"endTime":322.7,"body":"one thing that my wife and I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":319.857,"endTime":322.7,"body":"[chuckles] have the most tension"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":322.7,"endTime":324.206,"body":"about is actually just"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":324.206,"endTime":327.297,"body":"doing the dishes. Cuz neither"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":324.206,"endTime":327.297,"body":"one of us likes to do it. So"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":327.297,"endTime":329.0,"body":"I would remove that from my day"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":327.297,"endTime":329.0,"body":"in a heartbeat."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":329.3,"endTime":330.5,"body":"That's fine [??]. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":330.5,"endTime":332.7,"body":"Just, I mean, I would want"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":330.5,"endTime":332.7,"body":"clean dishes. I wouldn't wanna"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":332.7,"endTime":333.507,"body":"just not do it and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":333.512,"endTime":335.666,"body":"have dirty dishes. But if the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":333.512,"endTime":335.666,"body":"dishes get clean regardless,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":335.672,"endTime":337.706,"body":"that's what I would pick. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":339.132,"endTime":341.5,"body":"I like that. Yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":339.132,"endTime":341.5,"body":"actually, of all the, like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":341.5,"endTime":342.252,"body":"household chores that you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":342.252,"endTime":344.471,"body":"have to do all the time, dishes"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":342.252,"endTime":344.471,"body":"are like one of the easiest ones"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":344.471,"endTime":347.3,"body":"for me. Like, in which, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":344.471,"endTime":347.3,"body":"know, I -- chores are like a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":347.3,"endTime":348.072,"body":"pain -- I don't mean easy."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":348.312,"endTime":351.492,"body":"Like, easy to get myself to do,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":348.312,"endTime":351.492,"body":"you know? I think I can"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":351.492,"endTime":353.651,"body":"listen to podcasts and stuff,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":351.492,"endTime":353.651,"body":"and so it's, I don't know."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":353.982,"endTime":355.091,"body":"Yeah. It's rather"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":353.982,"endTime":355.091,"body":"meditative."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":354.3,"endTime":356.0,"body":"It doesn't bothers me when"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":354.3,"endTime":356.0,"body":"I'm doing the dishes. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":356.0,"endTime":358.601,"body":"exactly. Exactly [chuckles]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":356.0,"endTime":358.601,"body":"I'm, like, if"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":358.601,"endTime":361.5,"body":"I'm doing that chore, then, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":358.601,"endTime":361.5,"body":"know, that everybody -- somebody"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":361.5,"endTime":363.372,"body":"else is dealing with the kids"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":361.5,"endTime":363.372,"body":"[laughs]."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":364.062,"endTime":365.831,"body":"Hmm. A little break."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":365.891,"endTime":368.201,"body":"Oh, man. But I don't like"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":365.891,"endTime":368.201,"body":"putting the dishes away,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":368.232,"endTime":369.252,"body":"honestly. That's my --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":370.122,"endTime":371.172,"body":"Oh. Well, you know, it's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":370.122,"endTime":371.172,"body":"--"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":370.5,"endTime":372.0,"body":"That's, like, I don't mind"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":370.5,"endTime":372.0,"body":"cleaning them. It's like putting"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":372.0,"endTime":374.711,"body":"them away is the thing that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":372.0,"endTime":374.711,"body":"always bumps me on."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":375.057,"endTime":377.0,"body":"Our dishwasher's actually"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":375.057,"endTime":377.0,"body":"broken right now."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":377.0,"endTime":377.3,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":377.3,"endTime":379.0,"body":"So, all the dishes are"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":377.3,"endTime":379.0,"body":"done by hand, which is probably"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":379.0,"endTime":380.346,"body":"why it's front of mine, for me."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":381.101,"endTime":384.851,"body":"Our dishwasher was broke"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":381.101,"endTime":384.851,"body":"for like over a month. And it"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":384.911,"endTime":389.442,"body":"was- it was the source of a lot"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":384.911,"endTime":389.442,"body":"of tension in the house"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":389.442,"endTime":391.0,"body":"[laughs]. Like, we have four"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":389.442,"endTime":391.0,"body":"kids and then some of them like"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":391.0,"endTime":394.3,"body":"take plates in their rooms and"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":391.0,"endTime":394.3,"body":"then you've got like crusty"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":394.3,"endTime":396.242,"body":"dishes. Like, what are you"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":394.3,"endTime":396.242,"body":"doing?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":397.617,"endTime":398.596,"body":"And my wife does that."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":400.752,"endTime":404.141,"body":"Well, Ryan, we are very"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":400.752,"endTime":404.141,"body":"happy to have you here with us"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":404.141,"endTime":407.982,"body":"today to talk about a lot of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":404.141,"endTime":407.982,"body":"different things. But building"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":407.982,"endTime":410.951,"body":"better teams I think is gonna be"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":407.982,"endTime":410.951,"body":"a great source of our"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":410.951,"endTime":415.572,"body":"conversation. But before we get"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":410.951,"endTime":415.572,"body":"to that, let's hear your origin"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":415.572,"endTime":418.771,"body":"story. So, how did you get to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":415.572,"endTime":418.771,"body":"this point in your tech career?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":419.797,"endTime":422.007,"body":"Yeah, thanks. I mean, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":419.797,"endTime":422.007,"body":"always approach this story a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":422.007,"endTime":425.817,"body":"little differently every time I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":422.007,"endTime":425.817,"body":"tell it. I mean, I've always"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":425.817,"endTime":428.531,"body":"been interested in computers,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":425.817,"endTime":428.531,"body":"right when I was a kid. I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":428.531,"endTime":430.872,"body":"remember the first kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":428.531,"endTime":430.872,"body":"computer programming thing-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":430.872,"endTime":432.342,"body":"computer programming thing that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":430.872,"endTime":432.342,"body":"I did was, there was a video"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":432.342,"endTime":433.812,"body":"game I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":433.812,"endTime":437.112,"body":"liked to play and it was kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":433.812,"endTime":437.112,"body":"like Iron Man mode where like if"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":437.112,"endTime":440.232,"body":"you die, you die. And I- I had a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":437.112,"endTime":440.232,"body":"big career in the game, and then"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":440.232,"endTime":442.7,"body":"I died, and I was like, \"Oh, my"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":440.232,"endTime":442.7,"body":"god.\" I was so depressed."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":442.7,"endTime":445.0,"body":"Probably the first time I was"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":442.7,"endTime":445.0,"body":"ever depressed in my life that I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":445.0,"endTime":448.0,"body":"remember was [chuckles] I dying"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":445.0,"endTime":448.0,"body":"in this game."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":448.0,"endTime":450.7,"body":"And so, I came in, and I- I took"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":448.0,"endTime":450.7,"body":"the save game file,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":450.7,"endTime":452.932,"body":"and I switched around the bits,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":450.7,"endTime":452.932,"body":"and made myself alive again."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":453.742,"endTime":456.651,"body":"And so that's where I started"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":453.742,"endTime":456.651,"body":"out. I think with the, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":456.651,"endTime":459.052,"body":"know, I always was interested in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":456.651,"endTime":459.052,"body":"DOS, and kind of playing video"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":459.052,"endTime":462.081,"body":"games. And so, I've been talking"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":459.052,"endTime":462.081,"body":"to the computer for many years,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":462.081,"endTime":465.507,"body":"is what I call it, through the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":462.081,"endTime":465.507,"body":"terminal. But yeah, I never"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":465.507,"endTime":468.057,"body":"considered it as a career, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":465.507,"endTime":468.057,"body":"know? I had a teacher in high"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":468.057,"endTime":470.022,"body":"school who got me into"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":468.057,"endTime":470.022,"body":"economics. And so I decided to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":470.022,"endTime":471.987,"body":"study"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":471.992,"endTime":474.927,"body":"that in college. But, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":471.992,"endTime":474.927,"body":"college didn't really agree with"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":474.932,"endTime":478.286,"body":"me for mental health reasons."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":474.932,"endTime":478.286,"body":"And so I dropped out and I was"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":478.286,"endTime":481.317,"body":"working actually on a loading"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":478.286,"endTime":481.317,"body":"dock. Cuz I had a- a CDL, like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":481.322,"endTime":484.137,"body":"a truck license, but I couldn't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":481.322,"endTime":484.137,"body":"find a job driving a truck. So I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":484.137,"endTime":486.627,"body":"got a job loading the trucks. It"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":484.137,"endTime":486.627,"body":"was the middle of the- it was in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":486.632,"endTime":487.799,"body":"the middle of the night. It was,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":486.632,"endTime":487.799,"body":"you know, I learned a lot on"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":487.799,"endTime":488.966,"body":"that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":488.966,"endTime":492.776,"body":"job about hard work. But, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":488.966,"endTime":492.776,"body":"know, it wasn't really what I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":492.776,"endTime":496.586,"body":"wanted to do long term. And a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":492.776,"endTime":496.586,"body":"friend of mine who I met in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":496.586,"endTime":499.0,"body":"college was like, \"Hey, do you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":496.586,"endTime":499.0,"body":"wanna be a software engineer?\""},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":499.0,"endTime":501.0,"body":"So, I mean, this is kind of the-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":499.0,"endTime":501.0,"body":"the height of privilege, right?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":501.0,"endTime":504.0,"body":"It's like someone just offers"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":501.0,"endTime":504.0,"body":"you a job and you don't have to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":504.0,"endTime":507.3,"body":"apply. And, you know, like, I-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":504.0,"endTime":507.3,"body":"I- I feel for everybody these"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":507.3,"endTime":510.0,"body":"days who is looking for a job as"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":507.3,"endTime":510.0,"body":"a software engineer and really"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":510.0,"endTime":510.716,"body":"kind of has"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":510.716,"endTime":513.626,"body":"to look, and look, and look. You"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":510.716,"endTime":513.626,"body":"know, for me it just fell in my"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":513.631,"endTime":516.417,"body":"lap even when I wasn't looking"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":513.631,"endTime":516.417,"body":"for it. So, a lot of privilege"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":517.287,"endTime":520.136,"body":"there. And, yeah, so, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":517.287,"endTime":520.136,"body":"I started off doing that job. It"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":520.136,"endTime":521.741,"body":"was like a government"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":520.136,"endTime":521.741,"body":"contracting job. I actually"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":521.741,"endTime":523.346,"body":"really enjoyed"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":523.346,"endTime":526.466,"body":"it. I remember the first problem"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":523.346,"endTime":526.466,"body":"I solved, which was putting a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":526.466,"endTime":529.3,"body":"ClickHandler on a button"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":526.466,"endTime":529.3,"body":"[chuckles]. And, you know, I- I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":529.3,"endTime":530.3,"body":"solved it sort of the --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":530.3,"endTime":533.277,"body":"I put- put it in the HTML as,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":530.3,"endTime":533.277,"body":"like, text, which is, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":533.636,"endTime":535.286,"body":"not how you even did it back"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":533.636,"endTime":535.286,"body":"then with jQuery and stuff like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":535.286,"endTime":536.936,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":537.581,"endTime":541.991,"body":"This was back in 2009. And yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":537.581,"endTime":541.991,"body":"so I didn't even solve it"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":541.991,"endTime":544.331,"body":"kind of the right way, but the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":541.991,"endTime":544.331,"body":"elation of having solved a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":544.331,"endTime":547.241,"body":"problem was huge and I kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":544.331,"endTime":547.241,"body":"tried to stay close to that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":547.241,"endTime":550.032,"body":"feeling. Kind of like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":547.241,"endTime":550.032,"body":"with switching the bit in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":550.037,"endTime":552.221,"body":"the save game file, just trying"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":550.037,"endTime":552.221,"body":"to stay close to that feeling"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":552.221,"endTime":558.581,"body":"throughout my career. And, so I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":552.221,"endTime":558.581,"body":"did that for about four years."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":558.672,"endTime":561.011,"body":"You know, my boss was like, \"I'm"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":558.672,"endTime":561.011,"body":"not gonna pay you anymore than"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":561.017,"endTime":562.991,"body":"you're making now.\" And I was"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":561.017,"endTime":562.991,"body":"like, \"Well, I could make more"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":562.991,"endTime":564.7,"body":"money.\" So I went to another"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":562.991,"endTime":564.7,"body":"job-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":564.7,"endTime":565.0,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":566.0,"endTime":567.912,"body":"-a private sector job, cuz"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":567.912,"endTime":569.316,"body":"the first job was a government"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":567.912,"endTime":569.316,"body":"contracting job. And, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":569.316,"endTime":570.72,"body":"I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":570.721,"endTime":574.111,"body":"enjoyed that too. You know, it's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":570.721,"endTime":574.111,"body":"-- it was in DC. It's not, like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":574.111,"endTime":577.201,"body":"a big market. So the company"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":574.111,"endTime":577.201,"body":"that I worked for was a little"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":577.201,"endTime":580.0,"body":"bit, you know, janky, I would"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":577.201,"endTime":580.0,"body":"say. Kinda like the first one."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":580.0,"endTime":582.182,"body":"But I learned a lot at that job."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":580.0,"endTime":582.182,"body":"I worked with a lot of great"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":582.182,"endTime":585.331,"body":"engineers, learned a lot about"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":582.182,"endTime":585.331,"body":"what I didn't want in a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":585.331,"endTime":589.201,"body":"job. And at the same time, I- I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":585.331,"endTime":589.201,"body":"went to a meetup for General"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":589.201,"endTime":592.062,"body":"Assembly, and they asked me,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":589.201,"endTime":592.062,"body":"\"Hey.\" Someone just came up and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":592.062,"endTime":592.917,"body":"said, \"Hey, do you wanna be a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":592.062,"endTime":592.917,"body":"teacher?\" And I immediately"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":592.917,"endTime":593.772,"body":"said,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":593.772,"endTime":596.741,"body":"\"Yes.\" It's something I hadn't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":593.772,"endTime":596.741,"body":"really thought about, but I was"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":596.741,"endTime":599.412,"body":"always on Stack Overflow, just"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":596.741,"endTime":599.412,"body":"kind of answering questions and-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":600.042,"endTime":602.471,"body":"and so, it just was an immediate"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":600.042,"endTime":602.471,"body":"yes for me. Like, I just kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":602.471,"endTime":603.986,"body":"-- it blurred outta my mouth,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":602.471,"endTime":603.986,"body":"you know? Like joy, without me"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":603.986,"endTime":605.501,"body":"even"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":605.501,"endTime":609.971,"body":"thinking about it. And, yeah, so"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":605.501,"endTime":609.971,"body":"I- I did some teaching at"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":609.971,"endTime":611.441,"body":"General Assembly, and that was"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":609.971,"endTime":611.441,"body":"sort of the end of my"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":611.441,"endTime":612.911,"body":"programming"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":612.912,"endTime":614.217,"body":"career, even though it lasted"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":612.912,"endTime":614.217,"body":"for another seven years or"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":614.217,"endTime":615.522,"body":"something."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":616.062,"endTime":618.971,"body":"Actually, I don't know how long,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":616.062,"endTime":618.971,"body":"but it lasted for a long"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":618.971,"endTime":620.606,"body":"time after that, even though I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":618.971,"endTime":620.606,"body":"decide -- I decided at that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":620.606,"endTime":622.241,"body":"point"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":622.241,"endTime":625.572,"body":"that I wanted to solve human"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":622.241,"endTime":625.572,"body":"problems in software, and not"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":625.572,"endTime":628.121,"body":"so much solve the- the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":625.572,"endTime":628.121,"body":"programming problems. But I kept"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":628.302,"endTime":631.812,"body":"grinding at it for many years,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":628.302,"endTime":631.812,"body":"moved to New York, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":631.812,"endTime":636.027,"body":"continued to teach at a company"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":631.812,"endTime":636.027,"body":"called Thankful. Just worked"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":636.027,"endTime":639.177,"body":"at Squarespace first, and then"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":636.027,"endTime":639.177,"body":"Dropbox, and then eventually"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":639.177,"endTime":640.961,"body":"just, you know, kind of burnt"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":639.177,"endTime":640.961,"body":"out on development. Cuz again,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":640.961,"endTime":642.745,"body":"I-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":642.746,"endTime":645.027,"body":"I kind of had already found"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":642.746,"endTime":645.027,"body":"something in my calling a little"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":645.027,"endTime":649.496,"body":"bit, in something else related."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":645.027,"endTime":649.496,"body":"And so now I work as a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":649.496,"endTime":652.557,"body":"consultant. And I guess we can"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":649.496,"endTime":652.557,"body":"talk about that. But, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":652.557,"endTime":656.486,"body":"it's, you know, what I'm trying"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":652.557,"endTime":656.486,"body":"to do is help teams be more"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":656.486,"endTime":661.542,"body":"knowledgeable and more"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":656.486,"endTime":661.542,"body":"productive, and deliver kind"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":661.542,"endTime":664.272,"body":"of on a promise of quality, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":661.542,"endTime":664.272,"body":"know, and- and-, and timelines."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":664.721,"endTime":666.822,"body":"So that's what I'm trying to do"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":664.721,"endTime":666.822,"body":"as a consultant. But that was"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":666.822,"endTime":670.481,"body":"sort of an evolution from"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":666.822,"endTime":670.481,"body":"teaching. You know, from"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":670.481,"endTime":673.902,"body":"teaching and- and solving human"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":670.481,"endTime":673.902,"body":"problems. So that kind of brings"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":673.902,"endTime":675.881,"body":"me to where I'm at today. And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":673.902,"endTime":675.881,"body":"then, you know, of course I'm in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":675.881,"endTime":679.331,"body":"VC, which is a wonderful"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":675.881,"endTime":679.331,"body":"community. And that's been a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":679.331,"endTime":683.052,"body":"source of great joy for me. And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":679.331,"endTime":683.052,"body":"you'll make other communities"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":683.052,"endTime":684.672,"body":"that I'm in, but this is kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":683.052,"endTime":684.672,"body":"the main one that I- I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":684.672,"endTime":686.292,"body":"appreciate"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":686.292,"endTime":688.032,"body":"the most. So yeah, that's kind"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":686.292,"endTime":688.032,"body":"of where I'm at today."