{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":14.099,"endTime":16.829,"body":"Hello, and"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":14.099,"endTime":16.829,"body":"welcome to season 1, episode"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":16.829,"endTime":23.16,"body":"6 of the Virtual Coffee podcast."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":16.829,"endTime":23.16,"body":"I'm Bekah, and this is"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":23.16,"endTime":26.1,"body":"a podcast that features members"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":23.16,"endTime":26.1,"body":"of the Virtual Coffee community."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":26.64,"endTime":29.82,"body":"Virtual Coffee is an intimate"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":26.64,"endTime":29.82,"body":"group of developers at all"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":29.82,"endTime":32.85,"body":"stages of their coding journey."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":29.82,"endTime":32.85,"body":"And they're here on this podcast"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":32.85,"endTime":36.03,"body":"sharing their stories and what"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":32.85,"endTime":36.03,"body":"they've learned. And we're here"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":36.03,"endTime":39.99,"body":"to share it with you. Here with"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":36.03,"endTime":39.99,"body":"me today is my co-host, Dan."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":41.159,"endTime":44.759,"body":"Thanks, Bekah. In this"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":41.159,"endTime":44.759,"body":"episode, you'll hear from Drew"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":44.789,"endTime":48.539,"body":"Clements. Drew is a career"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":44.789,"endTime":48.539,"body":"transitioner, a father of two"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":48.539,"endTime":52.109,"body":"and full time developer. And he"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":48.539,"endTime":52.109,"body":"spends his spare time building"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":52.14,"endTime":55.799,"body":"protege.dev and hopes to become"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":52.14,"endTime":55.799,"body":"a strong advocate for junior"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":55.799,"endTime":59.13,"body":"developers everywhere. In this"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":55.799,"endTime":59.13,"body":"episode, we talk about building"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":59.13,"endTime":62.939,"body":"a career and also Drew's"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":59.13,"endTime":62.939,"body":"experience building protege.dev"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":63.03,"endTime":67.29,"body":"the platform curated with remote"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":63.03,"endTime":67.29,"body":"jobs for junior developers. Drew"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":67.29,"endTime":70.56,"body":"talks about the struggles of"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":67.29,"endTime":70.56,"body":"junior level job searching, the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":70.59,"endTime":73.14,"body":"importance of supportive company"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":70.59,"endTime":73.14,"body":"culture, and learning and"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":73.14,"endTime":74.489,"body":"public, while building Protege."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":75.15,"endTime":77.34,"body":"We start"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":75.15,"endTime":77.34,"body":"every episode of the podcast"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":77.34,"endTime":80.7,"body":"like we start every Virtual"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":77.34,"endTime":80.7,"body":"Coffee. We introduce ourselves"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":80.7,"endTime":83.939,"body":"with our name, where we're from,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":80.7,"endTime":83.939,"body":"what we do, and a random"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":83.939,"endTime":88.079,"body":"check-in question. Today's"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":83.939,"endTime":88.079,"body":"question is, what is the most"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":88.079,"endTime":92.909,"body":"beautiful place near where you"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":88.079,"endTime":92.909,"body":"live? We hope you enjoyed this"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":92.909,"endTime":104.819,"body":"episode. Hey, I'm Bekah, I'm a"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":92.909,"endTime":104.819,"body":"front end"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":101.609,"endTime":109.14,"body":"developer from a small town in"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":101.609,"endTime":109.14,"body":"Ohio and the most beautiful"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":104.819,"endTime":113.04,"body":"place near me, I don't really"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":104.819,"endTime":113.04,"body":"know. But it snowed a lot last"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":109.14,"endTime":115.95,"body":"night. And so all of the pine"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":109.14,"endTime":115.95,"body":"trees look really, really"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":113.04,"endTime":118.17,"body":"beautiful. So I'm just gonna go"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":113.04,"endTime":118.17,"body":"with pine trees covered with"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":115.95,"endTime":118.17,"body":"snow."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":119.14,"endTime":121.93,"body":"That's awesome. I love"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":119.14,"endTime":121.93,"body":"how everything looks with snow"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":121.93,"endTime":126.67,"body":"on it. Hi, I'm Dan. I am a front"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":121.93,"endTime":126.67,"body":"end developer from"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":126.7,"endTime":129.37,"body":"Cleveland, Ohio. I say Cleveland"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":126.7,"endTime":129.37,"body":"every time I'm actually from"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":129.37,"endTime":131.904,"body":"Lakewood, which is first city,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":129.37,"endTime":131.904,"body":"West of Cleveland. And so there"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":131.904,"endTime":134.438,"body":"is a"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":134.469,"endTime":138.849,"body":"park called Lakewood Park that's"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":134.469,"endTime":138.849,"body":"on the lake here. And it's very"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":138.849,"endTime":141.4,"body":"beautiful. There's lots of, it's"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":138.849,"endTime":141.4,"body":"big, and there's lots of"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":141.43,"endTime":144.789,"body":"cool little spots to hang out."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":141.43,"endTime":144.789,"body":"So that's that."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":146.52,"endTime":150.449,"body":"I'm Drew. I'm a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":146.52,"endTime":150.449,"body":"front end developer with Foster"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":150.449,"endTime":156.75,"body":"Commerce. The most beautiful"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":150.449,"endTime":156.75,"body":"place near where I live. I live"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":156.75,"endTime":162.27,"body":"in the south. So my options are"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":156.75,"endTime":162.27,"body":"limited here. So I'm like five"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":162.27,"endTime":164.849,"body":"minutes from St. Simons Island."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":162.27,"endTime":164.849,"body":"But the beaches aren't"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":164.849,"endTime":168.659,"body":"necessarily pretty. They just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":164.849,"endTime":168.659,"body":"have expensive resorts. And I'm"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":168.659,"endTime":171.599,"body":"like, I'm just out to Savannah."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":168.659,"endTime":171.599,"body":"So they have a pretty rad"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":171.599,"endTime":174.104,"body":"downtown. But okay, I got one. I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":171.599,"endTime":174.104,"body":"got one. On the other side of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":174.104,"endTime":176.609,"body":"the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":176.61,"endTime":180.18,"body":"state from me, which is still"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":176.61,"endTime":180.18,"body":"relatively close compared to you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":180.18,"endTime":184.5,"body":"guys. We have, they call it the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":180.18,"endTime":184.5,"body":"little Grand Canyon. It's a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":184.5,"endTime":187.349,"body":"little hiking trail. It really"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":184.5,"endTime":187.349,"body":"does just look like a miniature"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":187.349,"endTime":188.4,"body":"version of the Grand Canyon."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":188.65,"endTime":191.5,"body":"Nice. That's cool. That"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":188.65,"endTime":191.5,"body":"sounds cool. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":191.71,"endTime":196.21,"body":"Vacation"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":191.71,"endTime":196.21,"body":"2021. Well, welcome, Drew, we"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":196.21,"endTime":201.37,"body":"are very happy to have you and"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":196.21,"endTime":201.37,"body":"fun fact about Drew, he designed"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":201.37,"endTime":204.31,"body":"the Virtual Coffee logo. So"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":201.37,"endTime":204.31,"body":"thanks for that."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":204.93,"endTime":205.68,"body":"I do what I can."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":204.93,"endTime":205.68,"body":"(laugh)"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":207.659,"endTime":209.819,"body":"We always"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":207.659,"endTime":209.819,"body":"like to start off with the"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":209.849,"endTime":214.53,"body":"origin story of how you got into"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":209.849,"endTime":214.53,"body":"tech. So can you give us a"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":214.53,"endTime":215.129,"body":"little background?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":217.069,"endTime":221.0,"body":"Yeah, that's, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":217.069,"endTime":221.0,"body":"feel like my story into tech is"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":221.0,"endTime":227.03,"body":"like a story linked to a story"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":221.0,"endTime":227.03,"body":"linked to a story. So growing"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":227.03,"endTime":230.719,"body":"up, I played in bunch of punk"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":227.03,"endTime":230.719,"body":"rock bands. One of the last"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":230.719,"endTime":234.77,"body":"bands I played in, I met a guy"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":230.719,"endTime":234.77,"body":"from the local music scene named"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":234.77,"endTime":238.729,"body":"Sean. Sean moved away to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":234.77,"endTime":238.729,"body":"California and became a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":238.729,"endTime":242.044,"body":"developer. Right before he did"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":238.729,"endTime":242.044,"body":"that, I tattooed him. Me"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":242.044,"endTime":245.359,"body":"tattooing"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":245.479,"endTime":250.4,"body":"landed me in apprenticeship as a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":245.479,"endTime":250.4,"body":"designer a few years later,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":251.27,"endTime":255.889,"body":"which then let me, that's where"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":251.27,"endTime":255.889,"body":"I was kind of introduced to like"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":255.889,"endTime":260.72,"body":"HTML and CSS. So I was like,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":255.889,"endTime":260.72,"body":"hey, I'm learning this stuff. I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":260.72,"endTime":262.819,"body":"remember Shawn was doing"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":260.72,"endTime":262.819,"body":"something like this. So then I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":262.819,"endTime":265.25,"body":"reached back out to him. Me and"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":262.819,"endTime":265.25,"body":"him started kind of talking"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":265.25,"endTime":272.3,"body":"again. So from there, I was able"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":265.25,"endTime":272.3,"body":"to kind of work into a developer"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":272.3,"endTime":280.04,"body":"role with that same company. And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":272.3,"endTime":280.04,"body":"left tattooing. So it's, it's a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":280.04,"endTime":284.3,"body":"guy I met through the local"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":280.04,"endTime":284.3,"body":"music scene in 2010 ended up"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":284.3,"endTime":289.879,"body":"getting me into developing a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":284.3,"endTime":289.879,"body":"decade later. Yeah, so I spent"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":289.879,"endTime":293.329,"body":"seven years as a tattoo artist,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":289.879,"endTime":293.329,"body":"transitioned to graphic design."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":293.329,"endTime":296.779,"body":"From graphic design, I used to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":293.329,"endTime":296.779,"body":"know that Sean, the old"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":296.779,"endTime":302.93,"body":"connection, to get my way here."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":296.779,"endTime":302.93,"body":"And I don't think I could have"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":302.93,"endTime":305.42,"body":"made that happen if I had all"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":302.93,"endTime":305.42,"body":"the money in the world and 10"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":305.42,"endTime":307.16,"body":"years to plan it, but here I am."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":308.54,"endTime":310.939,"body":"That's"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":308.54,"endTime":310.939,"body":"awesome. So if we ever have a"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":310.939,"endTime":314.3,"body":"Virtual Coffee on-site"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":310.939,"endTime":314.3,"body":"conference, are you going to"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":314.3,"endTime":317.36,"body":"offer tattoos? All Virtual"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":314.3,"endTime":317.36,"body":"Coffee logos?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":318.98,"endTime":320.3,"body":"(laugh) Yes, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":318.98,"endTime":320.3,"body":"will do that."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":320.42,"endTime":322.579,"body":"All right,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":320.42,"endTime":322.579,"body":"we have it recorded. So now you"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":322.579,"endTime":329.3,"body":"can't back out. Okay, so I'm"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":322.579,"endTime":329.3,"body":"also want to know about how you"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":329.3,"endTime":334.939,"body":"found Virtual Coffee. I feel"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":329.3,"endTime":334.939,"body":"like I have known you longer, a"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":334.939,"endTime":338.99,"body":"lot longer than Virtual Coffee"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":334.939,"endTime":338.99,"body":"has been going on. So. But how"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":338.99,"endTime":340.85,"body":"did you end up at Virtual"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":338.99,"endTime":340.85,"body":"Coffee?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":342.23,"endTime":346.459,"body":"How did I end up"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":342.23,"endTime":346.459,"body":"with Virtual Coffee? It's funny"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":346.459,"endTime":349.37,"body":"enough that we're recording this"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":346.459,"endTime":349.37,"body":"on a podcast because I met you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":350.089,"endTime":352.879,"body":"through reaching out to find"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":350.089,"endTime":352.879,"body":"people to interview for a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":352.879,"endTime":357.74,"body":"podcast I was going to start."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":352.879,"endTime":357.74,"body":"So, so I have the recording"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":357.829,"endTime":359.72,"body":"actually. I don't know if it, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":357.829,"endTime":359.72,"body":"don't know if it ever got"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":359.72,"endTime":362.86,"body":"editing. I don't (laugh). I just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":359.72,"endTime":362.86,"body":"had it right here on the desk."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":362.86,"endTime":366.0,"body":"No. So, I guess in 2019, I was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":362.86,"endTime":366.0,"body":"going to start a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":366.0,"endTime":368.669,"body":"podcast, I reached out to you."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":366.0,"endTime":368.669,"body":"We connected on Twitter. That"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":368.669,"endTime":371.338,"body":"never"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":366.139,"endTime":374.939,"body":"ended up happening. But we, when"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":371.339,"endTime":378.42,"body":"I saw you posting, so at the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":371.339,"endTime":378.42,"body":"beginning of 2020, I was, I was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":374.939,"endTime":377.939,"body":"working two jobs. I was working"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":374.939,"endTime":377.939,"body":"full time as a designer,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":377.939,"endTime":380.939,"body":"part-time"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":378.42,"endTime":383.55,"body":"as a developer. An awesome, both"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":378.42,"endTime":383.55,"body":"of those job"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":380.939,"endTime":387.839,"body":"within like 24 hours of each"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":380.939,"endTime":387.839,"body":"other. And with a wife that was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":383.55,"endTime":391.8,"body":"five months pregnant, that was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":383.55,"endTime":391.8,"body":"kind of like a gut"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":387.839,"endTime":395.639,"body":"check. But around that same time"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":387.839,"endTime":395.639,"body":"was when you'd posted about"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":391.8,"endTime":399.329,"body":"Virtual Coffee. So like, you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":391.8,"endTime":399.329,"body":"know, I have a lot of spare time"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":395.639,"endTime":401.699,"body":"on my hands, Bekah posts a lot"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":395.639,"endTime":401.699,"body":"of awesome stuff, we had a great"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":399.329,"endTime":406.649,"body":"conversation when we recorded"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":399.329,"endTime":406.649,"body":"our podcast episode together. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":401.699,"endTime":411.689,"body":"I was like, yeah, let me, let me"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":401.699,"endTime":411.689,"body":"check this out and see what"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":406.649,"endTime":421.8,"body":"happens. And now you can't get"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":406.649,"endTime":421.8,"body":"rid of me. (laugh)"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":419.16,"endTime":422.505,"body":"I think"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":419.16,"endTime":422.505,"body":"that podcast episode that I"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":422.505,"endTime":425.85,"body":"recorded with you, I had just"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":421.8,"endTime":429.029,"body":"been working with Dan for a"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":421.8,"endTime":429.029,"body":"couple of months. And I like was"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":425.85,"endTime":431.55,"body":"still trying to wrap my head"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":425.85,"endTime":431.55,"body":"around things. And I remember"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":429.029,"endTime":434.16,"body":"you asking me questions and I"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":429.029,"endTime":434.16,"body":"were like, I don't even know the"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":431.55,"endTime":433.904,"body":"words that I should use to"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":431.55,"endTime":433.904,"body":"answer those questions. So..."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":433.904,"endTime":436.258,"body":"(laugh)"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":437.97,"endTime":440.1,"body":"If it's any"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":437.97,"endTime":440.1,"body":"consolation, there's still a lot"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":440.1,"endTime":441.404,"body":"of times I don't know the words"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":440.1,"endTime":441.404,"body":"I should use to answer"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":441.404,"endTime":442.708,"body":"questions. (laugh)"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":443.16,"endTime":444.449,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":443.16,"endTime":444.449,"body":"that's for sure. Same."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":444.449,"endTime":446.774,"body":"Same. (laugh) But it was. It was"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":444.449,"endTime":446.774,"body":"like, it was really great"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":446.774,"endTime":449.099,"body":"podcast"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":449.1,"endTime":454.649,"body":"interview because you're just"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":449.1,"endTime":454.649,"body":"some fun to be around, I guess."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":454.649,"endTime":459.3,"body":"So, I'm happy that you are here"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":454.649,"endTime":459.3,"body":"with us today. And at Virtual"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":459.3,"endTime":459.81,"body":"Coffee."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":460.319,"endTime":463.199,"body":"Happy to be here."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":460.319,"endTime":463.199,"body":"Like I said you can't get rid of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":463.199,"endTime":463.379,"body":"me."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":465.629,"endTime":467.834,"body":"(laugh) Um,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":465.629,"endTime":467.834,"body":"okay, so fast forward a little"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":467.834,"endTime":470.039,"body":"bit,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":470.1,"endTime":472.38,"body":"you got another job, your career"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":470.1,"endTime":472.38,"body":"changer. And you're like, oh"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":472.38,"endTime":474.66,"body":"hey,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":474.66,"endTime":481.139,"body":"I bought this domain called"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":474.66,"endTime":481.139,"body":"protege.dev. So on top of all of"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":481.139,"endTime":485.069,"body":"the other things that I'm doing,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":481.139,"endTime":485.069,"body":"I'm, I'm gonna start this"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":485.279,"endTime":490.23,"body":"community building project. So,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":485.279,"endTime":490.23,"body":"why and how?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":491.05,"endTime":492.999,"body":"Why and how?