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":689.106,"endTime":690.996,"body":"We're the- we're the best"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":689.106,"endTime":690.996,"body":"one, obviously. So --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":691.317,"endTime":696.0,"body":"Well, the most welcoming,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":691.317,"endTime":696.0,"body":"right? [All laugh] The most"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":696.0,"endTime":696.417,"body":"welcoming tech"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":696.417,"endTime":698.996,"body":"community. I've started to get"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":696.417,"endTime":698.996,"body":"the invite, so I'm really happy"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":699.001,"endTime":701.697,"body":"about that. I hope we can"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":699.001,"endTime":701.697,"body":"continue to expand at a- at a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":701.701,"endTime":703.0,"body":"measured rate-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":703.0,"endTime":703.3,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":703.3,"endTime":705.596,"body":"-with, you know, people"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":703.3,"endTime":705.596,"body":"who are aligned with the vision."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":706.662,"endTime":709.902,"body":"Yeah. That's been so fun to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":706.662,"endTime":709.902,"body":"have new people back, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":710.052,"endTime":711.942,"body":"coming back in. It's been- it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":710.052,"endTime":711.942,"body":"been fun."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":711.5,"endTime":711.7,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":712.7,"endTime":713.7,"body":"Well, Ryan, thank you for-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":713.0,"endTime":714.7,"body":"Yeah, I'd like someone --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":713.0,"endTime":714.7,"body":"go ahead, go ahead."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":714.7,"endTime":716.0,"body":"-oh, go ahead. I was just"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":714.7,"endTime":716.0,"body":"gonna say thank you for-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":715.7,"endTime":716.3,"body":"I said --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":716.7,"endTime":718.0,"body":"-that story, but --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":718.346,"endTime":720.687,"body":"Yeah. Okay. Sure. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":718.346,"endTime":720.687,"body":"Yeah. It's- it's- it's a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":720.687,"endTime":723.836,"body":"story that has other parts to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":720.687,"endTime":723.836,"body":"it, of course. It's hard to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":723.836,"endTime":727.167,"body":"kind of like capture a -- the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":723.836,"endTime":727.167,"body":"multidimensional nature of human"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":727.167,"endTime":731.126,"body":"beings in a- in a short blurb."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":727.167,"endTime":731.126,"body":"But yeah, happy to talk more"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":731.126,"endTime":732.297,"body":"about it as we go forward."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":733.076,"endTime":737.5,"body":"Was there a moment in --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":733.076,"endTime":737.5,"body":"when you were teaching, that you"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":737.5,"endTime":741.7,"body":"really felt, \"This is what I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":737.5,"endTime":741.7,"body":"wanna be doing,\" or do you think"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":741.7,"endTime":745.736,"body":"the whole experience just kind"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":741.7,"endTime":745.736,"body":"of led you down this path?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":746.802,"endTime":748.812,"body":"Well, there was a moment"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":746.802,"endTime":748.812,"body":"when I was like, \"This is not"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":748.812,"endTime":751.731,"body":"what I wanna do,\" right in the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":748.812,"endTime":751.731,"body":"beginning. You know, I taught"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":751.731,"endTime":754.822,"body":"HTM- I taught a front-end course"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":751.731,"endTime":754.822,"body":"at General Assembly, and, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":754.822,"endTime":757.0,"body":"know, I taught HTML and it was"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":754.822,"endTime":757.0,"body":"great. I was like, \"Oh, my god."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":757.0,"endTime":759.7,"body":"I'm such a good teacher, people"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":757.0,"endTime":759.7,"body":"love me, I'm getting great"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":759.7,"endTime":763.3,"body":"reviews. Like, this is what I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":759.7,"endTime":763.3,"body":"wanna do.\" And then we got into"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":763.3,"endTime":766.7,"body":"JavaScript. And to be fair,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":763.3,"endTime":766.7,"body":"there was no curriculum, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":766.7,"endTime":769.5,"body":"know what I mean? Like, this --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":766.7,"endTime":769.5,"body":"they just opened this office and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":769.5,"endTime":771.5,"body":"General Assembly was rather — I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":769.5,"endTime":771.5,"body":"don't know how young it was —"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":771.5,"endTime":774.836,"body":"but it seemed pretty- pretty"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":771.5,"endTime":774.836,"body":"startup-y. And so, there was no"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":774.836,"endTime":778.0,"body":"curriculum. So I had to make it"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":774.836,"endTime":778.0,"body":"up as I went. And, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":778.0,"endTime":780.7,"body":"didn't do a good job at that,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":778.0,"endTime":780.7,"body":"initially. It's very tough to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":780.7,"endTime":782.5,"body":"teach JavaScript. And so-"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":782.5,"endTime":782.7,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":783.0,"endTime":785.5,"body":"-[chuckles] I got all"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":783.0,"endTime":785.5,"body":"these bad reviews."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":785.5,"endTime":788.126,"body":"People love me, still, cuz I'm"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":785.5,"endTime":788.126,"body":"like a nice person, but they"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":788.126,"endTime":789.791,"body":"were like, \"He's a nice person,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":788.126,"endTime":789.791,"body":"but he's not a good teacher.\""},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":789.791,"endTime":791.456,"body":"And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":791.456,"endTime":794.942,"body":"so that was sort of a lesson for"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":791.456,"endTime":794.942,"body":"me. It's like, okay, prepare how"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":794.942,"endTime":797.971,"body":"do you actually, you know, teach"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":794.942,"endTime":797.971,"body":"really hard material to pe- to a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":797.971,"endTime":801.511,"body":"variety of people? So I learned"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":797.971,"endTime":801.511,"body":"a lot from that. But, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":801.511,"endTime":803.822,"body":"the initial kind of, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":801.511,"endTime":803.822,"body":"wouldn't say high, but the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":803.826,"endTime":808.351,"body":"initial sort of like, joy of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":803.826,"endTime":808.351,"body":"teaching was that first kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":808.351,"endTime":811.591,"body":"semester part of it, the first"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":808.351,"endTime":811.591,"body":"half of the course. And I really"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":811.591,"endTime":812.686,"body":"enjoyed that. And that kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":811.591,"endTime":812.686,"body":"carried me through even the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":812.686,"endTime":813.781,"body":"tough"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":813.782,"endTime":818.162,"body":"time of like, you know, not"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":813.782,"endTime":818.162,"body":"doing well. But I also realized"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":818.162,"endTime":820.442,"body":"from that, that I wanted to do"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":818.162,"endTime":820.442,"body":"individualized mentorship more"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":820.442,"endTime":823.976,"body":"than I wanted to do teaching in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":820.442,"endTime":823.976,"body":"general, you know? And I still"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":823.976,"endTime":827.277,"body":"kind of struggle whether I wanna"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":823.976,"endTime":827.277,"body":"do conference talks or -- cuz I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":827.277,"endTime":829.527,"body":"do like what I can do in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":827.277,"endTime":829.527,"body":"conversation rather than what I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":829.527,"endTime":832.976,"body":"do in kind of multiplexing, if"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":829.527,"endTime":832.976,"body":"you will, to a bunch of people."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":833.547,"endTime":834.912,"body":"So yeah, I think teaching is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":833.547,"endTime":834.912,"body":"great. I do enjoy kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":834.912,"endTime":836.277,"body":"getting"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":836.277,"endTime":837.537,"body":"up in front of people actually"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":836.277,"endTime":837.537,"body":"in the- the kind of nervousness"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":837.537,"endTime":838.797,"body":"of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":838.797,"endTime":841.886,"body":"that. And -- but I do enjoy the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":838.797,"endTime":841.886,"body":"individualized mentorship better"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":841.886,"endTime":844.3,"body":"and that's kind of where I- I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":841.886,"endTime":844.3,"body":"think I shine, is pair"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":844.3,"endTime":847.256,"body":"programming and, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":844.3,"endTime":847.256,"body":"conversations. So ... yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":849.287,"endTime":853.647,"body":"Yeah. That's- that's really"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":849.287,"endTime":853.647,"body":"cool. I was- I was -- well, I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":853.647,"endTime":856.287,"body":"think that's actually the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":853.647,"endTime":856.287,"body":"answer. But I was gonna ask, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":856.287,"endTime":857.937,"body":"know, you talked -- when you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":856.287,"endTime":857.937,"body":"were talking about before you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":857.937,"endTime":861.567,"body":"were teaching, that feeling,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":857.937,"endTime":861.567,"body":"right? The feeling fixing the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":861.567,"endTime":862.7,"body":"game or-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":862.7,"endTime":863.0,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":863.0,"endTime":865.0,"body":"-adding the ClickHandler,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":863.0,"endTime":865.0,"body":"right? You were talking about"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":865.0,"endTime":867.116,"body":"staying close to that feeling,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":865.0,"endTime":867.116,"body":"which I -- which is, I-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":867.476,"endTime":870.956,"body":"I turn a phrase that I love and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":867.476,"endTime":870.956,"body":"also something that I've sort of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":872.037,"endTime":874.407,"body":"un- you know, unintentionally or"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":872.037,"endTime":874.407,"body":"intentionally, sometimes, try to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":874.407,"endTime":877.167,"body":"do, throughout my career. But"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":874.407,"endTime":877.167,"body":"my- my question was going to be"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":877.167,"endTime":879.297,"body":"like, how do you stay close to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":877.167,"endTime":879.297,"body":"that feeling when you're not-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":879.417,"endTime":882.0,"body":"when you're not solving"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":879.417,"endTime":882.0,"body":"technical computer problems"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":882.0,"endTime":883.0,"body":"anymore, right? How --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":883.0,"endTime":886.422,"body":"like, what- like, what are ways"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":883.0,"endTime":886.422,"body":"that you can -- that you do"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":886.422,"endTime":888.761,"body":"stay close to that? Because I- I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":886.422,"endTime":888.761,"body":"imagine you do, but it's just a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":888.767,"endTime":890.591,"body":"little bit different. And so, I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":888.767,"endTime":890.591,"body":"was wondering if you talk a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":890.591,"endTime":894.192,"body":"little bit about like how you --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":890.591,"endTime":894.192,"body":"or if you've thought about"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":894.197,"endTime":896.231,"body":"that at all [laughs]. How you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":894.197,"endTime":896.231,"body":"stay close to that feeling now?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":895.5,"endTime":896.0,"body":"I have. I have. I think-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":896.0,"endTime":896.3,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":896.3,"endTime":898.0,"body":"-about it all the time"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":896.3,"endTime":898.0,"body":"actually [laughs]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":898.5,"endTime":899.0,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":899.096,"endTime":902.756,"body":"Well, for me, it's the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":899.096,"endTime":902.756,"body":"concept, you know? There's a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":902.756,"endTime":905.216,"body":"Buddhist teacher named Suzuki"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":902.756,"endTime":905.216,"body":"Roshi who had a great phrase,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":905.216,"endTime":907.0,"body":"which is 'In the beginner's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":905.216,"endTime":907.0,"body":"mind, there are many"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":907.0,"endTime":907.466,"body":"possibilities, and in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":907.466,"endTime":911.397,"body":"the experts mind, there are a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":907.466,"endTime":911.397,"body":"few.' And so I- I just"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":911.397,"endTime":914.711,"body":"remember the beginner's mind. I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":911.397,"endTime":914.711,"body":"try to remember that I don't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":914.711,"endTime":916.406,"body":"know, basically, anything. You"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":914.711,"endTime":916.406,"body":"know what I mean? Like, you've"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":916.406,"endTime":918.101,"body":"had"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":918.101,"endTime":921.552,"body":"experience with things, you've"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":918.101,"endTime":921.552,"body":"seen some problems, but every"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":921.552,"endTime":925.001,"body":"problem you solve is totally"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":921.552,"endTime":925.001,"body":"new. It's, you know, it's like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":925.001,"endTime":929.0,"body":"it's some new combination, some"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":925.001,"endTime":929.0,"body":"new context, some new outcome"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":929.0,"endTime":932.216,"body":"you're trying to achieve, some"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":929.0,"endTime":932.216,"body":"new technologies. And so I try"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":932.216,"endTime":935.606,"body":"to stay close to beginner's mind"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":932.216,"endTime":935.606,"body":"as much as I can by reminding"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":935.606,"endTime":940.317,"body":"myself that I don't know, and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":935.606,"endTime":940.317,"body":"going from that sort of area"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":940.317,"endTime":944.096,"body":"of possibility rather than sort"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":940.317,"endTime":944.096,"body":"of the preconceived notions. And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":944.096,"endTime":948.807,"body":"so in my current work, I try to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":944.096,"endTime":948.807,"body":"work with companies that want to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":948.807,"endTime":952.317,"body":"hire junior developers. I think"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":948.807,"endTime":952.317,"body":"that's sort of the -- I'd"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":952.317,"endTime":955.076,"body":"rather work with companies that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":952.317,"endTime":955.076,"body":"are trying to integrate juniors"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":955.076,"endTime":957.716,"body":"rather than companies that are"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":955.076,"endTime":957.716,"body":"obsessed with, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":957.716,"endTime":961.106,"body":"seniority. And the reason for"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":957.716,"endTime":961.106,"body":"that is that helps me stay close"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":961.111,"endTime":965.067,"body":"to beginner's mind by working"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":961.111,"endTime":965.067,"body":"with beginners. You see the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":965.067,"endTime":968.652,"body":"kind of endless possibilities in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":965.067,"endTime":968.652,"body":"their mind. As they create"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":968.652,"endTime":971.682,"body":"sort of quote, unquote bad code,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":968.652,"endTime":971.682,"body":"it's like -- that's actually"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":971.682,"endTime":974.142,"body":"creative code. It's creative"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":971.682,"endTime":974.142,"body":"problem solving. It's not like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":974.142,"endTime":975.491,"body":"they're just wrote -- writing"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":974.142,"endTime":975.491,"body":"down something they already"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":975.491,"endTime":976.84,"body":"know."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":976.841,"endTime":979.751,"body":"They're really trying to solve a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":976.841,"endTime":979.751,"body":"problem from a standpoint of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":979.756,"endTime":984.116,"body":"possibilities. And so, yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":979.756,"endTime":984.116,"body":"think working with beginners is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":984.116,"endTime":986.096,"body":"how I stay close to that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":984.116,"endTime":986.096,"body":"feeling. In addition to kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":986.096,"endTime":989.126,"body":"cultivating it in my own mind, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":986.096,"endTime":989.126,"body":"try to experience it through the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":989.126,"endTime":992.907,"body":"minds of actual, you know- you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":989.126,"endTime":992.907,"body":"know, beginners. So yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":992.912,"endTime":994.229,"body":"think that's- that's kind of the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":992.912,"endTime":994.229,"body":"answer is, I- I try to stay"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":994.229,"endTime":995.546,"body":"close"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":995.547,"endTime":998.397,"body":"to that feeling and then that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":995.547,"endTime":998.397,"body":"allows me that excitement when"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":998.397,"endTime":1000.976,"body":"other people solve problems."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":998.397,"endTime":1000.976,"body":"When it clicks for other people."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1001.726,"endTime":1003.046,"body":"That's where, like, it clicks"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1001.726,"endTime":1003.046,"body":"for me too, you know? It's like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1003.046,"endTime":1004.366,"body":"I- I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1004.366,"endTime":1005.431,"body":"don't know that I could do it. I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1004.366,"endTime":1005.431,"body":"mean, I, you know, if I'm"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1005.431,"endTime":1006.496,"body":"solving"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1006.496,"endTime":1009.496,"body":"a problem myself, some sort of,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1006.496,"endTime":1009.496,"body":"you know, big scope problem as"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1009.501,"endTime":1011.897,"body":"you get when you're more"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1009.501,"endTime":1011.897,"body":"experienced, there's clicks for,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1011.897,"endTime":1014.596,"body":"you know, it clicks for me too."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1011.897,"endTime":1014.596,"body":"And I get that- that feeling of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1014.596,"endTime":1017.0,"body":"like, \"Oh, it works,\" you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1014.596,"endTime":1017.0,"body":"\"There's no errors.\" Or, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1017.0,"endTime":1020.0,"body":"know, the TypeScript compiler"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1017.0,"endTime":1020.0,"body":"says, \"Go ahead,\" you know?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1020.0,"endTime":1023.0,"body":"That's- that's good stuff. But I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1020.0,"endTime":1023.0,"body":"do love feeling it click or"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1023.0,"endTime":1026.987,"body":"seeing it click beginners, and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1023.0,"endTime":1026.987,"body":"kind of experiencing that joy"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1027.076,"endTime":1027.356,"body":"secondhand."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1029.221,"endTime":1033.451,"body":"That's awesome. That's very"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1029.221,"endTime":1033.451,"body":"cool. Like, being able to stay"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1033.451,"endTime":1035.791,"body":"close that feeling, right? By"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1033.451,"endTime":1035.791,"body":"sharing it with other people,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1035.791,"endTime":1036.5,"body":"you know? I-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1036.5,"endTime":1038.0,"body":"Well, it's the best way"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1036.5,"endTime":1038.0,"body":"[unintelligible]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1037.0,"endTime":1039.362,"body":"-before I ask this question"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1037.0,"endTime":1039.362,"body":"-- yeah, yeah. Totally."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1039.366,"endTime":1042.001,"body":"Totally. You know, and you had-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1039.366,"endTime":1042.001,"body":"you had started talking about --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1042.001,"endTime":1046.3,"body":"on how you, like, doing more"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1042.001,"endTime":1046.3,"body":"one-on-one, you know, pairing"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1046.3,"endTime":1046.711,"body":"stuff like"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1046.711,"endTime":1049.261,"body":"that, with people, and I imagine"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1046.711,"endTime":1049.261,"body":"that's -- it becomes a lot"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1049.261,"endTime":1052.5,"body":"easier to do that, right? To-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1049.261,"endTime":1052.5,"body":"to- to share in the experience"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1052.5,"endTime":1052.771,"body":"when you --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1052.951,"endTime":1056.852,"body":"when it's a more intimate, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1052.951,"endTime":1056.852,"body":"know, learning situation, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1056.912,"endTime":1059.461,"body":"With one, you know, one-on-one"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1056.912,"endTime":1059.461,"body":"sort of thing, instead of, like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1059.491,"endTime":1061.0,"body":"teaching a class, for instance."