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":491.05,"endTime":492.999,"body":"Well, so, I originally bought"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":492.999,"endTime":494.948,"body":"the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":494.949,"endTime":497.334,"body":"Protege domain... To the back up"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":494.949,"endTime":497.334,"body":"just a little bit. I had an old"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":497.334,"endTime":499.719,"body":"side"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":499.72,"endTime":503.29,"body":"project called ColtXP. It's a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":499.72,"endTime":503.29,"body":"really bad name. Never name"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":503.29,"endTime":506.8,"body":"anything that ever. But that's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":503.29,"endTime":506.8,"body":"what the original podcast that I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":506.8,"endTime":510.339,"body":"interviewed you for, was going"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":506.8,"endTime":510.339,"body":"to kind of be in parallel with"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":510.339,"endTime":516.789,"body":"that. And so I, I knew that it"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":510.339,"endTime":516.789,"body":"was a bad name. So I was trying"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":516.789,"endTime":518.679,"body":"to think of something, something"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":516.789,"endTime":518.679,"body":"else I could call it. The idea"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":518.679,"endTime":520.569,"body":"of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":520.57,"endTime":523.84,"body":"that project was that it was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":520.57,"endTime":523.84,"body":"gonna be pretty much a place"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":523.84,"endTime":528.429,"body":"where people could connect to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":523.84,"endTime":528.429,"body":"work on open source issues"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":528.429,"endTime":531.73,"body":"together, kind of like a junior"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":528.429,"endTime":531.73,"body":"finding a senior willing to, you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":531.73,"endTime":536.11,"body":"know, give them some time. So I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":531.73,"endTime":536.11,"body":"was just trying to think the,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":536.139,"endTime":541.929,"body":"the name ColtXP, uhm... I think"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":536.139,"endTime":541.929,"body":"I just used like a Thesaurus or"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":541.929,"endTime":544.539,"body":"something like, what's another"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":541.929,"endTime":544.539,"body":"word for someone that's learning"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":544.539,"endTime":548.259,"body":"something or something like"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":544.539,"endTime":548.259,"body":"that. And Colt was somehow on"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":548.259,"endTime":550.539,"body":"that list. It was like an"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":548.259,"endTime":550.539,"body":"inexperienced person or"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":550.539,"endTime":555.19,"body":"something like that. Again,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":550.539,"endTime":555.19,"body":"horrible name. Don't ever call"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":555.19,"endTime":561.909,"body":"anything yet. So I came across"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":555.19,"endTime":561.909,"body":"the word protege, you know,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":561.94,"endTime":565.21,"body":"pretty obvious. I don't know why"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":561.94,"endTime":565.21,"body":"I didn't think of it in the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":565.21,"endTime":569.23,"body":"first place. So I was looking"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":565.21,"endTime":569.23,"body":"around on different domains."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":569.259,"endTime":572.139,"body":"Actually, no. I went to Netlify."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":569.259,"endTime":572.139,"body":"And I was like, let me see if"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":572.2,"endTime":575.769,"body":"protege.com is available."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":572.2,"endTime":575.769,"body":"Obviously, it wasn't. So I was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":575.769,"endTime":579.58,"body":"like, let me see if protege.dev"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":575.769,"endTime":579.58,"body":"is available. It was. For 15"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":579.58,"endTime":584.59,"body":"bucks. I was like that's not bad"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":579.58,"endTime":584.59,"body":"at all. So I hit the next button"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":584.59,"endTime":588.46,"body":"expecting there to be like"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":584.59,"endTime":588.46,"body":"insert payment information. And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":588.46,"endTime":591.715,"body":"it said, congratulations. I was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":588.46,"endTime":591.715,"body":"like uh... okay. I guess this is"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":591.715,"endTime":594.97,"body":"a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":594.97,"endTime":599.799,"body":"thing now. So I kind of went"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":594.97,"endTime":599.799,"body":"back and forth on do I want to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":599.799,"endTime":603.669,"body":"make that something new with"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":599.799,"endTime":603.669,"body":"that name, do I want to rebrand"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":603.669,"endTime":609.399,"body":"the old project under Protege,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":603.669,"endTime":609.399,"body":"which was the original idea. But"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":609.399,"endTime":615.669,"body":"then, but then COVID happened,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":609.399,"endTime":615.669,"body":"and I lost, I lost both of those"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":615.669,"endTime":618.34,"body":"jobs. So I think, I think I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":615.669,"endTime":618.34,"body":"accidentally bought the domain"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":619.029,"endTime":624.97,"body":"in February and then in March"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":619.029,"endTime":624.97,"body":"was when I lost work. So, you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":624.97,"endTime":627.039,"body":"know, I was looking, I lost"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":624.97,"endTime":627.039,"body":"work, so I was looking at all"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":627.039,"endTime":629.47,"body":"the job boards all the time. And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":627.039,"endTime":629.47,"body":"it was, you know, you see"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":629.47,"endTime":633.7,"body":"senior, senior, senior lead,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":629.47,"endTime":633.7,"body":"tech lead, bla bla bla bla. And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":633.7,"endTime":636.7,"body":"I was like, there's like,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":633.7,"endTime":636.7,"body":"there's nothing, it's so"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":636.7,"endTime":640.36,"body":"hard to find anything for"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":636.7,"endTime":640.36,"body":"someone at my skill level. So I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":640.36,"endTime":642.37,"body":"was like, you know what? I'm"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":640.36,"endTime":642.37,"body":"just gonna build the job board"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":642.37,"endTime":647.98,"body":"that I wish I had. And that's,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":642.37,"endTime":647.98,"body":"that's kind of how it ended up"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":647.98,"endTime":653.71,"body":"getting started. I lost, I lost"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":647.98,"endTime":653.71,"body":"my job and gave myself a new"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":653.71,"endTime":657.159,"body":"one (laugh). A new one that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":653.71,"endTime":657.159,"body":"doesn't pay anything."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":658.32,"endTime":661.169,"body":"I love that, I love the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":658.32,"endTime":661.169,"body":"idea of like, you just, you have"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":661.169,"endTime":665.669,"body":"a problem, you know, and so you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":661.169,"endTime":665.669,"body":"just decided to fix it (laugh),"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":666.779,"endTime":667.529,"body":"to fix it yourself, right?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":667.678,"endTime":669.239,"body":"That's, that's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":667.678,"endTime":669.239,"body":"pretty much what happened."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":669.568,"endTime":672.568,"body":"Yeah, it's amazing. And"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":669.568,"endTime":672.568,"body":"then on top of that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":672.568,"endTime":674.639,"body":"you know you're going to gain"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":672.568,"endTime":674.639,"body":"experience for yourself, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":674.639,"endTime":680.308,"body":"know? And building it, right? We"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":674.639,"endTime":680.308,"body":"were just talking to Vic. And"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":680.339,"endTime":683.458,"body":"he's talking about a lot of this"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":680.339,"endTime":683.458,"body":"sort of the same thing, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":683.458,"endTime":686.519,"body":"Like the, he frames it a little"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":683.458,"endTime":686.519,"body":"differently. But the indie, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":686.519,"endTime":690.418,"body":"know, indie hacking mentality,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":686.519,"endTime":690.418,"body":"right? Of, you have a problem."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":690.418,"endTime":694.019,"body":"And so instead of, I don't know,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":690.418,"endTime":694.019,"body":"wandering around, or just being"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":694.019,"endTime":697.288,"body":"sad, you know, right? Like, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":694.019,"endTime":697.288,"body":"just kind of go and, go and dive"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":697.288,"endTime":701.788,"body":"into it, right? And hopefully,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":697.288,"endTime":701.788,"body":"it becomes a successful product."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":701.788,"endTime":704.609,"body":"And also, you know, you're"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":701.788,"endTime":704.609,"body":"giving yourself like, experience"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":704.609,"endTime":706.828,"body":"and scratching your own itch and"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":704.609,"endTime":706.828,"body":"all that stuff. That's great."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":706.86,"endTime":710.549,"body":"Yeah, the, when I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":706.86,"endTime":710.549,"body":"first started out on Protege, my"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":710.549,"endTime":715.11,"body":"mindset was, you know, I'm going"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":710.549,"endTime":715.11,"body":"to build this thing in React, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":715.11,"endTime":719.429,"body":"need, I needed a React project"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":715.11,"endTime":719.429,"body":"on my portfolio. So I told"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":719.429,"endTime":723.12,"body":"myself, like, I'm gonna, I'm"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":719.429,"endTime":723.12,"body":"gonna build this out. And if it"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":723.12,"endTime":727.86,"body":"works, awesome. If not, then I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":723.12,"endTime":727.86,"body":"have something on a resume that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":727.95,"endTime":731.46,"body":"will maybe at least helped get"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":727.95,"endTime":731.46,"body":"me hired, which it actually did,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":731.49,"endTime":734.129,"body":"fairly, fairly early on. So I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":731.49,"endTime":734.129,"body":"think I started building it in"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":734.129,"endTime":739.44,"body":"March. And either at the end of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":734.129,"endTime":739.44,"body":"March or early April, I was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":739.44,"endTime":743.25,"body":"connected with a company called"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":739.44,"endTime":743.25,"body":"Layer Frame out of Florida,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":743.279,"endTime":748.74,"body":"super awesome team. And the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":743.279,"endTime":748.74,"body":"workout done on Protege, even at"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":748.74,"endTime":753.45,"body":"that point, before it was even"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":748.74,"endTime":753.45,"body":"done. Just the fact that I was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":753.509,"endTime":756.87,"body":"doing that, you know, building"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":753.509,"endTime":756.87,"body":"that product, but also the work"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":756.87,"endTime":760.334,"body":"I'd put into it myself, pretty"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":756.87,"endTime":760.334,"body":"much jumping in blind was one"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":760.334,"endTime":763.798,"body":"of,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":763.799,"endTime":766.529,"body":"one of the reasons that they can"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":763.799,"endTime":766.529,"body":"even consider to bring me on"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":766.529,"endTime":770.399,"body":"the team. So it saved me almost"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":766.529,"endTime":770.399,"body":"immediately."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":771.84,"endTime":773.669,"body":"I think"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":771.84,"endTime":773.669,"body":"that's so great. I think there's"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":773.73,"endTime":778.919,"body":"a tendency when you are starting"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":773.73,"endTime":778.919,"body":"out as an entry level dev to"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":778.919,"endTime":781.62,"body":"just keep going through the"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":778.919,"endTime":781.62,"body":"tutorials, right? And there's"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":781.62,"endTime":785.039,"body":"nothing wrong with that. But"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":781.62,"endTime":785.039,"body":"there's so many different people"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":785.039,"endTime":788.399,"body":"that are doing those same"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":785.039,"endTime":788.399,"body":"projects. So if you're able to"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":788.399,"endTime":791.309,"body":"do something where you're"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":788.399,"endTime":791.309,"body":"building something that you're"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":791.309,"endTime":794.279,"body":"interested in, or something that"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":791.309,"endTime":794.279,"body":"solves a problem for you, you're"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":794.279,"endTime":797.49,"body":"a little bit invested in it, but"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":794.279,"endTime":797.49,"body":"it also shows that, hey, look,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":797.49,"endTime":801.36,"body":"you know, I tackled this"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":797.49,"endTime":801.36,"body":"problem, and I kept adding to it"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":801.36,"endTime":805.259,"body":"and growing with it. And I think"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":801.36,"endTime":805.259,"body":"that really shows, you know, a"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":805.259,"endTime":808.049,"body":"really good representation of"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":805.259,"endTime":808.049,"body":"who you are as a coder."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":810.639,"endTime":815.11,"body":"Yeah, you mentioned"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":810.639,"endTime":815.11,"body":"like, when you were describing"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":815.11,"endTime":817.134,"body":"talking to the company who hired"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":815.11,"endTime":817.134,"body":"you after that, that you went"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":817.134,"endTime":819.158,"body":"into"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":819.159,"endTime":822.97,"body":"the, the Protege project going"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":819.159,"endTime":822.97,"body":"in blind. And I was, I was"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":822.97,"endTime":826.36,"body":"wondering, like, what you like,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":822.97,"endTime":826.36,"body":"in hindsight, like, what do you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":826.809,"endTime":828.879,"body":"think of when you say that,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":826.809,"endTime":828.879,"body":"like, what pieces were you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":828.879,"endTime":832.659,"body":"missing, you know? Now that"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":828.879,"endTime":832.659,"body":"you've gone through the whole"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":832.659,"endTime":836.019,"body":"process, and it's been a"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":832.659,"endTime":836.019,"body":"product, you know, for however"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":836.019,"endTime":837.474,"body":"long, I just looked at my watch"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":836.019,"endTime":837.474,"body":"to see what month it was. I"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":837.474,"endTime":838.929,"body":"don't know"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":838.929,"endTime":840.294,"body":"what I'm doing. But, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":838.929,"endTime":840.294,"body":"it's, it's been a, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":840.294,"endTime":841.659,"body":"it's"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":841.659,"endTime":843.789,"body":"been live for how many months?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":843.789,"endTime":844.614,"body":"Coming up on a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":843.789,"endTime":844.614,"body":"year. I think March will be a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":844.614,"endTime":845.439,"body":"year."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":845.44,"endTime":851.049,"body":"Okay, yeah. So I guess"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":845.44,"endTime":851.049,"body":"my question is (laugh), my"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":851.049,"endTime":853.299,"body":"question is like, what, what do"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":851.049,"endTime":853.299,"body":"you know, now that like, would"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":853.299,"endTime":856.24,"body":"change your approach, if"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":853.299,"endTime":856.24,"body":"anything, you know? If you would"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":856.24,"endTime":859.21,"body":"start, if you were starting"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":856.24,"endTime":859.21,"body":"protege.dev right now?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":859.45,"endTime":862.195,"body":"How much time do"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":859.45,"endTime":862.195,"body":"you have? (laugh) It was, so,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":862.195,"endTime":864.94,"body":"the initial"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":864.94,"endTime":869.679,"body":"build was just a regular Create"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":864.94,"endTime":869.679,"body":"React App. That was intentional,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":869.679,"endTime":872.11,"body":"because I wanted to force myself"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":869.679,"endTime":872.11,"body":"to learn some of the lower level"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":872.11,"endTime":880.419,"body":"plumbing. I wish I would have"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":872.11,"endTime":880.419,"body":"known more about state"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":880.419,"endTime":885.85,"body":"management in React. Like I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":880.419,"endTime":885.85,"body":"kinda... So, right before this"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":885.85,"endTime":887.71,"body":"episode, we were talking about"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":885.85,"endTime":887.71,"body":"how some of the, some of the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":887.71,"endTime":891.37,"body":"parts of it are really just a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":887.71,"endTime":891.37,"body":"juggling act until, you know, it"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":891.37,"endTime":898.419,"body":"either dies or does what it's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":891.37,"endTime":898.419,"body":"supposed to do. So I think, if I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":898.419,"endTime":900.37,"body":"would have known a little bit"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":898.419,"endTime":900.37,"body":"more around that, that could"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":900.37,"endTime":905.08,"body":"have been, I don't think it's an"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":900.37,"endTime":905.08,"body":"unstable system. But it's not as"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":905.08,"endTime":907.84,"body":"good as it can be. And I'm"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":905.08,"endTime":907.84,"body":"actually in the process of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":907.84,"endTime":914.11,"body":"rewriting some of that work now."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":907.84,"endTime":914.11,"body":"And I expect I'm going to be"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":914.11,"endTime":918.25,"body":"able to eliminate probably about"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":914.11,"endTime":918.25,"body":"40% of what's there now, and"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":918.25,"endTime":922.539,"body":"have something that works better"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":918.25,"endTime":922.539,"body":"in, you know, with better"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":922.539,"endTime":926.83,"body":"practices in place at the same"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":922.539,"endTime":926.83,"body":"time. Also I didn't really know"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":926.83,"endTime":929.184,"body":"much about, like component"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":926.83,"endTime":929.184,"body":"systems, like I knew what"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":929.184,"endTime":931.538,"body":"components"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":931.539,"endTime":935.2,"body":"were, but I didn't really have a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":931.539,"endTime":935.2,"body":"good idea of how to utilize them"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":935.2,"endTime":937.539,"body":"correctly, which is another"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":935.2,"endTime":937.539,"body":"thing I've been kind of cleaning"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":937.539,"endTime":940.779,"body":"up as I've been doing this"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":937.539,"endTime":940.779,"body":"rebuild. We're converting from"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":940.899,"endTime":947.08,"body":"React, Create React App to Next"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":940.899,"endTime":947.08,"body":"right now. So I mean, even just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":947.08,"endTime":949.149,"body":"last night, I was looking at"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":947.08,"endTime":949.149,"body":"some stuff like why didn't I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":949.149,"endTime":952.299,"body":"just make this a component"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":949.149,"endTime":952.299,"body":"rather than pasting it seven"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":952.33,"endTime":957.519,"body":"times in the same place? Yeah."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":952.33,"endTime":957.519,"body":"So, just, just little stuff like"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":957.519,"endTime":957.909,"body":"that."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":958.678,"endTime":960.568,"body":"It's"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":958.678,"endTime":960.568,"body":"interesting. I used to write"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":960.568,"endTime":963.989,"body":"screenplays with my brother. And"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":960.568,"endTime":963.989,"body":"one of the first bits of advice"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":963.989,"endTime":967.828,"body":"someone told me or I heard, it"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":963.989,"endTime":967.828,"body":"was write your whole screenplay,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":967.859,"endTime":971.818,"body":"and then cut 50% and then"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":967.859,"endTime":971.818,"body":"rewrite it. And like, as you're"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":971.818,"endTime":975.629,"body":"talking through this, that kind"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":971.818,"endTime":975.629,"body":"of makes sense to me in terms of"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":975.629,"endTime":978.778,"body":"like, okay, you have something"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":975.629,"endTime":978.778,"body":"down and you learned a lot in"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":978.778,"endTime":982.078,"body":"that first process. But what you"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":978.778,"endTime":982.078,"body":"learn should enable you to"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":982.259,"endTime":985.469,"body":"really tighten things up and"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":982.259,"endTime":985.469,"body":"getting it working efficiently"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":985.469,"endTime":988.649,"body":"or, or making it an effective"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":985.469,"endTime":988.649,"body":"story and codes not that"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":988.649,"endTime":989.548,"body":"different from that."