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1061.0,"endTime":1061.5,"body":"It's true."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1061.5,"endTime":1063.7,"body":"How it's easier to- easier"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1061.5,"endTime":1063.7,"body":"to close to that feeling"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1063.7,"endTime":1064.0,"body":"[chuckles]."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1062.596,"endTime":1065.717,"body":"Also I've found that --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1062.596,"endTime":1065.717,"body":"exactly. And also I've found"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1065.717,"endTime":1068.626,"body":"that -- I mean, this is an ADD"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1065.717,"endTime":1068.626,"body":"trait. But, like, if you tell me"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1068.626,"endTime":1070.757,"body":"to go off and do something, if"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1068.626,"endTime":1070.757,"body":"I'm not interested in it, I'm"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1070.761,"endTime":1074.386,"body":"not gonna do it [chuckles]. And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1070.761,"endTime":1074.386,"body":"so, like, that's why freelancing"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1074.386,"endTime":1074.481,"body":"[unintelligible] --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1074.481,"endTime":1074.761,"body":"Hm. I dunno if I think"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1074.481,"endTime":1074.761,"body":"about that [all laugh]."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1075.797,"endTime":1078.7,"body":"Well, yeah, exactly. So,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1075.797,"endTime":1078.7,"body":"you know, it's- it's tough for"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1078.7,"endTime":1082.0,"body":"me to kind of do programming on"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1078.7,"endTime":1082.0,"body":"my own. And I've found that,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1082.0,"endTime":1086.0,"body":"like, if someone else holds the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1082.0,"endTime":1086.0,"body":"focus, like in pair programming,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1086.0,"endTime":1088.067,"body":"or if it -- if"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1088.067,"endTime":1090.616,"body":"it's something I can do in the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1088.067,"endTime":1090.616,"body":"context of a meeting, you know?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1090.616,"endTime":1093.977,"body":"Like, I just kind of go in, I do"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1090.616,"endTime":1093.977,"body":"the meeting, I come out, I go"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1093.977,"endTime":1095.536,"body":"back to my life. Like, that is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1093.977,"endTime":1095.536,"body":"actually where I do my best"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1095.536,"endTime":1097.095,"body":"work,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1097.096,"endTime":1099.557,"body":"is something I can do in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1097.096,"endTime":1099.557,"body":"conversation, in- in- in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1099.557,"endTime":1101.221,"body":"collaboration. Where someone"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1099.557,"endTime":1101.221,"body":"else holds the focus, I can do"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1101.221,"endTime":1102.885,"body":"the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1102.886,"endTime":1105.856,"body":"best work. But, so that's sort"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1102.886,"endTime":1105.856,"body":"of another thing about knowing"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1105.856,"endTime":1110.146,"body":"myself, right? It's like knowing"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1105.856,"endTime":1110.146,"body":"where I work best and not trying"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1110.146,"endTime":1112.997,"body":"to, like, fit into someone"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1110.146,"endTime":1112.997,"body":"else's life as a- as a software"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1112.997,"endTime":1116.2,"body":"developer, you know? So, and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1112.997,"endTime":1116.2,"body":"also trying -- it took me a long"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1116.2,"endTime":1116.416,"body":"time to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1116.416,"endTime":1120.656,"body":"kind of release myself from the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1116.416,"endTime":1120.656,"body":"view I had of being a software"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1120.656,"endTime":1125.037,"body":"developer, cuz it was such a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1120.656,"endTime":1125.037,"body":"part of my identity. And so"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1125.037,"endTime":1127.0,"body":"it's- it's tough, like, to say,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1125.037,"endTime":1127.0,"body":"like, you know, to give that up"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1127.0,"endTime":1127.616,"body":"to say, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1127.616,"endTime":1129.356,"body":"know, I don't wanna be a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1127.616,"endTime":1129.356,"body":"software developer so much"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1129.356,"endTime":1131.096,"body":"anymore, as"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1131.096,"endTime":1133.436,"body":"much as I wanna help other"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1131.096,"endTime":1133.436,"body":"software developers. Like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1133.436,"endTime":1137.0,"body":"that's a -- it was a mind"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1133.436,"endTime":1137.0,"body":"bending thing, you know? Cuz I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1137.0,"endTime":1137.696,"body":"was so used to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1137.696,"endTime":1138.911,"body":"seeing, you know, to- to telling"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1137.696,"endTime":1138.911,"body":"people I was a software"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1138.911,"endTime":1140.126,"body":"engineer."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1140.126,"endTime":1143.277,"body":"I still do sometimes cuz it's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1140.126,"endTime":1143.277,"body":"much easier than explaining what"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1143.277,"endTime":1145.436,"body":"I try to do, you know, if I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1143.277,"endTime":1145.436,"body":"don't really wanna have the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1145.436,"endTime":1147.916,"body":"conversation. If it's just some-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1145.436,"endTime":1147.916,"body":"somebody doesn't know the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1147.916,"endTime":1150.3,"body":"difference anyway. I'll just"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1147.916,"endTime":1150.3,"body":"say, \"Oh, I'm a software"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1150.3,"endTime":1153.0,"body":"engineer.\" But it's still true."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1150.3,"endTime":1153.0,"body":"I do a lot of engineering on my"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1153.0,"endTime":1155.3,"body":"own. But, yeah, pair"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1153.0,"endTime":1155.3,"body":"programming, things I can do in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1155.3,"endTime":1156.916,"body":"conversation, is where I really"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1155.3,"endTime":1156.916,"body":"shine."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1158.372,"endTime":1160.981,"body":"So when you're working"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1158.372,"endTime":1160.981,"body":"with teams, how do you kind of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1160.981,"endTime":1165.481,"body":"transfer that same energy to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1160.981,"endTime":1165.481,"body":"teaching within a team, or what"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1165.481,"endTime":1168.662,"body":"do you think the role is and how"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1165.481,"endTime":1168.662,"body":"that's translated from your"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1168.662,"endTime":1170.031,"body":"experience to what you're doing"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1168.662,"endTime":1170.031,"body":"now?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1171.257,"endTime":1172.201,"body":"Well, I mean, first you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1171.257,"endTime":1172.201,"body":"have to know the team, right?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1172.201,"endTime":1173.145,"body":"You"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1173.146,"endTime":1174.166,"body":"have to kinda know what their"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1173.146,"endTime":1174.166,"body":"individual problems are. You"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1174.166,"endTime":1175.186,"body":"have"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1175.186,"endTime":1178.126,"body":"to talk to them. And so, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1175.186,"endTime":1178.126,"body":"know, I- I start with like an"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1178.132,"endTime":1181.906,"body":"audit, where I go in and kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1178.132,"endTime":1181.906,"body":"identify the pain points for"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1181.906,"endTime":1185.0,"body":"people. So that way, when I go"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1181.906,"endTime":1185.0,"body":"pair with people, I know them."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1185.0,"endTime":1185.281,"body":"And I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1185.281,"endTime":1188.132,"body":"know the kind of what they're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1185.281,"endTime":1188.132,"body":"working on. I know where they're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1188.132,"endTime":1192.422,"body":"struggling. So yeah, I think"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1188.132,"endTime":1192.422,"body":"that, yeah, knowing- knowing"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1192.422,"endTime":1194.701,"body":"people, knowing the people on"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1192.422,"endTime":1194.701,"body":"the team is kind of the most"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1194.701,"endTime":1197.221,"body":"important thing, and being"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1194.701,"endTime":1197.221,"body":"personal. You know, I don't --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1197.281,"endTime":1199.7,"body":"I'm not writing a book, right"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1197.281,"endTime":1199.7,"body":"[chuckles]? I'm not writing a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1199.7,"endTime":1200.162,"body":"book on how to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1200.162,"endTime":1201.331,"body":"solve all the problems. If I was"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1200.162,"endTime":1201.331,"body":"doing that, I mean, that would"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1201.331,"endTime":1202.5,"body":"be"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1202.531,"endTime":1204.811,"body":"great too. But it's like I'm"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1202.531,"endTime":1204.811,"body":"really creating an"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1204.811,"endTime":1209.146,"body":"individualized plan for people"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1204.811,"endTime":1209.146,"body":"and companies as well, you know?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1209.152,"endTime":1211.547,"body":"There's a plan for the team."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1209.152,"endTime":1211.547,"body":"There's also a plan for"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1211.547,"endTime":1215.176,"body":"individual pe- individual people"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1211.547,"endTime":1215.176,"body":"for how to improve, how to-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1215.237,"endTime":1218.477,"body":"to do better. So, yeah. I think"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1215.237,"endTime":1218.477,"body":"I've actually forgot what"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1218.477,"endTime":1221.086,"body":"the- what the feeling was you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1218.477,"endTime":1221.086,"body":"were asking about, but I think"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1221.092,"endTime":1223.727,"body":"that's sort of maybe an answer."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1221.092,"endTime":1223.727,"body":"I mean, if you- if you have a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1223.731,"endTime":1226.636,"body":"follow up, I mean, maybe I can"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1223.731,"endTime":1226.636,"body":"get back on track. But that was"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1226.636,"endTime":1227.717,"body":"the first thing that came to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1226.636,"endTime":1227.717,"body":"mind [laughs]."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1229.487,"endTime":1231.091,"body":"Yeah. Well, I mean, it's"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1229.487,"endTime":1231.091,"body":"a hard balance transitioning"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1231.091,"endTime":1232.695,"body":"from"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1232.696,"endTime":1235.3,"body":"doing like one-on-one mentorship"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1232.696,"endTime":1235.3,"body":"and teaching-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1235.0,"endTime":1235.5,"body":"Oh, yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1235.7,"endTime":1237.497,"body":"-to going inside of a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1237.501,"endTime":1240.707,"body":"team. And I think that idea of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1237.501,"endTime":1240.707,"body":"getting to know people is super"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1240.707,"endTime":1245.5,"body":"important because I- I think"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1240.707,"endTime":1245.5,"body":"that you can be way more"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1245.5,"endTime":1245.957,"body":"effective as"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1245.957,"endTime":1250.156,"body":"a teacher if you do know the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1245.957,"endTime":1250.156,"body":"people in front of you."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1250.287,"endTime":1254.6,"body":"Because, like, I- I think. So"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1250.287,"endTime":1254.6,"body":"much of the time we"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1254.6,"endTime":1254.842,"body":"depersonalize what"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1254.842,"endTime":1258.711,"body":"we're doing or we abstract these"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1254.842,"endTime":1258.711,"body":"concepts out and try to apply"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1258.711,"endTime":1261.8,"body":"them rather than, like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1258.711,"endTime":1261.8,"body":"recognizing, like, there's a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1261.8,"endTime":1262.342,"body":"dynamic group of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1262.342,"endTime":1265.582,"body":"people in front of us and this"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1262.342,"endTime":1265.582,"body":"approach is not going to work"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1265.582,"endTime":1269.211,"body":"unless you have an understanding"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1265.582,"endTime":1269.211,"body":"of who those human beings are."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1269.217,"endTime":1273.007,"body":"And I think that's, you know,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1269.217,"endTime":1273.007,"body":"having those conversations and"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1273.186,"endTime":1275.9,"body":"the -- like, we do in Virtual"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1273.186,"endTime":1275.9,"body":"Coffee and the breakout rooms"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1275.9,"endTime":1276.186,"body":"makes a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1276.186,"endTime":1280.267,"body":"big difference. And there- there"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1276.186,"endTime":1280.267,"body":"can be a real balance of like"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1280.267,"endTime":1285.727,"body":"trying to have that personal"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1280.267,"endTime":1285.727,"body":"experience, and having empathy,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1285.727,"endTime":1290.287,"body":"and then also teaching in that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1285.727,"endTime":1290.287,"body":"situation. So do you have any"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1290.346,"endTime":1293.136,"body":"strategies for being able to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1290.346,"endTime":1293.136,"body":"balance those things?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1294.707,"endTime":1297.317,"body":"Well, you know, I- I think"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1294.707,"endTime":1297.317,"body":"there's -- I have sort of a view"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1297.317,"endTime":1299.0,"body":"on learning. I mean, I have a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1297.317,"endTime":1299.0,"body":"lot of sound bites, right? That"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1299.0,"endTime":1303.436,"body":"I say over and over again. But,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1299.0,"endTime":1303.436,"body":"you know, my view on learning is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1303.442,"endTime":1306.932,"body":"that a knowledge is that -- it's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1303.442,"endTime":1306.932,"body":"-- there's nobody has the same"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1306.932,"endTime":1310.382,"body":"knowledge. We all think that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1306.932,"endTime":1310.382,"body":"like, \"Oh, I learned React, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1310.382,"endTime":1313.5,"body":"know React, like, we know the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1310.382,"endTime":1313.5,"body":"same thing,\" right? But"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1313.5,"endTime":1314.251,"body":"actually, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1314.251,"endTime":1317.402,"body":"know, the way we really learn is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1314.251,"endTime":1317.402,"body":"by connecting to our experience."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1317.761,"endTime":1319.156,"body":"We have all these analogies that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1317.761,"endTime":1319.156,"body":"are personal, that we use to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1319.156,"endTime":1320.551,"body":"kind"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1320.551,"endTime":1324.061,"body":"of identify and understand"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1320.551,"endTime":1324.061,"body":"problems, understand solutions,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1324.061,"endTime":1325.681,"body":"understand technologies, and so"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1324.061,"endTime":1325.681,"body":"it's really like a 3D space"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1325.681,"endTime":1327.301,"body":"where"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1327.301,"endTime":1328.576,"body":"nobody really overlaps. It's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1327.301,"endTime":1328.576,"body":"like you have this sort of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1328.576,"endTime":1329.851,"body":"bubble of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1329.852,"endTime":1334.0,"body":"knowledge in the- in the problem"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1329.852,"endTime":1334.0,"body":"space. And it's very"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1334.0,"endTime":1334.471,"body":"multidimensional,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1334.477,"endTime":1335.704,"body":"it doesn't overlap with other"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1334.477,"endTime":1335.704,"body":"people, it's centered around"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1335.704,"endTime":1336.931,"body":"you."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1337.622,"endTime":1339.692,"body":"And so I think when you're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1337.622,"endTime":1339.692,"body":"working with a team, it's like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1340.231,"endTime":1342.662,"body":"you have to kinda understand"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1340.231,"endTime":1342.662,"body":"that a team is a collection of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1342.666,"endTime":1346.531,"body":"individuals who have common"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1342.666,"endTime":1346.531,"body":"goals. It's not like a unit."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1346.531,"endTime":1348.721,"body":"Like, you know, in the military"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1346.531,"endTime":1348.721,"body":"or something where everybody"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1348.727,"endTime":1351.031,"body":"just sort of like follows an o-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1348.727,"endTime":1351.031,"body":"I mean, I don't know. I never"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1351.031,"endTime":1353.3,"body":"been in the military. But you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1351.031,"endTime":1353.3,"body":"know, it's like that software"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1353.3,"endTime":1354.511,"body":"team is very much"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1354.511,"endTime":1357.632,"body":"like individual people tackling"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1354.511,"endTime":1357.632,"body":"problems individually. And I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1357.632,"endTime":1361.846,"body":"think that, the other thing is,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1357.632,"endTime":1361.846,"body":"trying to break that cycle and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1361.846,"endTime":1364.517,"body":"improve kind of pairing and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1361.846,"endTime":1364.517,"body":"knowledge sharing between the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1364.517,"endTime":1367.336,"body":"team. Because a lot of times, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1364.517,"endTime":1367.336,"body":"mean, the teams- these teams"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1367.336,"endTime":1370.817,"body":"I've been on, it's like you come"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1367.336,"endTime":1370.817,"body":"in, and people are individually"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1370.817,"endTime":1372.886,"body":"working on problems, your"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1370.817,"endTime":1372.886,"body":"individual productivity,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1372.886,"endTime":1376.396,"body":"everybody's trying to burn down"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1372.886,"endTime":1376.396,"body":"their sprint points. And, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1376.402,"endTime":1378.406,"body":"know, there's not like a lot of,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1376.402,"endTime":1378.406,"body":"you know, some people will come"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1378.406,"endTime":1380.267,"body":"up and ask a question"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1378.406,"endTime":1380.267,"body":"occasionally, but there's not,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1380.957,"endTime":1383.7,"body":"like, teams working together."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1380.957,"endTime":1383.7,"body":"And so I think the- the ultimate"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1383.7,"endTime":1384.3,"body":"thing is I don't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1384.3,"endTime":1387.017,"body":"wanna be there in long term, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1384.3,"endTime":1387.017,"body":"know? I'm not there to, like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1387.017,"endTime":1389.807,"body":"be the teacher forever. My- my"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1387.017,"endTime":1389.807,"body":"goal is to change the team"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1389.807,"endTime":1393.047,"body":"dynamic to make everybody a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1389.807,"endTime":1393.047,"body":"teacher, you know? Make"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1393.047,"endTime":1396.5,"body":"everybody sort of a learner. And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1393.047,"endTime":1396.5,"body":"everybody a mentor, you know?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1396.5,"endTime":1397.186,"body":"Not -- obviously,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1397.186,"endTime":1399.767,"body":"people have different capacities"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1397.186,"endTime":1399.767,"body":"and interests in it. But, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1399.767,"endTime":1402.166,"body":"know, just improving their"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1399.767,"endTime":1402.166,"body":"ability to do it in their own"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1402.166,"endTime":1403.756,"body":"way. I think is kind of -- I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1402.166,"endTime":1403.756,"body":"think that answers your"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1403.756,"endTime":1405.346,"body":"question."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1405.346,"endTime":1407.5,"body":"I always get off on these"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1405.346,"endTime":1407.5,"body":"tangents, but I think that's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1407.5,"endTime":1411.5,"body":"sort of how I approach the team"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1407.5,"endTime":1411.5,"body":"dynamic, is really trying to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1411.5,"endTime":1415.0,"body":"make myself irrelevant"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1411.5,"endTime":1415.0,"body":"[chuckles]. Make myself not"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1415.0,"endTime":1416.507,"body":"necessary in the long term."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1416.777,"endTime":1418.876,"body":"Cuz again, I wanna work in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1416.777,"endTime":1418.876,"body":"limited engagements. It's again,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1418.876,"endTime":1422.086,"body":"an ADD thing. I'm not trying to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1418.876,"endTime":1422.086,"body":"make a year contract with"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1422.092,"endTime":1425.086,"body":"somebody where I'm just, like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1422.092,"endTime":1425.086,"body":"constantly grinding with them."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1425.092,"endTime":1428.3,"body":"It's like -- no, I wanna make"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1425.092,"endTime":1428.3,"body":"them better in a short term,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1428.3,"endTime":1431.3,"body":"in an impactful way. Like you do"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1428.3,"endTime":1431.3,"body":"the- do the judo move where you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1431.3,"endTime":1436.126,"body":"just sort of like come in and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1431.3,"endTime":1436.126,"body":"flip things around and leave,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1436.126,"endTime":1438.7,"body":"you know [chuckles]? That's kind"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1436.126,"endTime":1438.7,"body":"of my ultimate goal. Is not to-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1438.7,"endTime":1439.846,"body":"not to be -- to make people"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1439.846,"endTime":1442.067,"body":"dependent on me, to make people"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1439.846,"endTime":1442.067,"body":"self-sufficient."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1443.207,"endTime":1446.146,"body":"I think that's great and"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1443.207,"endTime":1446.146,"body":"I think that one of the biggest"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1446.146,"endTime":1453.616,"body":"things that I see or hear in the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1446.146,"endTime":1453.616,"body":"industry is it kind of takes a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1453.616,"endTime":1458.267,"body":"breaking point to bring somebody"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1453.616,"endTime":1458.267,"body":"in to rectify communication and"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1458.267,"endTime":1462.7,"body":"team ... I don't know what the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1458.267,"endTime":1462.7,"body":"right word is."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1462.7,"endTime":1463.5,"body":"Dynamics? Or --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1464.5,"endTime":1465.436,"body":"What would you -- what"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1464.5,"endTime":1465.436,"body":"did you say?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1465.3,"endTime":1467.7,"body":"Effectiveness? A dynamics,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1465.3,"endTime":1467.7,"body":"effectiveness --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1465.7,"endTime":1468.0,"body":"Yeah. Team effectiveness,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1465.7,"endTime":1468.0,"body":"dynamics."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1468.0,"endTime":1469.3,"body":"Yeah. Proactivities"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1468.0,"endTime":1469.3,"body":"something."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1468.5,"endTime":1470.537,"body":"You know, people wait"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1468.5,"endTime":1470.537,"body":"until there's a problem. And"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1470.537,"endTime":1476.747,"body":"I feel like bringing someone in"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1470.537,"endTime":1476.747,"body":"very early on can reduce"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1476.751,"endTime":1480.093,"body":"miscommunications, burnout,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1476.751,"endTime":1480.093,"body":"problems that you see because"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1480.093,"endTime":1483.435,"body":"you"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1483.436,"endTime":1486.616,"body":"haven't spent that time"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1483.436,"endTime":1486.616,"body":"developing communication. And I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1486.616,"endTime":1487.951,"body":"don't know if this is"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1486.616,"endTime":1487.951,"body":"particularly a startup issue,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1487.951,"endTime":1489.286,"body":"but"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1489.287,"endTime":1490.936,"body":"like, the whole move fast and"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1489.287,"endTime":1490.936,"body":"break things, I feel like"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1490.936,"endTime":1492.585,"body":"there's"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1492.586,"endTime":1492.7,"body":"a lot-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1492.7,"endTime":1493.0,"body":"Oh, yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1492.8,"endTime":1496.0,"body":"-lost in how we"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1492.8,"endTime":1496.0,"body":"communicate within teams and"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1496.0,"endTime":1498.0,"body":"cross team communication."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1498.0,"endTime":1500.957,"body":"So, like, what- what is your"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1498.0,"endTime":1500.957,"body":"ideal situation to come in?"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1500.961,"endTime":1504.227,"body":"Would you like to come in from"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1500.961,"endTime":1504.227,"body":"the beginning? Or do you like"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1504.227,"endTime":1509.237,"body":"to come in and kind of like blow"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1504.227,"endTime":1509.237,"body":"people's minds by fixing their"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1509.237,"endTime":1509.747,"body":"problem?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1510.797,"endTime":1513.136,"body":"That's a good way to put"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1510.797,"endTime":1513.136,"body":"it. Yeah, I mean, a lot of the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1513.136,"endTime":1516.076,"body":"things I offer are"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1513.136,"endTime":1516.076,"body":"counterintuitive, right? Like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1516.076,"endTime":1518.5,"body":"slowing down, like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1516.076,"endTime":1518.5,"body":"not going, moving fast, and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1518.5,"endTime":1521.0,"body":"breaking things, but instead,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1518.5,"endTime":1521.0,"body":"you know, allowing people the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1521.0,"endTime":1522.3,"body":"time and the- the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1522.3,"endTime":1526.757,"body":"ability to talk to each other,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1522.3,"endTime":1526.757,"body":"first, you know? And second,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1526.761,"endTime":1529.936,"body":"create quality. But I will say"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1526.761,"endTime":1529.936,"body":"that there's the ideal"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1529.936,"endTime":1531.556,"body":"situation there is sort of a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1529.936,"endTime":1531.556,"body":"size of the company that makes"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1531.556,"endTime":1533.176,"body":"sense."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1533.567,"endTime":1537.632,"body":"I think that one thing people"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1533.567,"endTime":1537.632,"body":"kind of discount is that the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1537.721,"endTime":1541.201,"body":"best practices for a very small"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1537.721,"endTime":1541.201,"body":"company are different than the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1541.201,"endTime":1544.172,"body":"best practices for a large"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1541.201,"endTime":1544.172,"body":"company, you know? If you're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1544.172,"endTime":1547.3,"body":"like a small company, and you're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1544.172,"endTime":1547.3,"body":"trying to scale, you know, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1547.3,"endTime":1547.531,"body":"wanna get"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1547.531,"endTime":1550.561,"body":"started first. You wanna create"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1547.531,"endTime":1550.561,"body":"an MVP, you wanna -- and so the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1550.561,"endTime":1553.142,"body":"best practices for doing that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1550.561,"endTime":1553.142,"body":"are not necessarily focused on"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1553.142,"endTime":1556.951,"body":"quality as much as they are"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1553.142,"endTime":1556.951,"body":"vetting and validating your"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1557.521,"endTime":1559.7,"body":"idea. And validating that it has"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1557.521,"endTime":1559.7,"body":"a market, and validating that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1559.7,"endTime":1563.7,"body":"people want to use it. And that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1559.7,"endTime":1563.7,"body":"maybe creates incentives that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1563.7,"endTime":1565.337,"body":"are different. And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1565.343,"endTime":1566.57,"body":"if you're like a series a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1565.343,"endTime":1566.57,"body":"company where you have maybe 10,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1566.57,"endTime":1567.797,"body":"20"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1567.797,"endTime":1570.227,"body":"people, and you have some"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1567.797,"endTime":1570.227,"body":"investment, and you have some"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1570.227,"endTime":1573.977,"body":"ability to take risks to improve"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1570.227,"endTime":1573.977,"body":"quality, right? So, I think, the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1573.981,"endTime":1577.247,"body":"ideal situation is a little"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1573.981,"endTime":1577.247,"body":"larger company — also larger"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1577.251,"endTime":1580.126,"body":"companies — have the ability to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1577.251,"endTime":1580.126,"body":"onboard juniors more. I think"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1580.126,"endTime":1582.856,"body":"that, you know, it -- it's tough"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1580.126,"endTime":1582.856,"body":"when you're a small company to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1582.856,"endTime":1586.426,"body":"have maybe one developer who,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1582.856,"endTime":1586.426,"body":"you know, is a junior developer."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1586.426,"endTime":1588.886,"body":"I think it's probably great from"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1586.426,"endTime":1588.886,"body":"a standpoint to that junior"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1588.886,"endTime":1589.936,"body":"developer, they learned so much."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1588.886,"endTime":1589.936,"body":"I've been in that situation"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1589.936,"endTime":1590.986,"body":"where"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1590.987,"endTime":1593.537,"body":"I'm the only front-end developer"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1590.987,"endTime":1593.537,"body":"or something, and I was kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1593.537,"endTime":1594.976,"body":"junior. And I learned a lot, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1593.537,"endTime":1594.976,"body":"know? So, I think, it's great"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1594.976,"endTime":1596.415,"body":"for"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1596.416,"endTime":1599.057,"body":"the person. But for the company,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1596.416,"endTime":1599.057,"body":"maybe it's like they wanna move"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1599.061,"endTime":1601.7,"body":"faster. They wanna- they wanna"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1599.061,"endTime":1601.7,"body":"break things, but, like, they"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1601.7,"endTime":1605.116,"body":"don't wanna things to be broken"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1601.7,"endTime":1605.116,"body":"constantly. So yeah, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1605.116,"endTime":1607.517,"body":"know, I think that the best"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1605.116,"endTime":1607.517,"body":"practices are different. And the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1607.517,"endTime":1610.457,"body":"ideal situation is maybe a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1607.517,"endTime":1610.457,"body":"slightly larger company where"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1610.457,"endTime":1613.071,"body":"there is a team. The team is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1610.457,"endTime":1613.071,"body":"sort of established. There's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1613.071,"endTime":1616.342,"body":"investment and ability to take"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1613.071,"endTime":1616.342,"body":"risks. I would love to work"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1616.342,"endTime":1617.451,"body":"with, you know, smaller"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1616.342,"endTime":1617.451,"body":"companies and work from the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1617.451,"endTime":1618.56,"body":"beginning,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1618.561,"endTime":1621.922,"body":"right? But that also is maybe"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1618.561,"endTime":1621.922,"body":"they may- maybe a little more"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1621.926,"endTime":1624.561,"body":"dependent on me, right? They"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1621.926,"endTime":1624.561,"body":"actually may wanna hire me as"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1624.561,"endTime":1626.0,"body":"like a senior developer, and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1624.561,"endTime":1626.0,"body":"that's not really what I'm"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1626.0,"endTime":1629.3,"body":"trying to do. I wanna come in,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1626.0,"endTime":1629.3,"body":"and, like, have a team that I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1629.3,"endTime":1630.291,"body":"can work with,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1630.321,"endTime":1634.221,"body":"and kind of affect, especially a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1630.321,"endTime":1634.221,"body":"junior team. So yeah, I think"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1634.221,"endTime":1636.172,"body":"that I would love to be there"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1634.221,"endTime":1636.172,"body":"from the beginning and help them"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1636.172,"endTime":1638.541,"body":"build quality, but I'd rather be"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1636.172,"endTime":1638.541,"body":"there when they are ready to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1638.541,"endTime":1639.0,"body":"build quality."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1640.0,"endTime":1640.3,"body":"Hm."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1640.3,"endTime":1643.906,"body":"Ready to- to have those"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1640.3,"endTime":1643.906,"body":"counterintuitive solutions."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1643.906,"endTime":1647.116,"body":"Like, \"Hey,\" you know, \"Slow"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1643.906,"endTime":1647.116,"body":"down. Don't -- when there's a-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1647.116,"endTime":1649.5,"body":"when there's tech debt, solve it"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1647.116,"endTime":1649.5,"body":"right away. Have everybody work"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1649.5,"endTime":1649.906,"body":"on it,\" you know?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1649.906,"endTime":1652.606,"body":"Things like this, which are sort"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1649.906,"endTime":1652.606,"body":"of like, not the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1652.606,"endTime":1655.217,"body":"incentives you usually have. You"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1652.606,"endTime":1655.217,"body":"know, cuz the main thing is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1655.217,"endTime":1656.797,"body":"they've been trying things. Like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1655.217,"endTime":1656.797,"body":"you said, there's a problem,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1656.797,"endTime":1660.3,"body":"right? Their -- the CTO is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1656.797,"endTime":1660.3,"body":"talking to the CEO, and the CEO"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1660.3,"endTime":1662.7,"body":"is like, \"Hey, you're not"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1660.3,"endTime":1662.7,"body":"delivering on these business"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1662.7,"endTime":1666.5,"body":"needs. Your team is making a- a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1662.7,"endTime":1666.5,"body":"qual- a qua- product that lacks"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1666.5,"endTime":1669.0,"body":"in quality, and our users"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1666.5,"endTime":1669.0,"body":"noticed.\" And, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1669.0,"endTime":1671.567,"body":"what's the problem that you're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1669.0,"endTime":1671.567,"body":"-- you can't af- affect these"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1671.567,"endTime":1674.537,"body":"things. That's kind of the- the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1671.567,"endTime":1674.537,"body":"issue that I would come in and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1674.537,"endTime":1677.987,"body":"sort of solve, is like when that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1674.537,"endTime":1677.987,"body":"exists -- and I think it exists"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1677.987,"endTime":1681.076,"body":"in a lot of teams at different"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1677.987,"endTime":1681.076,"body":"times. But yeah, that's what"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1681.076,"endTime":1684.047,"body":"I would say. It's like there is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1681.076,"endTime":1684.047,"body":"an ideal size and an ideal"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1684.047,"endTime":1687.0,"body":"problem to come in and solve,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1684.047,"endTime":1687.0,"body":"and- and not -- companies are"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1687.0,"endTime":1687.376,"body":"not really"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1687.376,"endTime":1690.257,"body":"ready for counterintuitive"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1687.376,"endTime":1690.257,"body":"solutions when they're --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1690.257,"endTime":1692.5,"body":"everything's working fine"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1690.257,"endTime":1692.5,"body":"[chuckles]. I think they don't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1692.5,"endTime":1693.5,"body":"wanna come in and,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1693.5,"endTime":1694.936,"body":"like, change things. They're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1693.5,"endTime":1694.936,"body":"like, \"Oh, everything's working"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1694.936,"endTime":1697.3,"body":"fine.\" But when there's a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1694.936,"endTime":1697.3,"body":"problem, it's like, \"Try"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1697.3,"endTime":1700.5,"body":"something different. Try a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1697.3,"endTime":1700.5,"body":"different tact. Because that's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1700.5,"endTime":1701.896,"body":"how you're gonna find a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1700.5,"endTime":1701.896,"body":"solution.\""},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1703.683,"endTime":1706.3,"body":"I -- you know, we talked --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1703.683,"endTime":1706.3,"body":"Ryan had me on his Twitter"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1706.3,"endTime":1709.848,"body":"space ... what was that? Last"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1706.3,"endTime":1709.848,"body":"week? This week? I dunno. Time"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1709.848,"endTime":1711.0,"body":"has no meaning anymore."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1710.7,"endTime":1711.439,"body":"In the past."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1711.544,"endTime":1713.644,"body":"Recently? [All laugh] And-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1713.778,"endTime":1715.0,"body":"Not- not in the future. In"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1713.778,"endTime":1715.0,"body":"the past."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1714.723,"endTime":1717.5,"body":"One- one of the things we"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1714.723,"endTime":1717.5,"body":"talked about wa- a lot was- was"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1717.5,"endTime":1721.0,"body":"the idea of technical debt on"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1717.5,"endTime":1721.0,"body":"teams, right? And- and that's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1721.0,"endTime":1721.5,"body":"like one of the-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1721.5,"endTime":1725.749,"body":"one of the -- maybe one of the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1721.5,"endTime":1725.749,"body":"problems that you are hoping"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1725.749,"endTime":1727.7,"body":"to be able to help solve, right,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1725.749,"endTime":1727.7,"body":"with- with these teams."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1727.7,"endTime":1728.0,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1728.3,"endTime":1731.0,"body":"Could you talk a little bit"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1728.3,"endTime":1731.0,"body":"about what- what technical debt"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1731.0,"endTime":1731.719,"body":"is? You know, like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1731.723,"endTime":1734.0,"body":"what- what it means to you when"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1731.723,"endTime":1734.0,"body":"somebody says technical debt?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1734.0,"endTime":1738.7,"body":"And what -- and then- and then"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1734.0,"endTime":1738.7,"body":"also, like, you know, how- how"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1738.7,"endTime":1742.489,"body":"that can, like, negatively"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1738.7,"endTime":1742.489,"body":"affect a team, you know? Maybe"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1742.489,"endTime":1743.838,"body":"even without them knowing about"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1742.489,"endTime":1743.838,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1744.499,"endTime":1746.088,"body":"Well, I think there's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1744.499,"endTime":1746.088,"body":"actually -- it's important to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1746.088,"endTime":1748.818,"body":"say there's actually lots of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1746.088,"endTime":1748.818,"body":"different kinds of debt. They"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1748.818,"endTime":1751.009,"body":"are different than just -- I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1748.818,"endTime":1751.009,"body":"mean, a lot of people when- when"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1751.009,"endTime":1753.0,"body":"they say technical debt, they"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1751.009,"endTime":1753.0,"body":"think of some developer"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1753.0,"endTime":1754.3,"body":"experience problem where"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1754.3,"endTime":1755.5,"body":"it's like there's something"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1754.3,"endTime":1755.5,"body":"counterintuitive-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":1755.5,"endTime":1755.7,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1755.7,"endTime":1759.7,"body":"in the code, some feature"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1755.7,"endTime":1759.7,"body":"-- but you know -- excuse me."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1759.7,"endTime":1760.969,"body":"There's actually multiple"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1760.969,"endTime":1764.808,"body":"different kinds of debt. There's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1760.969,"endTime":1764.808,"body":"quality debt, which is where"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1764.808,"endTime":1767.959,"body":"you're building things kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1764.808,"endTime":1767.959,"body":"let -- lack quality, and you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1767.959,"endTime":1770.838,"body":"just leave it that way. I did"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1767.959,"endTime":1770.838,"body":"this funny tweet where I had a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1770.838,"endTime":1772.8,"body":"bridge that I built in like Poly"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1770.838,"endTime":1772.8,"body":"Bridge — I dunno if you know"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1772.8,"endTime":1773.328,"body":"this game —"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1773.598,"endTime":1775.669,"body":"but it has these gaps in the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1773.598,"endTime":1775.669,"body":"bridge, and like, the truck goes"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1775.669,"endTime":1778.009,"body":"across it, and the bridge flexes"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1775.669,"endTime":1778.009,"body":"around, and I'm like, this is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1778.013,"endTime":1780.5,"body":"kind of how we built products."