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":990.98,"endTime":994.039,"body":"Yeah, that was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":990.98,"endTime":994.039,"body":"what Andy's, the co-founder, he"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":994.039,"endTime":998.059,"body":"came on really early on with me."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":994.039,"endTime":998.059,"body":"One, one thing we were very"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":998.059,"endTime":1001.299,"body":"adamant about when we were"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":998.059,"endTime":1001.299,"body":"starting up was that we're going"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1001.299,"endTime":1008.47,"body":"to try to build as much of this"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1001.299,"endTime":1008.47,"body":"as possible without a library,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1008.47,"endTime":1012.129,"body":"if we can. So that's why, that's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1008.47,"endTime":1012.129,"body":"why a lot of the state"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1012.129,"endTime":1015.009,"body":"management with some of the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1012.129,"endTime":1015.009,"body":"forms are a bit of a juggling"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1015.009,"endTime":1017.919,"body":"act, because we knew there was,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1015.009,"endTime":1017.919,"body":"you know, Redux and other things"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1017.919,"endTime":1022.57,"body":"like that out there. But we"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1017.919,"endTime":1022.57,"body":"wanted to kind of put ourselves"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1022.57,"endTime":1026.619,"body":"in the uncomfortable position of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1022.57,"endTime":1026.619,"body":"having to build it, the only"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1026.859,"endTime":1030.67,"body":"having to build it with whatever"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1026.859,"endTime":1030.67,"body":"we had available to us then,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1031.029,"endTime":1033.849,"body":"without grabbing something off"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1031.029,"endTime":1033.849,"body":"the shelf. And... I mean, he"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1033.849,"endTime":1036.669,"body":"would"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1036.67,"endTime":1040.9,"body":"probably agree, we both"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1036.67,"endTime":1040.9,"body":"probably, we learned, we learned"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1040.9,"endTime":1044.95,"body":"a lot of wrong ways to handle"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1040.9,"endTime":1044.95,"body":"state React. We learned a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1044.95,"endTime":1047.89,"body":"lot of ways that you can do it,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1044.95,"endTime":1047.89,"body":"but probably aren't ideal. And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1047.89,"endTime":1051.025,"body":"now we're, now we're getting"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1047.89,"endTime":1051.025,"body":"into the phase of, you know,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1051.025,"endTime":1054.16,"body":"now, now"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1054.16,"endTime":1056.44,"body":"we can do it the right way with"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1054.16,"endTime":1056.44,"body":"an understanding of why it's the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1056.44,"endTime":1056.95,"body":"right way."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1057.799,"endTime":1063.109,"body":"Yeah, that enable that,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1057.799,"endTime":1063.109,"body":"that agreement at the beginning,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1063.14,"endTime":1066.319,"body":"and between you and your partner"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1063.14,"endTime":1066.319,"body":"was is like, a very, very cool"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1066.319,"endTime":1069.5,"body":"thing to do. Especially, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1066.319,"endTime":1069.5,"body":"know, it's nice to have"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1070.069,"endTime":1071.989,"body":"alignment and that sort of"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1070.069,"endTime":1071.989,"body":"thing, you know? But I mean, I"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1071.989,"endTime":1073.909,"body":"always,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1073.94,"endTime":1077.18,"body":"always, always say the best way"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1073.94,"endTime":1077.18,"body":"to learn anything, on any sort"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1077.18,"endTime":1079.97,"body":"of deep level is to do it, just"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1077.18,"endTime":1079.97,"body":"like you guys have done. And"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1080.15,"endTime":1081.829,"body":"state management in particular,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1080.15,"endTime":1081.829,"body":"I mean like, a lot of things are"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1081.829,"endTime":1083.508,"body":"like"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1083.509,"endTime":1085.219,"body":"this. But state management is"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1083.509,"endTime":1085.219,"body":"one of those, where there's a"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1085.219,"endTime":1086.929,"body":"million"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1086.93,"endTime":1092.75,"body":"ways to do it. None of them are"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1086.93,"endTime":1092.75,"body":"right or wrong, really. And the,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1092.9,"endTime":1096.559,"body":"but you never really, you never"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1092.9,"endTime":1096.559,"body":"gonna have actual full insight"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1096.559,"endTime":1100.16,"body":"into why you, why to make one"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1096.559,"endTime":1100.16,"body":"choice or the other. Why to use"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1100.16,"endTime":1105.89,"body":"Redux versus, you know, anything"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1100.16,"endTime":1105.89,"body":"else. It, by reading tutorials,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1105.92,"endTime":1107.9,"body":"you're never gonna figure it"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1105.92,"endTime":1107.9,"body":"out, right? Like, you're never"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1107.9,"endTime":1110.779,"body":"like, somebody could say use"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1107.9,"endTime":1110.779,"body":"Redux for this x, y and z, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1110.779,"endTime":1114.769,"body":"know? Don't use Redux here, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1110.779,"endTime":1114.769,"body":"know, and you could sort of try"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1114.769,"endTime":1117.859,"body":"to follow them. But you're never"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1114.769,"endTime":1117.859,"body":"gonna, you don't understand why"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1117.92,"endTime":1122.48,"body":"until you've gone down the road"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1117.92,"endTime":1122.48,"body":"of hacking it together, and then"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1122.72,"endTime":1125.18,"body":"getting to the spot where you're"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1122.72,"endTime":1125.18,"body":"like, okay, this, I see now."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1125.18,"endTime":1127.609,"body":"Like, this is not working out,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1125.18,"endTime":1127.609,"body":"or this is like more of a pain"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1127.609,"endTime":1130.4,"body":"than it should be, or, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1127.609,"endTime":1130.4,"body":"or whatever. Or I don't trust it"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1130.4,"endTime":1134.18,"body":"as much, which is, which is one"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1130.4,"endTime":1134.18,"body":"of the, like, one of the, one of"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1134.18,"endTime":1137.269,"body":"the things that's hard to"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1134.18,"endTime":1137.269,"body":"explain until you feel it,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1137.269,"endTime":1139.73,"body":"right? So you have that, you're"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1137.269,"endTime":1139.73,"body":"talking about that form state."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1140.15,"endTime":1143.9,"body":"And just not like, you know, it"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1140.15,"endTime":1143.9,"body":"can be better, you know, like,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1143.9,"endTime":1146.18,"body":"it's working and stuff, but you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1143.9,"endTime":1146.18,"body":"know, like, there's some,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1146.66,"endTime":1149.72,"body":"there's some area where it's not"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1146.66,"endTime":1149.72,"body":"exactly sure what's going on or"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1149.72,"endTime":1152.93,"body":"can't track, you know, all the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1149.72,"endTime":1152.93,"body":"different pieces of state or all"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1152.96,"endTime":1154.894,"body":"the different, you know, figures"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1152.96,"endTime":1154.894,"body":"(??) that go on. Like, that's"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1154.894,"endTime":1156.828,"body":"really"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1156.829,"endTime":1157.19,"body":"great."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1157.49,"endTime":1158.45,"body":"Yeah, and even"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1157.49,"endTime":1158.45,"body":"when we're, even while I'm"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1158.45,"endTime":1159.41,"body":"coming"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1159.41,"endTime":1166.88,"body":"through it now, I'm realizing,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1159.41,"endTime":1166.88,"body":"I'm kind of reflecting back on"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1166.88,"endTime":1169.549,"body":"where I was last year, and like"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1166.88,"endTime":1169.549,"body":"I can kind of like see the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1169.549,"endTime":1171.574,"body":"growth that I've had over the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1169.549,"endTime":1171.574,"body":"last year. It's like, as I'm, as"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1171.574,"endTime":1173.599,"body":"I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1173.599,"endTime":1176.15,"body":"rebuilding part to this, I'm"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1173.599,"endTime":1176.15,"body":"looking at, I'm looking at some"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1176.15,"endTime":1178.94,"body":"of the state and I'm like, okay,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1176.15,"endTime":1178.94,"body":"this, this definitely needs to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1178.94,"endTime":1181.849,"body":"be, you know, handled somewhere"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1178.94,"endTime":1181.849,"body":"else in a more safer way. But"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1182.39,"endTime":1185.779,"body":"this is actually perfectly fine"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1182.39,"endTime":1185.779,"body":"to just be, you know, in this"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1185.779,"endTime":1187.909,"body":"one component, and that's all it"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1185.779,"endTime":1187.909,"body":"needs. And it's... I don't know."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1187.909,"endTime":1190.039,"body":"I,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1190.369,"endTime":1194.569,"body":"me a year ago would be like so"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1190.369,"endTime":1194.569,"body":"jealous of me right now (laugh),"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1194.569,"endTime":1199.4,"body":"that I'm like able to set them"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1194.569,"endTime":1199.4,"body":"in a position to like to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1199.4,"endTime":1201.89,"body":"know the difference of one and"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1199.4,"endTime":1201.89,"body":"why."