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1778.013,"endTime":1780.5,"body":"We leave these gaps and we say,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1780.5,"endTime":1783.3,"body":"\"Oh, the bri- the truck can get"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1780.5,"endTime":1783.3,"body":"across the bridge without the-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1783.3,"endTime":1783.558,"body":"the whole"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1783.558,"endTime":1785.403,"body":"thing being built, therefore"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1783.558,"endTime":1785.403,"body":"it's done.\" And so I think,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1785.403,"endTime":1787.248,"body":"that's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1787.249,"endTime":1788.839,"body":"sort of a quality problem,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1787.249,"endTime":1788.839,"body":"right? So that's quality debt."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1788.839,"endTime":1790.429,"body":"There's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1790.429,"endTime":1793.3,"body":"knowledge debt, which is where"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1790.429,"endTime":1793.3,"body":"the- the- the product doesn't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1793.3,"endTime":1796.939,"body":"teach people how to use it, how"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1793.3,"endTime":1796.939,"body":"to develop on it rather. And I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1796.939,"endTime":1799.699,"body":"think that the ultimate sort of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1796.939,"endTime":1799.699,"body":"product is one that teaches the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1799.699,"endTime":1803.7,"body":"developers how to- how to- how"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1799.699,"endTime":1803.7,"body":"to create, you know, changes in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1803.7,"endTime":1804.138,"body":"it, right? How"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1804.138,"endTime":1805.848,"body":"to extend it, how to modify it"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1804.138,"endTime":1805.848,"body":"to maintain it. If the product"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1805.848,"endTime":1807.558,"body":"isn't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1807.558,"endTime":1810.229,"body":"teaching people that, that's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1807.558,"endTime":1810.229,"body":"knowledge debt, right? That's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1810.229,"endTime":1812.3,"body":"sort of -- and the team isn't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1810.229,"endTime":1812.3,"body":"sharing the knowledge too,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1812.3,"endTime":1814.669,"body":"right? But -- so it's kind of a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1812.3,"endTime":1814.669,"body":"combination of sort of like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1814.699,"endTime":1818.388,"body":"automated solutions and just"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1814.699,"endTime":1818.388,"body":"plain old interfacing with other"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1818.388,"endTime":1822.45,"body":"people face to face, or- or you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1818.388,"endTime":1822.45,"body":"know, remotely. Or even"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1822.45,"endTime":1822.558,"body":"asynchronously,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1822.558,"endTime":1824.419,"body":"right? Cuz there's lots of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1822.558,"endTime":1824.419,"body":"different ways teams operate"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1824.419,"endTime":1827.479,"body":"these days. So, that's knowledge"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1824.419,"endTime":1827.479,"body":"debt. There's tactical debt,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1827.479,"endTime":1829.398,"body":"which is, well, you know, we"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1827.479,"endTime":1829.398,"body":"talked about, sort of like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1830.179,"endTime":1834.318,"body":"developer facing problems in the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1830.179,"endTime":1834.318,"body":"code that make it hard to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1834.318,"endTime":1836.5,"body":"develop, that make it hard to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1834.318,"endTime":1836.5,"body":"implement quality, and hard to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1836.5,"endTime":1837.199,"body":"share knowledge."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1837.588,"endTime":1841.009,"body":"And then there's- there's one"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1837.588,"endTime":1841.009,"body":"other one that I- I can't think"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1841.009,"endTime":1844.0,"body":"of right now [laughs]. But yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1841.009,"endTime":1844.0,"body":"it's -- there's -- that's what I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1844.0,"endTime":1844.308,"body":"would say."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1844.308,"endTime":1847.294,"body":"There's lot -- there's other"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1844.308,"endTime":1847.294,"body":"different kinds of debt."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1847.354,"endTime":1849.574,"body":"Quality debt, knowledge debt,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1847.354,"endTime":1849.574,"body":"technic- well, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1849.574,"endTime":1852.243,"body":"I'll think of it. It's just"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1849.574,"endTime":1852.243,"body":"funny. I should know it cuz it's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1852.243,"endTime":1854.223,"body":"kind of something -- I dunno if"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1852.243,"endTime":1854.223,"body":"it's something I came up with,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1854.223,"endTime":1855.693,"body":"but it's something I talk about"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1854.223,"endTime":1855.693,"body":"a lot. But there's different"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1855.693,"endTime":1857.163,"body":"kinds"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1857.163,"endTime":1861.064,"body":"of -- oh, innovation debt."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1857.163,"endTime":1861.064,"body":"That's it. So innovation debt is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1861.064,"endTime":1865.219,"body":"like, is things you wanna do but"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1861.064,"endTime":1865.219,"body":"you haven't done, cuz you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1865.219,"endTime":1868.128,"body":"can't do it for some reason, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1865.219,"endTime":1868.128,"body":"know? Like, you wanna build this"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1868.128,"endTime":1871.009,"body":"feature, you wanna implement"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1868.128,"endTime":1871.009,"body":"this big change, refactor the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1871.278,"endTime":1873.0,"body":"product, but everything else is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1871.278,"endTime":1873.0,"body":"holding you back, right? So,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1873.0,"endTime":1873.469,"body":"that's sort"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1873.469,"endTime":1876.739,"body":"of like there's a debt in the-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1873.469,"endTime":1876.739,"body":"in the innovation you're trying"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1876.739,"endTime":1879.2,"body":"to do. So yeah, I think breaking"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1876.739,"endTime":1879.2,"body":"it down in different -- into"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1879.2,"endTime":1879.439,"body":"different"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1879.443,"endTime":1882.5,"body":"kinds of debt, not just focusing"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1879.443,"endTime":1882.5,"body":"on calling it technical debt,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1882.5,"endTime":1885.5,"body":"sort of like opens you up to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1882.5,"endTime":1885.5,"body":"really affect the problems that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1885.5,"endTime":1886.074,"body":"are holding you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1886.074,"endTime":1888.894,"body":"back, to affect the things that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1886.074,"endTime":1888.894,"body":"are preventing you from"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1888.894,"endTime":1891.7,"body":"delivering on that qua- promise,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1888.894,"endTime":1891.7,"body":"like I said, and quality, right?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1891.7,"endTime":1894.413,"body":"And promise of timelines ... you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1891.7,"endTime":1894.413,"body":"know?"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1895.219,"endTime":1897.5,"body":"Yeah, I love how you"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1895.219,"endTime":1897.5,"body":"break that down. I think that"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1897.5,"endTime":1897.919,"body":"that really"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1897.919,"endTime":1900.738,"body":"helps to better understand what-"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1897.919,"endTime":1900.738,"body":"what problems that you're"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1900.738,"endTime":1903.557,"body":"facing,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1903.648,"endTime":1907.338,"body":"and also to be able to explain"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1903.648,"endTime":1907.338,"body":"it to other people."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1907.338,"endTime":1911.989,"body":"Especially if you have junior"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1907.338,"endTime":1911.989,"body":"members who are- are just coming"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1911.993,"endTime":1914.929,"body":"into the industry and trying to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1911.993,"endTime":1914.929,"body":"understand exactly what you mean"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1914.929,"endTime":1920.449,"body":"by technical debt. I think it"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1914.929,"endTime":1920.449,"body":"also can help people to better"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1920.449,"endTime":1925.578,"body":"identify their problems by"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1920.449,"endTime":1925.578,"body":"looking at it in that way. So"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1925.584,"endTime":1927.396,"body":"I- I think that this kind of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1925.584,"endTime":1927.396,"body":"touches on this idea of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1927.396,"endTime":1929.208,"body":"knowledge"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1929.209,"endTime":1933.858,"body":"sharing and how you do that in"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1929.209,"endTime":1933.858,"body":"teams. So, can you first"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1933.858,"endTime":1937.878,"body":"define knowledge sharing for us?"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1933.858,"endTime":1937.878,"body":"And then maybe talk about where"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":1937.878,"endTime":1939.328,"body":"to start with that?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1940.588,"endTime":1943.469,"body":"Yeah, I mean, I think"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1940.588,"endTime":1943.469,"body":"it's, you know, we have this"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1943.469,"endTime":1946.1,"body":"problem of droughts these days,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1943.469,"endTime":1946.1,"body":"right? Because of, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1946.1,"endTime":1946.338,"body":"global"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1946.338,"endTime":1949.159,"body":"warming. And there's places that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1946.338,"endTime":1949.159,"body":"have water, there's places that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1949.159,"endTime":1951.259,"body":"don't have water. And how do you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1949.159,"endTime":1951.259,"body":"irrigate, you know? How do you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1951.259,"endTime":1953.838,"body":"get water from one place to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1951.259,"endTime":1953.838,"body":"another so that everybody can"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1953.844,"endTime":1957.229,"body":"drink, everybody can grow crops,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1953.844,"endTime":1957.229,"body":"right? And that's sort of what I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1957.229,"endTime":1960.169,"body":"see knowledge sharing as it is."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1957.229,"endTime":1960.169,"body":"There's people that have the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1960.229,"endTime":1961.954,"body":"context, have the understanding,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1960.229,"endTime":1961.954,"body":"and there's people that need"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1961.954,"endTime":1963.679,"body":"that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1963.679,"endTime":1965.373,"body":"understanding, that need that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1963.679,"endTime":1965.373,"body":"context to affect their work."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1965.373,"endTime":1967.067,"body":"And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1967.068,"endTime":1969.118,"body":"it's like, how do you get the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1967.068,"endTime":1969.118,"body":"water from one place to another,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1969.118,"endTime":1972.854,"body":"you know? And, there's lots of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1969.118,"endTime":1972.854,"body":"different ways to do it, right?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1972.913,"endTime":1975.104,"body":"There's, you know, documentation"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1972.913,"endTime":1975.104,"body":"-- cuz the thing is, there's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1975.134,"endTime":1977.354,"body":"asynchronous and synchronous"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1975.134,"endTime":1977.354,"body":"knowledge sharing, right?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1977.864,"endTime":1978.883,"body":"Synchronous knowledge sharing is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1977.864,"endTime":1978.883,"body":"what we're doing right now."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1978.883,"endTime":1979.902,"body":"We're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1979.903,"endTime":1983.624,"body":"having a conversation in real"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1979.903,"endTime":1983.624,"body":"time. I'm telling you -- you're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1983.624,"endTime":1987.513,"body":"asking me questions, I'm telling"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1983.624,"endTime":1987.513,"body":"you something logical. I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1987.513,"endTime":1989.403,"body":"wouldn't call it an answer,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1987.513,"endTime":1989.403,"body":"right? Cuz there's lots of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1989.403,"endTime":1991.804,"body":"different answers. But I'm"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1989.403,"endTime":1991.804,"body":"telling you personal answers"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1991.804,"endTime":1994.443,"body":"about like how I think about"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1991.804,"endTime":1994.443,"body":"problems. So that's like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1994.443,"endTime":1996.663,"body":"synchronous knowledge sharing."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1994.443,"endTime":1996.663,"body":"And I think that if you can do"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1996.663,"endTime":1999.844,"body":"that, that's kind of the best"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1996.663,"endTime":1999.844,"body":"way to do it. Yes, it costs two"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1999.844,"endTime":2003.203,"body":"people's time. Which is kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":1999.844,"endTime":2003.203,"body":"where people get caught up is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2003.203,"endTime":2005.5,"body":"like, \"Oh, there's a big cost,\""},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2003.203,"endTime":2005.5,"body":"you know, like pairing. There's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2005.5,"endTime":2005.663,"body":"a big"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2005.663,"endTime":2011.453,"body":"cost with meetings, you know, or"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2005.663,"endTime":2011.453,"body":"one-on-ones ideally. But you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2011.453,"endTime":2013.794,"body":"know, of course there's a cost,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2011.453,"endTime":2013.794,"body":"but it's like there's a huge"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2013.794,"endTime":2016.854,"body":"benefit. It's not like two times"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2013.794,"endTime":2016.854,"body":"-- two people is two times work,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2016.854,"endTime":2020.0,"body":"you know? And two times cost."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2016.854,"endTime":2020.0,"body":"It's like, maybe it's two times"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2020.0,"endTime":2022.523,"body":"cost, but it's like there's a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2020.0,"endTime":2022.523,"body":"multiplication effect that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2022.523,"endTime":2024.953,"body":"happens when people share"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2022.523,"endTime":2024.953,"body":"knowledge, both in terms of the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2024.953,"endTime":2027.983,"body":"our ability to execute, and also"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2024.953,"endTime":2027.983,"body":"their ability to build quality,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2027.983,"endTime":2030.653,"body":"right? Cuz they know the edge"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2027.983,"endTime":2030.653,"body":"cases. They know sort of the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2030.653,"endTime":2032.633,"body":"context they need to create best"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2030.653,"endTime":2032.633,"body":"practices within the product."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2032.633,"endTime":2034.613,"body":"And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2034.614,"endTime":2036.413,"body":"then there's asynchronous"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2034.614,"endTime":2036.413,"body":"knowledge sharing, which is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2036.534,"endTime":2039.5,"body":"around, like, it could be Slack,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2036.534,"endTime":2039.5,"body":"right? It could just be that's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2039.5,"endTime":2042.213,"body":"async sort of knowledge sharing."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2039.5,"endTime":2042.213,"body":"There's also documentation,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2042.213,"endTime":2045.394,"body":"right? I have a lot of ideas on"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2042.213,"endTime":2045.394,"body":"documentation and kind of how to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2045.394,"endTime":2049.503,"body":"affect it and make it sort of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2045.394,"endTime":2049.503,"body":"useful for people. But yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2049.503,"endTime":2051.184,"body":"that's what I would say. That's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2049.503,"endTime":2051.184,"body":"sort of knowledge sharing in a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2051.184,"endTime":2054.244,"body":"nutshell. It's like how do you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2051.184,"endTime":2054.244,"body":"irrigate this knowledge between"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2054.333,"endTime":2055.923,"body":"different areas? The people that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2054.333,"endTime":2055.923,"body":"have it, the people that need"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2055.923,"endTime":2057.513,"body":"it,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2058.023,"endTime":2060.603,"body":"and doing it synchronously and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2058.023,"endTime":2060.603,"body":"asynchronously, and sort of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2060.603,"endTime":2062.914,"body":"like being aware of the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2060.603,"endTime":2062.914,"body":"difference between the two."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2062.914,"endTime":2064.128,"body":"I don't know if it's make sense."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2064.128,"endTime":2065.373,"body":"I love that metaphor. No,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2064.128,"endTime":2065.373,"body":"it makes- it makes a ton of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2065.373,"endTime":2066.618,"body":"sense."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2066.619,"endTime":2067.668,"body":"I, you know, I just --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2068.298,"endTime":2069.7,"body":"I have a lot of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2068.298,"endTime":2069.7,"body":"water-based metaphors for"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2069.7,"endTime":2070.759,"body":"programming. So --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2070.909,"endTime":2073.429,"body":"Water-based metaphors."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2070.909,"endTime":2073.429,"body":"Alright. I like it. I'm- I'm a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2073.429,"endTime":2075.648,"body":"big fan of- I'm a big fan of- of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2073.429,"endTime":2075.648,"body":"[unintelligible]."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2075.708,"endTime":2076.969,"body":"Would you be a Water"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2075.708,"endTime":2076.969,"body":"Bender?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2077.688,"endTime":2079.969,"body":"No, I would be Bruce Lee."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2077.688,"endTime":2079.969,"body":"Like, you know, if you put water"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2079.969,"endTime":2081.183,"body":"in a cup, it becomes the cup."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2079.969,"endTime":2081.183,"body":"You put water in a bottle, it"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2081.183,"endTime":2082.397,"body":"becomes"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2082.398,"endTime":2085.128,"body":"the bottle. That's sort of my"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2082.398,"endTime":2085.128,"body":"thinking of water is that it's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2085.128,"endTime":2089.1,"body":"like, it's flexible and I like-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2085.128,"endTime":2089.1,"body":"I like that idea. It's a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2089.1,"endTime":2089.3,"body":"flexible-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2089.3,"endTime":2089.5,"body":"So --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2089.4,"endTime":2090.0,"body":"-metaphor."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2091.443,"endTime":2093.7,"body":"Nevermind. I was just"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2091.443,"endTime":2093.7,"body":"[laughs] -- I was gonna take"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2093.7,"endTime":2094.744,"body":"this metaphor too far."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2095.389,"endTime":2097.998,"body":"No, well, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2095.389,"endTime":2097.998,"body":"mean, it's great metaphor, so --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2098.043,"endTime":2099.903,"body":"Oh, I was trying to figure"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2098.043,"endTime":2099.903,"body":"out what- what, like, Twitter"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2099.909,"endTime":2103.0,"body":"would be if you're, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2099.909,"endTime":2103.0,"body":"sharing if knowledge is- is"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2103.0,"endTime":2104.0,"body":"[unintelligible], like --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2103.099,"endTime":2104.869,"body":"Twitter is a rainstorm"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2103.099,"endTime":2104.869,"body":"[Bekah laughs]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2105.364,"endTime":2108.7,"body":"It is a rainstorm or is"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2105.364,"endTime":2108.7,"body":"like you -- like your Twitter"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2108.7,"endTime":2108.844,"body":"account —"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2108.844,"endTime":2110.884,"body":"not you — but like a person's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2108.844,"endTime":2110.884,"body":"Twitter account is like you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2110.884,"endTime":2112.773,"body":"standing there with a scorecard"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2110.884,"endTime":2112.773,"body":"[laughs], right?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2113.208,"endTime":2114.469,"body":"Exactly. You're just --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2113.208,"endTime":2114.469,"body":"it's a fire hose. You're just-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2114.498,"endTime":2115.248,"body":"Right [laughs]."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2115.429,"endTime":2116.418,"body":"-blast in into a- into a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2115.429,"endTime":2116.418,"body":"chasm [laughs]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2116.909,"endTime":2119.659,"body":"Right. Right. Yeah. Maybe"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2116.909,"endTime":2119.659,"body":"it hits the people."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2119.764,"endTime":2121.893,"body":"And sometimes it splashes"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2119.764,"endTime":2121.893,"body":"back at you. But that's, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2121.893,"endTime":2122.074,"body":"know-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2122.208,"endTime":2122.389,"body":"Right?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2122.583,"endTime":2124.563,"body":"-that's about it. I don't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2122.583,"endTime":2124.563,"body":"know. That's a good question."