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1202.099,"endTime":1203.63,"body":"I think"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1202.099,"endTime":1203.63,"body":"that's a really good point too,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1203.63,"endTime":1207.019,"body":"because there's always this"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1203.63,"endTime":1207.019,"body":"tricky thing where you feel"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1207.019,"endTime":1210.38,"body":"like, oh, I have not, I haven't"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1207.019,"endTime":1210.38,"body":"grown enough. But look, you're"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1210.38,"endTime":1213.349,"body":"talking about this one year"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1210.38,"endTime":1213.349,"body":"journey and how much you've"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1213.349,"endTime":1215.569,"body":"learned, you know? You've grown"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1213.349,"endTime":1215.569,"body":"a lot through that. And"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1215.569,"endTime":1219.079,"body":"sometimes it feels very slow."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1215.569,"endTime":1219.079,"body":"But really, you're, you're"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1219.079,"endTime":1219.95,"body":"moving a ton."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1221.279,"endTime":1224.16,"body":"Yeah, and this is"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1221.279,"endTime":1224.16,"body":"actually my, this is my first"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1224.16,"endTime":1227.025,"body":"year as a full time developer."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1224.16,"endTime":1227.025,"body":"So before this, I was either,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1227.025,"endTime":1229.89,"body":"um... I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1229.89,"endTime":1232.38,"body":"was working part time, which"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1229.89,"endTime":1232.38,"body":"was, you know, like, maybe 15"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1232.41,"endTime":1235.289,"body":"hours after I got done with a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1232.41,"endTime":1235.289,"body":"full time job. So like, you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1235.289,"endTime":1236.669,"body":"know, I was already probably"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1235.289,"endTime":1236.669,"body":"coming in at, like, 60% mental"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1236.669,"endTime":1238.049,"body":"(??)"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1238.049,"endTime":1245.94,"body":"capacity. And then the job I had"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1238.049,"endTime":1245.94,"body":"in the agency before that,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1245.94,"endTime":1249.75,"body":"it was a developer role, but it"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1245.94,"endTime":1249.75,"body":"was, it was with a bunch of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1249.75,"endTime":1253.95,"body":"proprietary stuff, and some"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1249.75,"endTime":1253.95,"body":"older languages. So like, a lot"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1253.95,"endTime":1255.614,"body":"of it didn't really... So I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1253.95,"endTime":1255.614,"body":"mean, a lot of it was just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1255.614,"endTime":1257.278,"body":"customer"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1257.279,"endTime":1263.19,"body":"support to begin with. And the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1257.279,"endTime":1263.19,"body":"smaller majority after that was,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1264.089,"endTime":1269.039,"body":"you know, it was in, in such a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1264.089,"endTime":1269.039,"body":"sandboxed and specific place"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1269.039,"endTime":1274.17,"body":"that a lot of it couldn't really"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1269.039,"endTime":1274.17,"body":"translate over. What I, one"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1274.17,"endTime":1276.42,"body":"thing I wanted to double back on"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1274.17,"endTime":1276.42,"body":"you said there, the, the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1276.42,"endTime":1280.829,"body":"alignment between me and Andy, a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1276.42,"endTime":1280.829,"body":"lot of that was able to happen"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1280.829,"endTime":1283.199,"body":"was because, I mean, I was, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1280.829,"endTime":1283.199,"body":"was very junior when I just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1283.199,"endTime":1285.569,"body":"decided"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1285.569,"endTime":1290.4,"body":"to go full tilt on this, but"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1285.569,"endTime":1290.4,"body":"Andy was the same way. Andy"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1290.4,"endTime":1293.549,"body":"was working full time as a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1290.4,"endTime":1293.549,"body":"project manager, you know. He"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1293.549,"endTime":1295.619,"body":"had written some code before, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1293.549,"endTime":1295.619,"body":"don't know the full extent of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1295.619,"endTime":1300.75,"body":"his, of his experience before"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1295.619,"endTime":1300.75,"body":"that. But when he approached me,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1300.75,"endTime":1303.15,"body":"he was like, hey, I've had a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1300.75,"endTime":1303.15,"body":"similar idea. I'm kind of in the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1303.15,"endTime":1308.339,"body":"same spot. So when, when we were"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1303.15,"endTime":1308.339,"body":"kind of like spitballing ideas,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1308.339,"endTime":1311.73,"body":"we were like, you know, let's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1308.339,"endTime":1311.73,"body":"keep it simple, check. Let's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1311.759,"endTime":1315.45,"body":"build as much as we can without"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1311.759,"endTime":1315.45,"body":"libraries, check. So I think, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1315.45,"endTime":1319.5,"body":"think part of the reason we were"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1315.45,"endTime":1319.5,"body":"able to align on so many things"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1319.5,"endTime":1323.609,"body":"in the beginning is that we"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1319.5,"endTime":1323.609,"body":"were, for the most part in"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1323.759,"endTime":1329.4,"body":"pretty much the exact same spot,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1323.759,"endTime":1329.4,"body":"career wise. Shout out to Andy,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1329.4,"endTime":1331.95,"body":"by the way. He just started full"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1329.4,"endTime":1331.95,"body":"time as a developer, I think,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1331.95,"endTime":1335.25,"body":"within the last few weeks. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1331.95,"endTime":1335.25,"body":"congrats on that."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1335.509,"endTime":1336.259,"body":"Yeah, for"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1335.509,"endTime":1336.259,"body":"sure."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1336.259,"endTime":1337.009,"body":"Congrats to Andy."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1337.279,"endTime":1345.529,"body":"Andy is"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1337.279,"endTime":1345.529,"body":"also very awesome. Okay, so"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1338.119,"endTime":1349.25,"body":"simultaneously, you are"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1338.119,"endTime":1349.25,"body":"establishing a career as an"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1345.559,"endTime":1354.259,"body":"early career developer, and you"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1345.559,"endTime":1354.259,"body":"are tackling a big problem in"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1349.25,"endTime":1357.71,"body":"the industry, right? So can we"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1349.25,"endTime":1357.71,"body":"talk a little bit about the"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1354.259,"endTime":1358.43,"body":"challenges of balancing both of"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1354.259,"endTime":1358.43,"body":"those things?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1360.789,"endTime":1364.029,"body":"Um, I don't know"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1360.789,"endTime":1364.029,"body":"if there's a balance as much as"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1364.059,"endTime":1367.419,"body":"I just put as much weight on"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1364.059,"endTime":1367.419,"body":"both all the time (laugh). Which"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1367.419,"endTime":1370.779,"body":"is why"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1370.779,"endTime":1372.924,"body":"I'm probably on like, a beeline"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1370.779,"endTime":1372.924,"body":"to burnout at some point"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1372.924,"endTime":1375.069,"body":"(laugh). I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1375.069,"endTime":1378.849,"body":"don't know. It's, I don't know,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1375.069,"endTime":1378.849,"body":"I haven't really thought about"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1378.849,"endTime":1381.819,"body":"it. There's not much for"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1378.849,"endTime":1381.819,"body":"balance. Or I guess I don't"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1381.819,"endTime":1386.349,"body":"really have a process for"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1381.819,"endTime":1386.349,"body":"balancing it. So like, I'm"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1386.349,"endTime":1389.289,"body":"really bad about saying yes when"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1386.349,"endTime":1389.289,"body":"people ask me for stuff. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1389.65,"endTime":1394.089,"body":"like, I joined up with Layer"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1389.65,"endTime":1394.089,"body":"Frame. And then, thanks to a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1394.089,"endTime":1397.089,"body":"tweet that you sent out Bekah, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1394.089,"endTime":1397.089,"body":"was propositioned for some other"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1397.089,"endTime":1400.809,"body":"contract work that ended up"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1397.089,"endTime":1400.809,"body":"happening like right alongside"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1400.809,"endTime":1405.7,"body":"that. That turned into the full"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1400.809,"endTime":1405.7,"body":"time role that I have now. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1405.7,"endTime":1408.73,"body":"I'm like, okay, cool. I won't"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1405.7,"endTime":1408.73,"body":"have two jobs anymore. Like a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1408.73,"endTime":1410.274,"body":"month after that someone else"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1408.73,"endTime":1410.274,"body":"was like, hey, I got some"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1410.274,"endTime":1411.818,"body":"contract,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1411.819,"endTime":1413.319,"body":"or do you want to jump in on?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1411.819,"endTime":1413.319,"body":"I'm like, absolutely (laugh)."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1413.319,"endTime":1414.819,"body":"Let's do it."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1415.93,"endTime":1422.289,"body":"So. I've had a bad habit of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1415.93,"endTime":1422.289,"body":"keeping two jobs."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1422.359,"endTime":1425.089,"body":"Yeah. It's"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1422.359,"endTime":1425.089,"body":"so hard to balance. I'm not, I'm"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1425.089,"endTime":1427.43,"body":"certainly not good at that"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1425.089,"endTime":1427.43,"body":"either. And that's one of the"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1427.43,"endTime":1430.549,"body":"things that I'm working at"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1427.43,"endTime":1430.549,"body":"figuring out I like go through"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1430.549,"endTime":1434.9,"body":"these cycles. I'm like, all in"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1430.549,"endTime":1434.9,"body":"for six weeks. And then for an"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1434.9,"endTime":1438.95,"body":"entire week I feel like I can't"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1434.9,"endTime":1438.95,"body":"move. And that's obviously not"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1438.95,"endTime":1440.614,"body":"healthy (laugh). I'm trying to"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1438.95,"endTime":1440.614,"body":"find better ways of doing that."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1440.614,"endTime":1442.278,"body":"But"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1442.279,"endTime":1445.069,"body":"also, there's just this weird, I"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1442.279,"endTime":1445.069,"body":"don't know, tech just move so"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1445.069,"endTime":1449.809,"body":"fast all the time. And you want"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1445.069,"endTime":1449.809,"body":"to level up as a new developer."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1449.809,"endTime":1452.749,"body":"And at the same time, you're so"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1449.809,"endTime":1452.749,"body":"aware of the problems of, I"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1452.749,"endTime":1455.689,"body":"don't"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1455.69,"endTime":1460.819,"body":"know, like being an entry level"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1455.69,"endTime":1460.819,"body":"developer position that you want"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1460.819,"endTime":1464.539,"body":"to tackle them when you have"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1460.819,"endTime":1464.539,"body":"that passion. So there is this"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1465.019,"endTime":1472.91,"body":"weird, you know, how do I do all"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1465.019,"endTime":1472.91,"body":"of these things and still take"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1472.91,"endTime":1474.079,"body":"care of myself."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1474.869,"endTime":1476.579,"body":"That's, that's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1474.869,"endTime":1476.579,"body":"one thing I've planned to focus"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1476.579,"endTime":1480.45,"body":"on this year is getting the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1476.579,"endTime":1480.45,"body":"stuff done that I want to in a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1480.539,"endTime":1485.19,"body":"healthy way. I will say one"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1480.539,"endTime":1485.19,"body":"silver lining to taking on all"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1485.19,"endTime":1487.019,"body":"that extra contract work is"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1485.19,"endTime":1487.019,"body":"I've, I've walked away with"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1487.019,"endTime":1488.848,"body":"probably"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1488.849,"endTime":1492.299,"body":"at least two to three things"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1488.849,"endTime":1492.299,"body":"that I didn't know before I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1492.299,"endTime":1498.72,"body":"started the project. I really"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1492.299,"endTime":1498.72,"body":"forget where that sentence was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1498.72,"endTime":1501.329,"body":"going (laugh). That was gonna be"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1498.72,"endTime":1501.329,"body":"a good one too."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1501.329,"endTime":1504.0,"body":"(laugh) And"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1501.329,"endTime":1504.0,"body":"that's we, all the time."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1504.45,"endTime":1504.9,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1507.269,"endTime":1508.229,"body":"Oh, no, so, it"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1507.269,"endTime":1508.229,"body":"allowed, it allowed me to work"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1508.229,"endTime":1509.189,"body":"with a couple"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1509.19,"endTime":1512.069,"body":"of different or, you know, just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1509.19,"endTime":1512.069,"body":"developers with different"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1512.069,"endTime":1514.74,"body":"styles. So when I was with Layer"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1512.069,"endTime":1514.74,"body":"Frame, I was working with Rob."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1516.119,"endTime":1520.71,"body":"And I feel like Rob was just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1516.119,"endTime":1520.71,"body":"like a mastermind with"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1520.71,"endTime":1524.25,"body":"everything. So like, anytime I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1520.71,"endTime":1524.25,"body":"had a, anytime I had a problem,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1524.25,"endTime":1527.46,"body":"he had a solution for it. And he"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1524.25,"endTime":1527.46,"body":"was really good at walking me"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1527.46,"endTime":1529.5,"body":"through how he got to the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1527.46,"endTime":1529.5,"body":"solution. So I walked away with"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1529.5,"endTime":1531.42,"body":"some really good troubleshooting"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1529.5,"endTime":1531.42,"body":"skills from that."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1533.039,"endTime":1535.289,"body":"And then when I, on this last"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1533.039,"endTime":1535.289,"body":"contract role that I just, at"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1535.289,"endTime":1537.539,"body":"the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1537.539,"endTime":1539.819,"body":"end of last year, I was working"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1537.539,"endTime":1539.819,"body":"with a guy named Nick."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1541.65,"endTime":1545.759,"body":"And he's just, he's just super"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1541.65,"endTime":1545.759,"body":"knowledgeable around React. And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1545.759,"endTime":1549.569,"body":"like, some of, there's like so"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1545.759,"endTime":1549.569,"body":"many tools and methods in React"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1549.569,"endTime":1553.5,"body":"that I didn't even know were a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1549.569,"endTime":1553.5,"body":"thing until I was able to work"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1553.5,"endTime":1561.869,"body":"with him. So it, I overload"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1553.5,"endTime":1561.869,"body":"myself a lot, but so far, I've"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1561.869,"endTime":1565.44,"body":"walked away, I've walked away in"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1561.869,"endTime":1565.44,"body":"the green from it."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1567.839,"endTime":1569.369,"body":"I want to"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1567.839,"endTime":1569.369,"body":"come back to this idea of"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1569.369,"endTime":1573.96,"body":"talking about Rob and one, just"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1569.369,"endTime":1573.96,"body":"like learning in general. So, do"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1573.96,"endTime":1578.849,"body":"you have a measure or a point"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1573.96,"endTime":1578.849,"body":"where you think, okay, I have"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1578.849,"endTime":1582.599,"body":"been trying to figure out this"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1578.849,"endTime":1582.599,"body":"problem. And I know that this"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1582.599,"endTime":1585.48,"body":"other person knows the answer."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1582.599,"endTime":1585.48,"body":"So at what point do you ask?"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1585.48,"endTime":1589.23,"body":"Like, how far down the rabbit"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1585.48,"endTime":1589.23,"body":"hole do you go before you ask"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1589.23,"endTime":1589.68,"body":"for help?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1591.589,"endTime":1596.779,"body":"So at my full"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1591.589,"endTime":1596.779,"body":"time job, we have a one hour"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1596.779,"endTime":1600.41,"body":"rule, if you get stuck for more"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1596.779,"endTime":1600.41,"body":"than an hour, then reach out to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1600.41,"endTime":1605.089,"body":"someone. And I think that's kind"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1600.41,"endTime":1605.089,"body":"of been rubbing off on me, for"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1605.089,"endTime":1609.47,"body":"my side projects. I'm in a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1605.089,"endTime":1609.47,"body":"couple of different communities,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1610.4,"endTime":1613.609,"body":"that I kind of know which one"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1610.4,"endTime":1613.609,"body":"will probably more than likely"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1613.609,"endTime":1615.364,"body":"have the answers I need, or will"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1613.609,"endTime":1615.364,"body":"be, dependent on the time of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1615.364,"endTime":1617.119,"body":"day,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1617.15,"endTime":1623.21,"body":"may just be more available. So I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1617.15,"endTime":1623.21,"body":"usually try to hit it. If, you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1623.21,"endTime":1626.569,"body":"know, right at the one hour"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1623.21,"endTime":1626.569,"body":"mark, depending on how hard I'm"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1626.569,"endTime":1629.359,"body":"spinning my wheels. Some,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1626.569,"endTime":1629.359,"body":"sometimes, I know there's been a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1629.359,"endTime":1633.049,"body":"few times, like I just, I hit a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1629.359,"endTime":1633.049,"body":"wall and like I don't even know"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1633.079,"endTime":1635.45,"body":"how to start scaling this thing."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1633.079,"endTime":1635.45,"body":"So I'm just gonna immediately"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1635.45,"endTime":1638.0,"body":"reach out, but then there's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1635.45,"endTime":1638.0,"body":"sometimes like, you know, I go"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1638.0,"endTime":1641.72,"body":"through, I go through my"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1638.0,"endTime":1641.72,"body":"troubleshooting process. And if"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1641.72,"endTime":1646.339,"body":"I still can't really get"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1641.72,"endTime":1646.339,"body":"anywhere, I have a couple"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1646.339,"endTime":1649.849,"body":"different places I can reach out"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1646.339,"endTime":1649.849,"body":"to the... What I love about the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1649.849,"endTime":1653.869,"body":"communities that I'm in is that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1649.849,"endTime":1653.869,"body":"in most cases, it's rare that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1653.869,"endTime":1657.38,"body":"they're just gonna give me the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1653.869,"endTime":1657.38,"body":"answer, but they're more so"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1657.38,"endTime":1661.069,"body":"going to work through it with"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1657.38,"endTime":1661.069,"body":"me, and almost kind of rubber"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1661.069,"endTime":1665.029,"body":"duck me to the answer. So that's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1661.069,"endTime":1665.029,"body":"always super awesome."