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2124.789,"endTime":2127.0,"body":"I- I like -- no, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2124.789,"endTime":2127.0,"body":"but- but going back to like"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2127.0,"endTime":2129.0,"body":"what- [chuckles] what you were"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2127.0,"endTime":2129.0,"body":"saying before, the- the -- that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2129.0,"endTime":2130.998,"body":"metaphor of the -- especially"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2131.148,"endTime":2133.789,"body":"the -- you started this with the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2131.148,"endTime":2133.789,"body":"concept of droughts,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2133.789,"endTime":2137.869,"body":"right? And- and, I think -- I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2133.789,"endTime":2137.869,"body":"feel like that is a really"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2137.869,"endTime":2140.8,"body":"powerful part of this metaphor"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2137.869,"endTime":2140.8,"body":"is, you know, you have these"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2140.8,"endTime":2141.3,"body":"droughts, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2141.3,"endTime":2145.384,"body":"And o-of knowledge and- and the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2141.3,"endTime":2145.384,"body":"-- yeah, yeah. And the- the lake"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2145.384,"endTime":2147.784,"body":"of knowledge, like, you have the"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2145.384,"endTime":2147.784,"body":"lake of knowledge sounds -- this"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2147.784,"endTime":2149.0,"body":"is [unintelligible]."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2147.829,"endTime":2149.0,"body":"Yeah. With the drought,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2147.829,"endTime":2149.0,"body":"nothing grows, you know what I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2149.0,"endTime":2149.898,"body":"mean? Nothing is built."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2150.244,"endTime":2151.0,"body":"Right, right, right."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2150.5,"endTime":2152.0,"body":"Nothing is active."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2151.0,"endTime":2152.014,"body":"Yeah. And --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2152.239,"endTime":2153.318,"body":"People are so, you know-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2153.813,"endTime":2154.173,"body":"I- I guess --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2154.429,"endTime":2154.849,"body":"-thirsty [chuckles]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2155.554,"endTime":2157.773,"body":"Yes. I think that's a great"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2155.554,"endTime":2157.773,"body":"way of thinking about it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2157.773,"endTime":2159.0,"body":"It's -- it can -- pretty awesome"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2157.773,"endTime":2159.0,"body":"metaphor."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2158.268,"endTime":2161.3,"body":"Kim Kardashian is like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2158.268,"endTime":2161.3,"body":"mow- watering her lawn at"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2161.3,"endTime":2164.3,"body":"200,000 gallons, you know? It's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2161.3,"endTime":2164.3,"body":"like, no- nobody else has the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2164.3,"endTime":2164.789,"body":"water. I don't know."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2165.768,"endTime":2168.978,"body":"Right. So that means she's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2165.768,"endTime":2168.978,"body":"the senior developer who doesn't"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2168.978,"endTime":2169.849,"body":"talk to anybody and then --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2169.898,"endTime":2172.188,"body":"Exactly. I mean, there are"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2169.898,"endTime":2172.188,"body":"those people right there try to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2172.188,"endTime":2173.028,"body":"forge power, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2173.028,"endTime":2174.289,"body":"Absolutely. You know, a-and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2173.028,"endTime":2174.289,"body":"--"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2174.409,"endTime":2175.489,"body":"Try to [unintelligible]"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2174.409,"endTime":2175.489,"body":"dragons, [unintelligible]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2175.818,"endTime":2179.0,"body":"And talked about -- dragons"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2175.818,"endTime":2179.0,"body":"[laughs]. Yeah, we- we- we"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2179.0,"endTime":2181.548,"body":"talked about -- or you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2181.548,"endTime":2185.059,"body":"talked about, you know, it --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2181.548,"endTime":2185.059,"body":"some of this work being easier"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2185.119,"endTime":2187.728,"body":"with larger teams or whatever,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2185.119,"endTime":2187.728,"body":"things like that. I feel like"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2187.733,"endTime":2190.7,"body":"this happens a lot more often"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2187.733,"endTime":2190.7,"body":"with smaller teams. May-maybe"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2190.7,"endTime":2191.0,"body":"not more often,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2191.0,"endTime":2193.518,"body":"but it is a harder solve --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2191.0,"endTime":2193.518,"body":"problem to solve, right, with a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2193.523,"endTime":2198.498,"body":"smaller team. Especially, like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2193.523,"endTime":2198.498,"body":"long-term. So, I'm just talking"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2198.498,"endTime":2199.5,"body":"about myself here [laughs]. So-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2199.5,"endTime":2200.0,"body":"No, go ahead."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2199.7,"endTime":2201.528,"body":"-just like talk about --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2199.7,"endTime":2201.528,"body":"but like, I've been working on-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2201.7,"endTime":2202.3,"body":"I'm very interested in it."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2202.0,"endTime":2204.949,"body":"-some of these- some of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2202.0,"endTime":2204.949,"body":"these products for, like, your"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2205.159,"endTime":2210.034,"body":"-- like ... I dunno. I've been"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2205.159,"endTime":2210.034,"body":"working on one client for over"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2210.034,"endTime":2214.0,"body":"10 years, right? And I have a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2210.034,"endTime":2214.0,"body":"ton of knowledge just in my head"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2214.0,"endTime":2216.454,"body":"about it. And, you know, I try"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2214.0,"endTime":2216.454,"body":"to do docs and stuff, but it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2216.454,"endTime":2219.213,"body":"like small team, right? So that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2216.454,"endTime":2219.213,"body":"means, mostly me, you know? And"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2219.219,"endTime":2222.3,"body":"then, sometimes, like Bekah"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2219.219,"endTime":2222.3,"body":"worked with me for a while, and-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2222.3,"endTime":2222.543,"body":"and- and I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2222.753,"endTime":2225.724,"body":"have somebody else working with"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2222.753,"endTime":2225.724,"body":"me now, you know? And it's --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2226.713,"endTime":2229.2,"body":"-there's all these -- there's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2226.713,"endTime":2229.2,"body":"all -- there's like deserts,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2229.2,"endTime":2229.414,"body":"right? Of-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2229.474,"endTime":2232.653,"body":"of- of not knowledge, right? I,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2229.474,"endTime":2232.653,"body":"you know, there's places"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2232.653,"endTime":2233.733,"body":"where I've like, \"This is gonna"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2232.653,"endTime":2233.733,"body":"be confusing, so I'm gonna,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2233.733,"endTime":2234.813,"body":"like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2234.818,"endTime":2237.123,"body":"write things down.\" But there's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2234.818,"endTime":2237.123,"body":"other places where, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2237.153,"endTime":2239.974,"body":"either — well, for a million"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2237.153,"endTime":2239.974,"body":"different reasons — there's, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2239.978,"endTime":2241.925,"body":"know, nothing, right? And I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2239.978,"endTime":2241.925,"body":"guess I don't really have a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2241.925,"endTime":2243.872,"body":"point"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2243.873,"endTime":2246.273,"body":"other than it's hard- it's hard"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2243.873,"endTime":2246.273,"body":"problem. It can be a very hard"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2246.273,"endTime":2247.923,"body":"problem to solve for teams of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2246.273,"endTime":2247.923,"body":"all sizes."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2249.349,"endTime":2251.3,"body":"Yeah. Well, you know, what"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2249.349,"endTime":2251.3,"body":"I would say, again,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2251.3,"endTime":2251.418,"body":"counterintuitive"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2251.418,"endTime":2255.949,"body":"solutions, right? My way of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2251.418,"endTime":2255.949,"body":"keeping -- my way of saying keep"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2255.949,"endTime":2259.3,"body":"docs up-to-date is don't try"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2255.949,"endTime":2259.3,"body":"[chuckles], you know? Speaking"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2259.3,"endTime":2261.0,"body":"of the water metaphor, it's a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2259.3,"endTime":2261.0,"body":"point in time thing."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2261.0,"endTime":2261.2,"body":"Talk --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2261.3,"endTime":2262.398,"body":"There's -- well, go ahead."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2261.3,"endTime":2262.398,"body":"What were you gonna say?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2262.458,"endTime":2264.5,"body":"Talk more -- no, I was"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2262.458,"endTime":2264.5,"body":"gonna say, talk more about this"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2264.5,"endTime":2264.829,"body":"[chuckles]. That- that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2264.833,"endTime":2266.4,"body":"is -- I never heard somebody say"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2264.833,"endTime":2266.4,"body":"that before, so I wanna hear"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2266.4,"endTime":2266.824,"body":"what you say."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2266.824,"endTime":2269.284,"body":"Well, I think there's some"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2266.824,"endTime":2269.284,"body":"documentation that needs to be"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2269.284,"endTime":2270.828,"body":"sort of evergreen, right? Like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2269.284,"endTime":2270.828,"body":"onboarding documentation. It"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2270.828,"endTime":2272.372,"body":"sort"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2272.373,"endTime":2275.1,"body":"of needs to be evergreen."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2272.373,"endTime":2275.1,"body":"READMEs need to be evergreen."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2275.1,"endTime":2277.5,"body":"But I think architectural"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2275.1,"endTime":2277.5,"body":"documentation, with, like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2277.5,"endTime":2278.673,"body":"diagrams, and like, how"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2278.673,"endTime":2282.514,"body":"things work, I think it's- it's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2278.673,"endTime":2282.514,"body":"so tough to kind of keep that up"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2282.514,"endTime":2285.603,"body":"to date because it's such a big"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2282.514,"endTime":2285.603,"body":"sort of problem, you know? Like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2285.603,"endTime":2287.974,"body":"how does the whole thing work?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2285.603,"endTime":2287.974,"body":"It's different from onboarding,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2287.974,"endTime":2290.463,"body":"which is like, how do you start"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2287.974,"endTime":2290.463,"body":"the thing you don't know. But-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2290.463,"endTime":2290.7,"body":"Totally."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2291.0,"endTime":2292.114,"body":"-architectural doc- go"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2291.0,"endTime":2292.114,"body":"ahead."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2293.268,"endTime":2294.469,"body":"Oh, I was just saying"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2293.268,"endTime":2294.469,"body":"totally. I was just agreeing"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2294.469,"endTime":2295.2,"body":"with you. I'm sorry [chuckles]."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2294.664,"endTime":2297.0,"body":"Oh yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2294.664,"endTime":2297.0,"body":"Documenta- or, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2297.0,"endTime":2297.244,"body":"architectural"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2297.244,"endTime":2300.0,"body":"documentation is so tough to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2297.244,"endTime":2300.0,"body":"kind of like take the whole"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2300.0,"endTime":2300.668,"body":"product and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2300.668,"endTime":2304.114,"body":"put it -- boil it down into a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2300.668,"endTime":2304.114,"body":"little residue of knowledge. And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2304.114,"endTime":2306.483,"body":"so I think, you know, I really"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2304.114,"endTime":2306.483,"body":"like the idea of architectural"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2306.483,"endTime":2310.143,"body":"decision records, which is I see"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2306.483,"endTime":2310.143,"body":"it like a blog, you know? You're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2310.143,"endTime":2312.364,"body":"keeping a blog of like all the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2310.143,"endTime":2312.364,"body":"changes you're making in the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2312.364,"endTime":2313.848,"body":"product, and it's point in time,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2312.364,"endTime":2313.848,"body":"and you don't update it. It's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2313.848,"endTime":2315.332,"body":"just"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2315.333,"endTime":2318.0,"body":"like, this is the decision we"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2315.333,"endTime":2318.0,"body":"made. And then if you- you --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2318.0,"endTime":2318.333,"body":"and I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2318.333,"endTime":2320.614,"body":"think if you reference those in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2318.333,"endTime":2320.614,"body":"the code, right? And, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2320.614,"endTime":2322.068,"body":"you have some anchor comments or"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2320.614,"endTime":2322.068,"body":"something that like link to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2322.068,"endTime":2323.522,"body":"these"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2323.523,"endTime":2326.583,"body":"different architectural records."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2323.523,"endTime":2326.583,"body":"And, you know, the architectural"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2326.588,"endTime":2330.434,"body":"records supersede each other,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2326.588,"endTime":2330.434,"body":"they amend each other, they have"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2330.438,"endTime":2332.623,"body":"linkages, sort of like hyper"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2330.438,"endTime":2332.623,"body":"text, right? It's like they're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2332.623,"endTime":2334.048,"body":"all linked together. So it is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2332.623,"endTime":2334.048,"body":"very much like a blog that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2334.048,"endTime":2335.473,"body":"you're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2335.474,"endTime":2336.688,"body":"keeping of the decisions you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2335.474,"endTime":2336.688,"body":"make throughout the development"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2336.688,"endTime":2337.902,"body":"of the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2337.903,"endTime":2339.463,"body":"product. 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Sometimes you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2371.224,"endTime":2374.373,"body":"wanna learn from the past, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2374.373,"endTime":2377.193,"body":"wanna learn from like how things"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2374.373,"endTime":2377.193,"body":"were done initially. And also"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2377.193,"endTime":2380.193,"body":"it's just like, it explains"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2377.193,"endTime":2380.193,"body":"things in a way that maybe"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2380.224,"endTime":2383.643,"body":"just a present sort of evergreen"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2380.224,"endTime":2383.643,"body":"documentation wouldn't. Cuz you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2383.643,"endTime":2386.373,"body":"say like, \"Oh, this is why that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2383.643,"endTime":2386.373,"body":"was done.\" There's so many times"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2386.373,"endTime":2388.0,"body":"when we go into a codebase and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2386.373,"endTime":2388.0,"body":"go, \"Oh my God, this is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2388.0,"endTime":2391.5,"body":"horrible. I was just done this"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2388.0,"endTime":2391.5,"body":"way.\" And the truth is always a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2391.5,"endTime":2392.398,"body":"reason. There's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2392.398,"endTime":2394.199,"body":"always a reason. I- I always try"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2392.398,"endTime":2394.199,"body":"to tell people that when they're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2394.199,"endTime":2397.048,"body":"like, \"Oh, I got this legacy"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2394.199,"endTime":2397.048,"body":"codebase, and it's like, it's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2397.048,"endTime":2399.8,"body":"the worst. Like, I can't believe"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2397.048,"endTime":2399.8,"body":"it. Who are these bad"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2399.8,"endTime":2400.048,"body":"developers?\""},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2400.048,"endTime":2402.539,"body":"It's like, you know, they were"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2400.048,"endTime":2402.539,"body":"you. Just in the past, working"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2402.539,"endTime":2405.0,"body":"with problem, you know? They're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2402.539,"endTime":2405.0,"body":"not, like, bad developers. It's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2405.0,"endTime":2405.418,"body":"just they're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2405.418,"endTime":2407.878,"body":"working on deadlines, they're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2405.418,"endTime":2407.878,"body":"working on the context is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2407.878,"endTime":2410.639,"body":"different. And so, like, I think"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2407.878,"endTime":2410.639,"body":"knowing that having empathy for"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2410.639,"endTime":2413.938,"body":"those original sort of the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2410.639,"endTime":2413.938,"body":"ancestors of the codebase is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2413.938,"endTime":2416.954,"body":"sort of like important. And just"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2413.938,"endTime":2416.954,"body":"that's kind of something you get"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2416.954,"endTime":2418.484,"body":"from a decision record that you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2416.954,"endTime":2418.484,"body":"wouldn't get from, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2418.484,"endTime":2420.014,"body":"like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2420.793,"endTime":2424.0,"body":"explanation of what -- how"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2420.793,"endTime":2424.0,"body":"things are. And also it kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2424.0,"endTime":2424.3,"body":"-- it- it"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2424.3,"endTime":2425.546,"body":"shows sort of alternate"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2424.3,"endTime":2425.546,"body":"solutions that you might"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2425.546,"endTime":2426.792,"body":"consider in the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2426.793,"endTime":2429.344,"body":"future — the decision record. If"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2426.793,"endTime":2429.344,"body":"you- if you look at the- the-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2429.344,"endTime":2432.0,"body":"the kind- you know, the way"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2429.344,"endTime":2432.0,"body":"they're written, it sometimes"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2432.0,"endTime":2432.554,"body":"talks about"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2432.554,"endTime":2434.833,"body":"alternate paths that could have"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2432.554,"endTime":2434.833,"body":"been taken in the decision that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2434.833,"endTime":2437.143,"body":"was made, and that could be"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2434.833,"endTime":2437.143,"body":"useful in the future. You might"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2437.143,"endTime":2438.974,"body":"say, \"Oh, you know, that's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2437.143,"endTime":2438.974,"body":"actually a way we could go with"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2438.974,"endTime":2442.1,"body":"this, based on the current"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2438.974,"endTime":2442.1,"body":"context. Let's go refactor"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2442.1,"endTime":2442.588,"body":"that.\" And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2442.588,"endTime":2446.128,"body":"it's also in the code. There's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2442.588,"endTime":2446.128,"body":"context, you know? It's like --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2446.188,"endTime":2449.278,"body":"and I think documentation and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2446.188,"endTime":2449.278,"body":"code is really the way to go,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2449.369,"endTime":2452.309,"body":"for all things. Cuz I think it's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2449.369,"endTime":2452.309,"body":"like when you separate it from"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2452.309,"endTime":2455.789,"body":"the code, you lose the context"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2452.309,"endTime":2455.789,"body":"of ... you lose context. And I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2455.789,"endTime":2458.548,"body":"think that's important to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2455.789,"endTime":2458.548,"body":"understanding how things work."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2458.548,"endTime":2461.0,"body":"But yeah, that's kind of my"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2458.548,"endTime":2461.0,"body":"thinking. Again,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2461.0,"endTime":2461.219,"body":"counterintuitive"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2461.224,"endTime":2463.708,"body":"solutions, it's like try"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2461.224,"endTime":2463.708,"body":"something different. There's a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2463.708,"endTime":2465.898,"body":"thing called, like, Oblique"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2463.708,"endTime":2465.898,"body":"Strategies, where it's like-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2465.898,"endTime":2468.568,"body":"it's like you just have a card,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2465.898,"endTime":2468.568,"body":"you pull it out, and it says,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2468.568,"endTime":2469.188,"body":"like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2469.188,"endTime":2472.3,"body":"\"Dance around in a circle,\" and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2469.188,"endTime":2472.3,"body":"like, that's how you, like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2472.3,"endTime":2472.429,"body":"cultivate"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2472.429,"endTime":2475.639,"body":"your creativity. I think like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2472.429,"endTime":2475.639,"body":"thinking differently and trying"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2475.639,"endTime":2478.338,"body":"different things than you would"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2475.639,"endTime":2478.338,"body":"normally do or are normally done"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2478.338,"endTime":2480.7,"body":"in the industry is sort of an --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2478.338,"endTime":2480.7,"body":"if -- even if it doesn't work,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2480.7,"endTime":2481.248,"body":"it tells"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2481.248,"endTime":2483.438,"body":"you something about how it might"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2481.248,"endTime":2483.438,"body":"work, you know? It's an"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2483.438,"endTime":2486.438,"body":"experiment that you're testing"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2483.438,"endTime":2486.438,"body":"hypothesis and maybe it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2486.438,"endTime":2487.833,"body":"work, but like, you learn"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2486.438,"endTime":2487.833,"body":"something new in the process."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2487.833,"endTime":2489.228,"body":"So-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2490.159,"endTime":2490.7,"body":"so -- there was a dog."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2490.7,"endTime":2491.0,"body":"Oh, man."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2491.0,"endTime":2492.228,"body":"Yeah, that's what I-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2491.0,"endTime":2492.228,"body":"that's what I think. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2493.639,"endTime":2496.6,"body":"I love that. I -- this"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2493.639,"endTime":2496.6,"body":"architectural deci- decision"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2496.6,"endTime":2499.0,"body":"records ... I was just looking"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2496.6,"endTime":2499.0,"body":"it up."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2499.0,"endTime":2499.5,"body":"Yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2500.0,"endTime":2501.7,"body":"I found a couple -- I kind"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2500.0,"endTime":2501.7,"body":"of found a couple blog posts"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2501.7,"endTime":2503.0,"body":"[unintelligible]."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2501.978,"endTime":2503.989,"body":"It's like, adr.github.io."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2501.978,"endTime":2503.989,"body":"A-D-R --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2504.228,"endTime":2506.298,"body":"That's what I -- yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2504.228,"endTime":2506.298,"body":"That's- that's what I'm on right"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2506.659,"endTime":2509.509,"body":"now. And I- I like that concept"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2506.659,"endTime":2509.509,"body":"a lot. I like to, you know, it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2509.509,"endTime":2512.0,"body":"-- it becomes -- it -- and I,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2509.509,"endTime":2512.0,"body":"you know, I have- I have spoken"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2512.0,"endTime":2512.719,"body":"about this before,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2512.719,"endTime":2514.0,"body":"but I have ADHD too, right? And"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2512.719,"endTime":2514.0,"body":"it's like-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2514.0,"endTime":2514.5,"body":"Oh, yeah."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2514.0,"endTime":2514.5,"body":"[Unintelligible]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2515.3,"endTime":2519.7,"body":"-the- the idea of like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2515.3,"endTime":2519.7,"body":"\"Oh, okay, I need docs,\" right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2519.7,"endTime":2520.443,"body":"This is like the thing"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2520.443,"endTime":2522.244,"body":"that pops in my head, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2520.443,"endTime":2522.244,"body":"Like, there's nothing here. I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2522.244,"endTime":2525.5,"body":"need docs. But then, like, what"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2522.244,"endTime":2525.5,"body":"are, like, I -- it's just such a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2525.5,"endTime":2525.903,"body":"huge thing to try to-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2525.903,"endTime":2526.0,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2525.963,"endTime":2528.934,"body":"-do. Like you said, it's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2525.963,"endTime":2528.934,"body":"like writing a book, almost. And"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2528.934,"endTime":2530.673,"body":"you know that, like, I mean, and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2528.934,"endTime":2530.673,"body":"then when you start thinking"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2530.673,"endTime":2532.068,"body":"about it, you know it's going to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2530.673,"endTime":2532.068,"body":"be out of date immediately and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2532.068,"endTime":2533.463,"body":"--"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2533.469,"endTime":2535.206,"body":"oh my gosh. So now it's like"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2533.469,"endTime":2535.206,"body":"huge chunk of work to begin"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2535.206,"endTime":2536.943,"body":"with."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2536.943,"endTime":2537.0,"body":"I know."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2537.0,"endTime":2540.0,"body":"And then, also huge"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2537.0,"endTime":2540.0,"body":"annoying chunk of works, like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2540.0,"endTime":2541.5,"body":"chunks of work, to keep-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2541.5,"endTime":2541.7,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2541.7,"endTime":2543.0,"body":"-it up to date. And it just"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2541.7,"endTime":2543.0,"body":"seems impossible in my head"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2543.0,"endTime":2544.594,"body":"sometimes, you know? I'm --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2544.818,"endTime":2546.5,"body":"Well, you know, when I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2544.818,"endTime":2546.5,"body":"worked at Dropbox, just to be"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2546.5,"endTime":2549.0,"body":"wi- the things that were wild,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2546.5,"endTime":2549.0,"body":"we had librarians [chuckles]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2549.3,"endTime":2549.5,"body":"Oh, man."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2549.5,"endTime":2550.9,"body":"Technical librarians."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2551.0,"endTime":2551.2,"body":"Whoa."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2551.3,"endTime":2552.0,"body":"Yeah, well, that's"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2551.3,"endTime":2552.0,"body":"[unintelligible] --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2552.0,"endTime":2553.0,"body":"Who's, like, literally --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2552.574,"endTime":2552.934,"body":"I mean, like, that --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2552.8,"endTime":2555.8,"body":"Hey, that's I wanna be. A"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2552.8,"endTime":2555.8,"body":"technical librarian"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2555.8,"endTime":2556.0,"body":"[Dan laughs]."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2556.0,"endTime":2556.7,"body":"Yeah, I can connect them"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2556.0,"endTime":2556.7,"body":"to you."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2556.2,"endTime":2557.5,"body":"I didn't know that was a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2556.2,"endTime":2557.5,"body":"thing."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2558.048,"endTime":2559.159,"body":"I can connect you to if"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2558.048,"endTime":2559.159,"body":"you want."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2559.384,"endTime":2562.173,"body":"That sounds awesome. I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2559.384,"endTime":2562.173,"body":"mean, like, that's the kind of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2562.173,"endTime":2565.7,"body":"thing you- you -- the -- once"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2562.173,"endTime":2565.7,"body":"your company grows in size,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2565.7,"endTime":2566.0,"body":"like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2566.0,"endTime":2568.023,"body":"you can start having people that"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2566.0,"endTime":2568.023,"body":"have jobs of, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2568.023,"endTime":2570.3,"body":"specific jobs, right? And in"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2568.023,"endTime":2570.3,"body":"smaller teams, you have to do"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2570.3,"endTime":2574.5,"body":"everything, right? And that's-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2570.3,"endTime":2574.5,"body":"that's a very cool. I- I wonder"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2574.5,"endTime":2575.7,"body":"if there's some-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2575.179,"endTime":2576.139,"body":"Once you get -- that's-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2575.179,"endTime":2576.139,"body":"that's a big [unintelligible]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2576.244,"endTime":2579.648,"body":"-I wonder if there's like a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2576.244,"endTime":2579.648,"body":"consulting -- technical"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2579.648,"endTime":2582.0,"body":"librarians that can consult ..."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2579.648,"endTime":2582.0,"body":"Well, I mean [unintelligible] --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2581.119,"endTime":2582.199,"body":"Well, generally, there are"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2581.119,"endTime":2582.199,"body":"technical --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2581.7,"endTime":2583.608,"body":"That's really what I"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2581.7,"endTime":2583.608,"body":"wanna do. I wanna be a-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2583.608,"endTime":2584.478,"body":"Yeah. I mean, like --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2583.7,"endTime":2585.289,"body":"-consulting technical"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2583.7,"endTime":2585.289,"body":"librarian."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2585.349,"endTime":2586.338,"body":"Right, right, right. So --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2585.349,"endTime":2586.338,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2585.7,"endTime":2588.768,"body":"You evaluate, you put the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2585.7,"endTime":2588.768,"body":"books back in the right order."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2589.0,"endTime":2589.3,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2589.699,"endTime":2590.539,"body":"Yeah, because like --"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2590.719,"endTime":2591.619,"body":"Say, you don't wanna"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2590.719,"endTime":2591.619,"body":"miscategorized."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2592.338,"endTime":2594.259,"body":"Right. And then, keeping it"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2592.338,"endTime":2594.259,"body":"up to date. Like, if you have"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2594.264,"endTime":2597.048,"body":"somebody that is not a full-time"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2594.264,"endTime":2597.048,"body":"employee, right? But somebody"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2597.054,"endTime":2601.969,"body":"who's -- like, all right. The"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2597.054,"endTime":2601.969,"body":"first run through would be a big"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2601.969,"endTime":2604.009,"body":"project, right? But like, after"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2601.969,"endTime":2604.009,"body":"that, it's like maintenance"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2604.009,"endTime":2606.679,"body":"stuff. Maybe a couple hours --"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2604.009,"endTime":2606.679,"body":"whatever. A week or a month, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2606.679,"endTime":2609.498,"body":"know, whatever it is. But like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2606.679,"endTime":2609.498,"body":"that -- man, alright. I have to"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2609.498,"endTime":2609.918,"body":"think this about this one. That"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2609.498,"endTime":2609.918,"body":"sounds- that sounds awesome."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2610.054,"endTime":2613.023,"body":"No, I- I agree. It's-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2610.054,"endTime":2613.023,"body":"it's- it's a- it's a huge task."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2613.023,"endTime":2615.8,"body":"And so, like, having specialized"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2613.023,"endTime":2615.8,"body":"people is really valuable."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2616.0,"endTime":2616.7,"body":"Yeah. Yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2616.7,"endTime":2618.0,"body":"But, you know, also -- but"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2616.7,"endTime":2618.0,"body":"they're -- they don't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2618.0,"endTime":2619.0,"body":"necessarily have the context."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2619.0,"endTime":2621.664,"body":"So they're just sort of like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2619.0,"endTime":2621.664,"body":"organizing, making sure things"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2621.664,"endTime":2623.5,"body":"are formatted correctly, making"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2621.664,"endTime":2623.5,"body":"sure things are-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2623.5,"endTime":2623.7,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2623.6,"endTime":2624.514,"body":"-linked correctly."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2624.844,"endTime":2627.153,"body":"But, you know, the knowledge has"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2624.844,"endTime":2627.153,"body":"to come sort of ultimately from"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2627.153,"endTime":2629.344,"body":"the people who are on the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2627.153,"endTime":2629.344,"body":"[unintelligible], you know?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2628.3,"endTime":2630.7,"body":"Totally. Totally. But if-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2628.3,"endTime":2630.7,"body":"but if somebody's like -- and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2630.7,"endTime":2633.063,"body":"that -- this is, like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2633.063,"endTime":2635.3,"body":"speaking of something that I've"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2633.063,"endTime":2635.3,"body":"done that is not well documented"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2635.3,"endTime":2637.5,"body":"or whatever, but somebody asks"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2635.3,"endTime":2637.5,"body":"me a question about it, then"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2637.5,"endTime":2640.0,"body":"I'm, like, can talk about it for"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2637.5,"endTime":2640.0,"body":"a while. You know what I mean?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2640.0,"endTime":2640.684,"body":"But then-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2640.684,"endTime":2641.224,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2641.224,"endTime":2643.3,"body":"-and you mentioned, like"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2641.224,"endTime":2643.3,"body":"sla- like those async, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2643.3,"endTime":2643.563,"body":"learning"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2643.563,"endTime":2645.364,"body":"channels and stuff like that."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2643.563,"endTime":2645.364,"body":"That's this kind of thing. And"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2645.364,"endTime":2648.543,"body":"then -- but then it gets buried"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2645.364,"endTime":2648.543,"body":"in a Slack, you know, thread"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2648.548,"endTime":2650.0,"body":"somewhere and disappears cuz-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2650.0,"endTime":2650.3,"body":"Oh, yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2650.5,"endTime":2652.083,"body":"-we don't pay for Slack"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2650.5,"endTime":2652.083,"body":"[laughs]. You know, and"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2652.083,"endTime":2652.7,"body":"all that stuff, right?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2652.7,"endTime":2653.0,"body":"Yeah [laughs]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2653.0,"endTime":2655.653,"body":"And so ... oh, man. I- I"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2653.0,"endTime":2655.653,"body":"like the idea of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2655.653,"endTime":2658.173,"body":"having somebody, an outside"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2655.653,"endTime":2658.173,"body":"person -- plus, like, if you see"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2658.173,"endTime":2660.873,"body":"somebody do -- I'm sorry I'm"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2658.173,"endTime":2660.873,"body":"talking about this so much. But"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2660.873,"endTime":2661.5,"body":"I'm excited about it now"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2660.873,"endTime":2661.5,"body":"[laughs]."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2661.5,"endTime":2662.0,"body":"No, that's fine."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2662.0,"endTime":2664.204,"body":"But if you- if you, like,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2662.0,"endTime":2664.204,"body":"if me, as- as, like, the ..."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2664.204,"endTime":2666.693,"body":"whatever. A lead developer on a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2664.204,"endTime":2666.693,"body":"project, and you have an outside"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2666.693,"endTime":2670.233,"body":"person that comes and gets"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2666.693,"endTime":2670.233,"body":"something going or adds an"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2670.233,"endTime":2672.574,"body":"addition, you'll be able to like"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2670.233,"endTime":2672.574,"body":"-- I would be able to, like, see"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2672.574,"endTime":2675.003,"body":"if it's wrong or needs some,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2672.574,"endTime":2675.003,"body":"like -- not wrong, but, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2675.003,"endTime":2677.5,"body":"know, need some, like, tweaks or"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2675.003,"endTime":2677.5,"body":"whatever. And that's an easier"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2677.5,"endTime":2678.034,"body":"job than-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2678.889,"endTime":2679.878,"body":"Well, there's a value to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2678.889,"endTime":2679.878,"body":"--"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2679.0,"endTime":2681.0,"body":"-than starting from the-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2679.0,"endTime":2681.0,"body":"starting from the beginning"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2681.0,"endTime":2681.634,"body":"[chuckles], right?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2681.858,"endTime":2683.7,"body":"It's a value to an"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2681.858,"endTime":2683.7,"body":"external perspective. That's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2683.7,"endTime":2684.168,"body":"what I always"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2684.168,"endTime":2687.978,"body":"say about myself is like, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2684.168,"endTime":2687.978,"body":"know, you've tried things, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2687.978,"endTime":2691.548,"body":"have a context about how things"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2687.978,"endTime":2691.548,"body":"work. I can come in as with an"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2691.548,"endTime":2694.458,"body":"external perspective and provide"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2691.548,"endTime":2694.458,"body":"additional value that you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2694.458,"endTime":2696.0,"body":"otherwise wouldn't get, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2694.458,"endTime":2696.0,"body":"know?"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2696.0,"endTime":2696.3,"body":"Totally."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2696.5,"endTime":2697.608,"body":"It's kind of like -- I'm"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2696.5,"endTime":2697.608,"body":"trying"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2697.608,"endTime":2700.159,"body":"to think of an explanation. It's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2697.608,"endTime":2700.159,"body":"cross-pollination, you know what"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2700.159,"endTime":2704.119,"body":"I mean? It's like you're getting"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2700.159,"endTime":2704.119,"body":"sort of information or wi-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2704.119,"endTime":2706.0,"body":"genetic information from an"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2704.119,"endTime":2706.0,"body":"external source. And that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2706.0,"endTime":2707.748,"body":"creates a better ... sort"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2707.748,"endTime":2710.809,"body":"of, you know, better result. If"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2707.748,"endTime":2710.809,"body":"you just kind of like, I don't"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2710.809,"endTime":2713.389,"body":"wanna get into, like, genetics."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2710.809,"endTime":2713.389,"body":"But it's like, you know, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2713.389,"endTime":2715.7,"body":"don't wanna just- just breed the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2713.389,"endTime":2715.7,"body":"same genes over and over again."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2715.7,"endTime":2718.5,"body":"It creates sort of problems. And"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2715.7,"endTime":2718.5,"body":"so it's like you need that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2718.5,"endTime":2722.208,"body":"external information, external"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2718.5,"endTime":2722.208,"body":"perspective. And, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2722.208,"endTime":2724.099,"body":"think every company needs that."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2722.208,"endTime":2724.099,"body":"And that's kinda what you get"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2724.099,"endTime":2725.0,"body":"when you hire people, right?"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2725.0,"endTime":2725.3,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2725.7,"endTime":2726.3,"body":"You're hiring-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2726.3,"endTime":2726.5,"body":"Totally."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2726.5,"endTime":2726.949,"body":"-someone, they come"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2726.949,"endTime":2730.309,"body":"in with their own sort of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2726.949,"endTime":2730.309,"body":"knowledge, and abilities, and --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2730.608,"endTime":2732.5,"body":"but, you know, if you can just"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2730.608,"endTime":2732.5,"body":"-- you can also hire a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2732.5,"endTime":2732.708,"body":"consultant,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2732.768,"endTime":2733.998,"body":"you know? And they- and they can"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2732.768,"endTime":2733.998,"body":"provide the same sort of thing"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2733.998,"endTime":2735.228,"body":"on"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2735.228,"endTime":2738.3,"body":"a more temporary sort of basis"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2735.228,"endTime":2738.3,"body":"and less -- you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2738.3,"endTime":2738.994,"body":"ultimately, less"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2738.994,"endTime":2742.114,"body":"cost, right? You know, than"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2738.994,"endTime":2742.114,"body":"hiring somebody. But over-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2742.114,"endTime":2744.364,"body":"over, you know, if they come in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2742.114,"endTime":2744.364,"body":"for three months and you cost"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2744.364,"endTime":2746.104,"body":"this much, hiring someone for a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2744.364,"endTime":2746.104,"body":"year and maybe not having them"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2746.104,"endTime":2747.844,"body":"do"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2747.849,"endTime":2750.273,"body":"the same work is, you know, a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2747.849,"endTime":2750.273,"body":"different- different calculus."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2750.273,"endTime":2752.583,"body":"But, yeah. External perspective"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2750.273,"endTime":2752.583,"body":"is very valuable."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2754.909,"endTime":2756.836,"body":"I love that. You've given"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2754.909,"endTime":2756.836,"body":"me a lot to think about"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2756.836,"endTime":2758.763,"body":"[laughs]."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2758.764,"endTime":2759.094,"body":"Yeah. That's good."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2759.094,"endTime":2761.284,"body":"I mean, I'll- I'll -- every"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2759.094,"endTime":2761.284,"body":"time we- every time we met --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2761.373,"endTime":2762.693,"body":"We have to talk about it"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2761.373,"endTime":2762.693,"body":"some more. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2763.054,"endTime":2764.389,"body":"Yeah. I always- I always"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2763.054,"endTime":2764.389,"body":"end up coming away with a- with"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2764.389,"endTime":2765.724,"body":"a lot"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2765.724,"endTime":2766.954,"body":"of stuff to think about. All of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":2765.724,"endTime":2766.954,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2767.764,"endTime":2769.563,"body":"Yeah. Well, that's the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2767.764,"endTime":2769.563,"body":"point, right? Is like -- that's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2769.563,"endTime":2772.804,"body":"the -- I have the external"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2769.563,"endTime":2772.804,"body":"perspective, and you're learning"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2772.804,"endTime":2777.273,"body":"from it. And I'm learning from"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2772.804,"endTime":2777.273,"body":"yours. That's sort of the- the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2777.278,"endTime":2779.331,"body":"ultimate idea, right? Is like we"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2777.278,"endTime":2779.331,"body":"learn from each other. That's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2779.331,"endTime":2781.384,"body":"why"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2781.384,"endTime":2784.0,"body":"we have conversations. It's not"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2781.384,"endTime":2784.0,"body":"to, like -- I'm not, like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2784.0,"endTime":2785.523,"body":"telling you stuff. I wanna"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2784.0,"endTime":2785.523,"body":"listen, you know?"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2787.833,"endTime":2791.7,"body":"Yeah. That's so"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2787.833,"endTime":2791.7,"body":"important, that idea of"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2791.7,"endTime":2792.784,"body":"listening. Cuz it's"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2793.083,"endTime":2798.364,"body":"hard to do and so much of the"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2793.083,"endTime":2798.364,"body":"time we spend listening to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2798.364,"endTime":2802.599,"body":"respond to other people rather"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2798.364,"endTime":2802.599,"body":"than just listening to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2802.599,"endTime":2807.248,"body":"understand people. And I think,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2802.599,"endTime":2807.248,"body":"that's -- it's a hard thing to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2807.248,"endTime":2813.039,"body":"do, but it's a good habit to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2807.248,"endTime":2813.039,"body":"work on in- in any situation."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2813.039,"endTime":2816.3,"body":"But especially, if you're on a"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2813.039,"endTime":2816.3,"body":"team of diverse people or-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2816.3,"endTime":2816.5,"body":"Oh, yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2816.5,"endTime":2817.539,"body":"-I- I think, too-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2817.539,"endTime":2819.0,"body":"Well, hopefully you are"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2817.539,"endTime":2819.0,"body":"[laughs]."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2817.6,"endTime":2819.8,"body":"-if you're working"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2817.6,"endTime":2819.8,"body":"remotely. It --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2820.0,"endTime":2821.244,"body":"Yeah. I think that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2820.0,"endTime":2821.244,"body":"listening, it"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2821.273,"endTime":2824.393,"body":"requires empathy, right? But it-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2821.273,"endTime":2824.393,"body":"it's more than that. I think it"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2824.423,"endTime":2826.673,"body":"-- because empathy comes from"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2824.423,"endTime":2826.673,"body":"letting go of yourself."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2826.778,"endTime":2827.389,"body":"Mm-hmm."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2827.574,"endTime":2829.463,"body":"You know, if you come into"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2827.574,"endTime":2829.463,"body":"a listening situation without"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2829.463,"endTime":2831.008,"body":"compassion, which is literally"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2829.463,"endTime":2831.008,"body":"just like not putting yourself"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2831.008,"endTime":2832.553,"body":"in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2832.554,"endTime":2834.503,"body":"the other person's shoes, but"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2832.554,"endTime":2834.503,"body":"just not even- just not even"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2834.503,"endTime":2837.293,"body":"really imagining, you know what"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2834.503,"endTime":2837.293,"body":"I mean? You just kind of let go"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2837.293,"endTime":2840.7,"body":"of your own preconceived notions"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2837.293,"endTime":2840.7,"body":"and- and listen to the person."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2840.7,"endTime":2841.434,"body":"And then,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2841.434,"endTime":2843.764,"body":"when they're done, you come out"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2841.434,"endTime":2843.764,"body":"of it and try to integrate it."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2844.108,"endTime":2846.059,"body":"Then you can come up with some"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2844.108,"endTime":2846.059,"body":"advice. But if you're sitting"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2846.059,"endTime":2848.369,"body":"there in your head sort of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2846.059,"endTime":2848.369,"body":"calculating like, \"Oh, this is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2848.369,"endTime":2851.0,"body":"my answer. This is my answer."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2848.369,"endTime":2851.0,"body":"This is how I think about it."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2851.0,"endTime":2851.338,"body":"This is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2851.338,"endTime":2854.639,"body":"how,\" you know? Then you're not"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2851.338,"endTime":2854.639,"body":"really listening. You're like, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2854.639,"endTime":2856.289,"body":"don't know what it is, but"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2854.639,"endTime":2856.289,"body":"you're not listening, you know?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2856.289,"endTime":2860.248,"body":"Listening is really like letting"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2856.289,"endTime":2860.248,"body":"go of yourself for a moment,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2860.639,"endTime":2863.818,"body":"completely, as much as possible,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2860.639,"endTime":2863.818,"body":"and just being present with the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2863.978,"endTime":2866.664,"body":"other person. And really like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2863.978,"endTime":2866.664,"body":"trying to -- that's how empathy"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2866.664,"endTime":2869.3,"body":"comes. It's not from, like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2866.664,"endTime":2869.3,"body":"relating it to your experience,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2869.3,"endTime":2869.603,"body":"your own sort"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2869.603,"endTime":2873.653,"body":"of hurts, and desires, and, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2869.603,"endTime":2873.653,"body":"know, suffering or whatever you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2873.653,"endTime":2876.264,"body":"wanna put it, you know? In the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2873.653,"endTime":2876.264,"body":"Buddhist sense I would say. But"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2876.268,"endTime":2877.691,"body":"yeah, you know, it's really just"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2876.268,"endTime":2877.691,"body":"kind of listening and being"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2877.691,"endTime":2879.114,"body":"there"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2879.114,"endTime":2882.264,"body":"for the other person. And then,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2879.114,"endTime":2882.264,"body":"after they're done, you come"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2882.264,"endTime":2885.023,"body":"back, and you go, \"Wow,\" you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2882.264,"endTime":2885.023,"body":"know, \"I really learn from that"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2885.023,"endTime":2887.6,"body":"perspective,\" you know? Cuz it's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2885.023,"endTime":2887.6,"body":"-- ultimately, listening is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2887.6,"endTime":2887.784,"body":"learning,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2887.784,"endTime":2890.664,"body":"right? And the way you learn is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2887.784,"endTime":2890.664,"body":"not by -- is by integrating, but"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2890.664,"endTime":2893.3,"body":"first, sort of, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2890.664,"endTime":2893.3,"body":"transporting yourself to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2893.3,"endTime":2895.809,"body":"another- another way of being in"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2893.3,"endTime":2895.809,"body":"other perspective."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2897.804,"endTime":2901.014,"body":"Yeah. I love that. Well,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2897.804,"endTime":2901.014,"body":"Ryan, it's about time for us to"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2901.014,"endTime":2902.0,"body":"wrap up. Is-"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2902.0,"endTime":2902.3,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2902.3,"endTime":2906.653,"body":"-there one tip that you"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2902.3,"endTime":2906.653,"body":"can leave our listeners with,"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2906.653,"endTime":2911.603,"body":"to help them get started in this"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2906.653,"endTime":2911.603,"body":"idea of building better teams"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":2911.603,"endTime":2914.543,"body":"through empathy and listening?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2915.969,"endTime":2920.574,"body":"Wow. That's a good"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2915.969,"endTime":2920.574,"body":"question. I think it's being,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2920.574,"endTime":2923.273,"body":"you know, compassion is very"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2920.574,"endTime":2923.273,"body":"important. There's a big push"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2923.273,"endTime":2926.873,"body":"these days for compassionate"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2923.273,"endTime":2926.873,"body":"coding, for compassionate teams."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2927.353,"endTime":2929.903,"body":"And you know, I've been on some"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2927.353,"endTime":2929.903,"body":"teams as well that just don't --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2929.963,"endTime":2931.718,"body":"there's some lack of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2929.963,"endTime":2931.718,"body":"disconnected compassion, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2931.718,"endTime":2933.473,"body":"know? And so"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2933.474,"endTime":2937.014,"body":"being gentle with each other,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2933.474,"endTime":2937.014,"body":"being empathetic as you said, is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2937.014,"endTime":2941.3,"body":"such an important skill and such"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2937.014,"endTime":2941.3,"body":"an important, you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2941.3,"endTime":2944.0,"body":"component of being a team."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2944.0,"endTime":2947.0,"body":"That listening aspect of really"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2944.0,"endTime":2947.0,"body":"kind of letting go of yourself"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2947.0,"endTime":2950.378,"body":"and connecting with another"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2947.0,"endTime":2950.378,"body":"person is -- you know, and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2950.378,"endTime":2952.5,"body":"then- and then sharing"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2950.378,"endTime":2952.5,"body":"knowledge, you know, is, like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2952.5,"endTime":2952.809,"body":"that's- that's --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2952.813,"endTime":2955.208,"body":"the- the basis of sharing"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2952.813,"endTime":2955.208,"body":"knowledge is connecting with the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2955.208,"endTime":2958.148,"body":"other person's experience."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2955.208,"endTime":2958.148,"body":"You're just talking at them and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2958.153,"endTime":2961.0,"body":"saying, \"Read the docs,\" you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2958.153,"endTime":2961.0,"body":"know? Like, that's not how you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2961.0,"endTime":2962.0,"body":"connect with the person,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2962.0,"endTime":2964.3,"body":"and then connect -- because"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2962.0,"endTime":2964.3,"body":"ultimately, the knowledge, as"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2964.3,"endTime":2964.568,"body":"I said,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2964.568,"endTime":2968.523,"body":"is, like, about connecting some"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2964.568,"endTime":2968.523,"body":"sort of theory to your personal"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2968.523,"endTime":2971.554,"body":"experience, you know? That's how"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2968.523,"endTime":2971.554,"body":"you transfer knowledge, is I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2971.554,"endTime":2974.798,"body":"tell you, this is my experience."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2971.554,"endTime":2974.798,"body":"Or you tell me first. I think"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2974.798,"endTime":2977.648,"body":"you have to ask questions first,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2974.798,"endTime":2977.648,"body":"you know? Ask questions first,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2977.648,"endTime":2980.0,"body":"and listen. And then see -- you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2977.648,"endTime":2980.0,"body":"say, \"This is my experience.\""},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2980.0,"endTime":2982.0,"body":"Then I go, \"Oh,\" you know,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2980.0,"endTime":2982.0,"body":"\"based on what I think, this"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2982.0,"endTime":2983.228,"body":"is how I might connect with what"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2983.233,"endTime":2985.659,"body":"you said. This is how I might"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2983.233,"endTime":2985.659,"body":"connect with you as a person.\""},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2986.139,"endTime":2988.239,"body":"So, I don't know if that makes"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2986.139,"endTime":2988.239,"body":"sense to your question, but"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2988.239,"endTime":2990.2,"body":"that's what I would say, is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2988.239,"endTime":2990.2,"body":"being gentle, being"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2990.2,"endTime":2991.0,"body":"compassionate first."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2991.0,"endTime":2994.708,"body":"And not trying to just kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2991.0,"endTime":2994.708,"body":"grind people, you know? Cuz"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2994.708,"endTime":2997.739,"body":"that's really how you lose your"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2994.708,"endTime":2997.739,"body":"team. It's how you lose kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2997.739,"endTime":3000.259,"body":"the knowledge that people have"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":2997.739,"endTime":3000.259,"body":"when they leave is you burn them"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3000.259,"endTime":3002.509,"body":"out. And you're not being"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3000.259,"endTime":3002.509,"body":"compassionate. And I think it's"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3002.509,"endTime":3005.478,"body":"so tough on a corporate level to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3002.509,"endTime":3005.478,"body":"be compassionate cuz there's the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3005.483,"endTime":3008.418,"body":"profit motive, and business"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3005.483,"endTime":3008.418,"body":"needs, and all this stuff. But"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3008.418,"endTime":3011.059,"body":"if you can really kind of let"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3008.418,"endTime":3011.059,"body":"that go and say, \"Look, we're"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3011.059,"endTime":3013.3,"body":"gonna care about our people"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3011.059,"endTime":3013.3,"body":"first,\" that will reap the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3013.3,"endTime":3013.909,"body":"rewards, you know?"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3014.173,"endTime":3017.054,"body":"That'll reap the rewards more"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3014.173,"endTime":3017.054,"body":"than like, you know, burning"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3017.054,"endTime":3019.244,"body":"people out for a business end,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3017.054,"endTime":3019.244,"body":"you know what I mean? Like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3019.244,"endTime":3022.423,"body":"there's more to life. You're a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3019.244,"endTime":3022.423,"body":"person too. The CEO's a person,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3022.423,"endTime":3024.164,"body":"you know? They don't wanna --"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3022.423,"endTime":3024.164,"body":"they wanna go golfing or"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3024.164,"endTime":3026.623,"body":"whatever. They don't wanna,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3024.164,"endTime":3026.623,"body":"like, you know, just be burning"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3026.623,"endTime":3030.193,"body":"themselves out and, you know, to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3026.623,"endTime":3030.193,"body":"like, to- to- to make money, I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3030.193,"endTime":3033.3,"body":"think, ultimately. Maybe they"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3030.193,"endTime":3033.3,"body":"do. But that's sort of my"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3033.3,"endTime":3033.614,"body":"opinion, is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3033.614,"endTime":3036.253,"body":"like, you wanna build a great"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3033.614,"endTime":3036.253,"body":"team, be compassionate. And play"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3036.253,"endTime":3038.474,"body":"golf, I guess, you know? Let"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3036.253,"endTime":3038.474,"body":"them play golf. I don't know"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3038.474,"endTime":3040.5,"body":"what do they wanna do [Bekah and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3038.474,"endTime":3040.5,"body":"Dan chuckle]. I play disc golf."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3040.5,"endTime":3041.3,"body":"But, you know-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3041.3,"endTime":3041.5,"body":"Yes!"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3041.5,"endTime":3043.7,"body":"-let people be themselves."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3041.5,"endTime":3043.7,"body":"And I think, that's -- you also"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3043.7,"endTime":3044.213,"body":"have to accept"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3044.213,"endTime":3046.974,"body":"that people don't work the same"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3044.213,"endTime":3046.974,"body":"hours, people don't have the"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3046.974,"endTime":3048.5,"body":"same accommodations. Like,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3046.974,"endTime":3048.5,"body":"that's where com- that's where"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3048.5,"endTime":3051.5,"body":"compassion comes in, is like"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3048.5,"endTime":3051.5,"body":"understanding the diversity of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3051.5,"endTime":3052.074,"body":"people and"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3052.074,"endTime":3054.443,"body":"trying to make them productive"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3052.074,"endTime":3054.443,"body":"and not trying to put them on a"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3054.443,"endTime":3056.7,"body":"clock, and like- like, where,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3054.443,"endTime":3056.7,"body":"you know, in the- in the Henry"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3056.7,"endTime":3060.0,"body":"Ford factory, it's creative"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3056.7,"endTime":3060.0,"body":"work. You really need to kind of"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3060.0,"endTime":3063.5,"body":"disconnect from that idea of,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3060.0,"endTime":3063.5,"body":"like, you know, hours, and time,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3064.074,"endTime":3064.074,"body":"and productivity."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":3066.409,"endTime":3068.0,"body":"Wow. That was a great way"},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":3066.409,"endTime":3068.0,"body":"to end the episode."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3068.2,"endTime":3069.0,"body":"Yeah. Amazing."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":3068.3,"endTime":3069.384,"body":"Thank you so much, Ryan."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3070.358,"endTime":3071.188,"body":"Thanks, Ryan. Thanks for"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3070.358,"endTime":3071.188,"body":"coming on."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3071.994,"endTime":3073.733,"body":"Of course. It's so"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3071.994,"endTime":3073.733,"body":"wonderful to talk to you both,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3073.733,"endTime":3076.704,"body":"the two people I really respect,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3073.733,"endTime":3076.704,"body":"and have great connection with,"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3076.704,"endTime":3079.313,"body":"and it's so nice to be able to"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3076.704,"endTime":3079.313,"body":"spend time with you. And, you"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3079.318,"endTime":3081.0,"body":"know, I guess recorded, but ..."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3079.318,"endTime":3081.0,"body":"just to-"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3081.0,"endTime":3081.3,"body":"Yeah, sure."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3081.1,"endTime":3081.713,"body":"-spend time with you is"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3081.1,"endTime":3081.713,"body":"really nice."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":3081.728,"endTime":3082.148,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3082.628,"endTime":3085.478,"body":"Yeah. Agreed. Alright."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3082.628,"endTime":3085.478,"body":"Yeah, we'll talk to you later."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":3085.778,"endTime":3086.349,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3086.423,"endTime":3087.264,"body":"Oh, you talk to me now"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3086.423,"endTime":3087.264,"body":"[Ryan and Bekah laugh]."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3089.139,"endTime":3090.159,"body":"Oh, and also later."},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3090.713,"endTime":3092.454,"body":"And also later. Yeah. I"},{"speaker":"Ryan","startTime":3090.713,"endTime":3092.454,"body":"love you, guys."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3092.739,"endTime":3093.0,"body":"Alright."},{"speaker":"Bekah","startTime":3093.0,"endTime":3093.3,"body":"Bye."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3093.3,"endTime":3099.137,"body":"Bye, Ryan. Thank you for"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3093.3,"endTime":3099.137,"body":"listening to this episode of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3099.137,"endTime":3102.893,"body":"the Virtual Coffee Podcast. This"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3099.137,"endTime":3102.893,"body":"episode was produced by Dan Ott"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3102.943,"endTime":3105.873,"body":"and Bekah Hawrot Weigel. If you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3102.943,"endTime":3105.873,"body":"have questions or comments, you"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3105.873,"endTime":3109.123,"body":"can hit us up on Twitter at"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3105.873,"endTime":3109.123,"body":"VirtualCoffeeIO, or email us at"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3109.123,"endTime":3110.857,"body":"podcast@virtualcoffee.io. You"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3109.123,"endTime":3110.857,"body":"can find the show notes, sign up"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3110.857,"endTime":3112.591,"body":"for"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3112.592,"endTime":3114.632,"body":"the newsletter, check out any of"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3112.592,"endTime":3114.632,"body":"our other resources on our"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3114.632,"endTime":3118.023,"body":"website, virtualcoffee.io. If"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3114.632,"endTime":3118.023,"body":"you're interested in sponsoring"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3118.023,"endTime":3120.422,"body":"Virtual Coffee, you can find out"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3118.023,"endTime":3120.422,"body":"more information on our website"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3120.693,"endTime":3125.132,"body":"at virtualcoffee.io/sponsorship."},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3120.693,"endTime":3125.132,"body":"Please subscribe to our podcast,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3125.163,"endTime":3126.768,"body":"and be sure to leave us a"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3125.163,"endTime":3126.768,"body":"review. Thanks for listening,"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3126.768,"endTime":3128.373,"body":"and we'll"},{"speaker":"Dan","startTime":3128.373,"endTime":3129.213,"body":"see you next week!"}]}