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1667.009,"endTime":1671.299,"body":"Nice. Yeah. Like, I"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1667.009,"endTime":1671.299,"body":"mean, that one hour mark? Seems"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1671.299,"endTime":1674.539,"body":"like a good, like rule of thumb,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1671.299,"endTime":1674.539,"body":"you know, for that sort of"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1674.539,"endTime":1678.529,"body":"thing. That question comes up a"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1674.539,"endTime":1678.529,"body":"lot, you know, and with, with"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1678.559,"endTime":1685.009,"body":"newer, early career developers,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1678.559,"endTime":1685.009,"body":"you know, I mean, that exact"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1685.009,"endTime":1686.96,"body":"question comes up a lot. A lot"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1685.009,"endTime":1686.96,"body":"of people are wondering it, and"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1686.96,"endTime":1692.48,"body":"it's hard to sort of baseline"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1686.96,"endTime":1692.48,"body":"it. I feel like the answer can"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1692.509,"endTime":1695.48,"body":"sometimes change depending on"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1692.509,"endTime":1695.48,"body":"the company, if you're, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1695.48,"endTime":1697.64,"body":"if you're working like this is"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1695.48,"endTime":1697.64,"body":"not for side projects, but you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1697.64,"endTime":1703.549,"body":"know, at a job. And I've been"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1697.64,"endTime":1703.549,"body":"finding it very, like, it seems"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1704.059,"endTime":1707.0,"body":"like a good thing to have an"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1704.059,"endTime":1707.0,"body":"actual rule for, like you said,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1707.059,"endTime":1710.599,"body":"that, that's where you learned"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1707.059,"endTime":1710.599,"body":"it from, have it written down,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1710.599,"endTime":1714.349,"body":"you know, and make it make sure"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1710.599,"endTime":1714.349,"body":"it's okay for early career"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1714.349,"endTime":1717.019,"body":"developers to ask questions, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1714.349,"endTime":1717.019,"body":"know? And like, let them know"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1717.019,"endTime":1720.41,"body":"when to do it, right? Because"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1717.019,"endTime":1720.41,"body":"you know what? I mean, nobody"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1720.41,"endTime":1723.2,"body":"wants to ask a question right"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1720.41,"endTime":1723.2,"body":"away every time they don't know"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1723.2,"endTime":1729.349,"body":"anything, you know, but it"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1723.2,"endTime":1729.349,"body":"always is going to be like,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1729.89,"endTime":1732.079,"body":"like, doing the rubber ducky"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1729.89,"endTime":1732.079,"body":"thing is just like such a useful"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1732.079,"endTime":1736.009,"body":"tool for any developer of any,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1732.079,"endTime":1736.009,"body":"any skill or you know, learning"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1736.009,"endTime":1738.604,"body":"level. It just that one hour"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1736.009,"endTime":1738.604,"body":"mark seems, seems cool. I don't"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1738.604,"endTime":1741.199,"body":"know."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1741.47,"endTime":1742.97,"body":"Yeah. Speaking of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1741.47,"endTime":1742.97,"body":"rubber ducks, my, we did uh..."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1742.97,"endTime":1744.47,"body":"Two"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1744.47,"endTime":1747.65,"body":"years ago, we did Secret Santa"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1744.47,"endTime":1747.65,"body":"for the family. My sister got"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1747.65,"endTime":1751.19,"body":"me, she didn't know what, she"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1747.65,"endTime":1751.19,"body":"didn't know what to get me. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1751.19,"endTime":1757.819,"body":"she just googled like, coder"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1751.19,"endTime":1757.819,"body":"gift ideas. And she got me this."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1759.41,"endTime":1762.89,"body":"It says, it says, Hi! I'm Stu,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1759.41,"endTime":1762.89,"body":"your debugging friend."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1762.89,"endTime":1764.93,"body":"Tell me your steps and we'll"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1762.89,"endTime":1764.93,"body":"find the bug together! It's,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1764.93,"endTime":1766.97,"body":"it's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1766.97,"endTime":1768.71,"body":"right here on my desk. And he"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1766.97,"endTime":1768.71,"body":"does exactly that."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1770.24,"endTime":1771.019,"body":"That's amazing."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1771.319,"endTime":1773.689,"body":"I um, I"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1771.319,"endTime":1773.689,"body":"have a problem of, I think,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1773.689,"endTime":1776.059,"body":"early in"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1776.059,"endTime":1779.599,"body":"my career. It was I don't know"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1776.059,"endTime":1779.599,"body":"if I should ask a question. And"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1779.779,"endTime":1783.68,"body":"now that I'm a little bit in,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1779.779,"endTime":1783.68,"body":"it's the stubbornness in me that"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1783.68,"endTime":1785.494,"body":"I have to tackle like, I can do"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1783.68,"endTime":1785.494,"body":"this, you know? (laugh) Like, I"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1785.494,"endTime":1787.308,"body":"don't"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1787.309,"endTime":1789.214,"body":"have to ask a question. This is"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1787.309,"endTime":1789.214,"body":"a real check of, I don't know,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1789.214,"endTime":1791.119,"body":"what does"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1791.119,"endTime":1792.71,"body":"that like hubris or something?"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":1791.119,"endTime":1792.71,"body":"(laugh)"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1793.47,"endTime":1796.35,"body":"(laugh) Yeah. No,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1793.47,"endTime":1796.35,"body":"I have uh... The first kind of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1796.35,"endTime":1799.23,"body":"developer"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1799.23,"endTime":1804.24,"body":"role I was in, the senior dev I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1799.23,"endTime":1804.24,"body":"worked with, he was, he was very"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1804.24,"endTime":1807.119,"body":"much trained the old-school way"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1804.24,"endTime":1807.119,"body":"and brought up with the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1807.119,"endTime":1812.099,"body":"old-school mentality. So any,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1807.119,"endTime":1812.099,"body":"anytime I would come to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1812.099,"endTime":1815.19,"body":"questions with him, he would"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1812.099,"endTime":1815.19,"body":"assume that like, I got to the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1815.19,"endTime":1818.19,"body":"question, or I got to the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1815.19,"endTime":1818.19,"body":"problem and immediately ask the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1818.19,"endTime":1822.21,"body":"question. And that's kind of how"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1818.19,"endTime":1822.21,"body":"he would react to me. Like,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1822.93,"endTime":1826.019,"body":"there's a lot of tension there."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1822.93,"endTime":1826.019,"body":"Like it got to the point where I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1826.019,"endTime":1829.92,"body":"didn't want to ask him a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1826.019,"endTime":1829.92,"body":"question, because I knew what, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1829.92,"endTime":1833.819,"body":"knew the vibe and what the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1829.92,"endTime":1833.819,"body":"response was going to be. What"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1833.819,"endTime":1836.579,"body":"was actually happening is like,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1833.819,"endTime":1836.579,"body":"I was spinning my wheels for"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1836.579,"endTime":1841.17,"body":"like, two hours trying to not"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1836.579,"endTime":1841.17,"body":"have to ask him a question. And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1841.17,"endTime":1844.259,"body":"then when I did ask the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1841.17,"endTime":1844.259,"body":"question, it was like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1844.259,"endTime":1850.319,"body":"grief conflict? A whole bunch of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1844.259,"endTime":1850.319,"body":"tension. So it's, I don't know,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1850.319,"endTime":1853.109,"body":"it's, it's been like a breath of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1850.319,"endTime":1853.109,"body":"fresh air, slash a huge relief"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1853.109,"endTime":1855.899,"body":"that,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1856.89,"endTime":1861.119,"body":"A, I've found the communities"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1856.89,"endTime":1861.119,"body":"that have found and have places"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1861.299,"endTime":1865.349,"body":"that I can ask questions, but B,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1861.299,"endTime":1865.349,"body":"now with a company that like,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1866.43,"endTime":1868.859,"body":"that had, that has their own"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1866.43,"endTime":1868.859,"body":"rule for when you should ask"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1868.859,"endTime":1872.7,"body":"questions, and a lot of times,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1868.859,"endTime":1872.7,"body":"they're, they're gonna chop that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1872.7,"endTime":1875.49,"body":"hour down to like, 30 minutes,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1872.7,"endTime":1875.49,"body":"or like, any time I'm on a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1875.49,"endTime":1877.44,"body":"project, they're like, hey, one"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1875.49,"endTime":1877.44,"body":"hour rule is actually 10 minutes"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1877.44,"endTime":1879.39,"body":"here,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1879.42,"endTime":1881.73,"body":"when our rules actually 20"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1879.42,"endTime":1881.73,"body":"minutes here, and they actually"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1881.73,"endTime":1883.424,"body":"want you to ask questions they"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1881.73,"endTime":1883.424,"body":"have, we have an entire thread"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1883.424,"endTime":1885.118,"body":"(??)"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1885.119,"endTime":1887.819,"body":"in basecamp, where it's just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1885.119,"endTime":1887.819,"body":"different developers asking"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1887.819,"endTime":1891.509,"body":"different questions. And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1887.819,"endTime":1891.509,"body":"there's, it's just super awesome"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1891.509,"endTime":1892.38,"body":"thing to be a part of."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1893.039,"endTime":1894.75,"body":"That's really, that's"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1893.039,"endTime":1894.75,"body":"cool. That's really cool to"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1894.75,"endTime":1898.259,"body":"hear. Like the per project or"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1894.75,"endTime":1898.259,"body":"something, they'll, they'll just"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1898.259,"endTime":1900.359,"body":"say, okay, for this project, we"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1898.259,"endTime":1900.359,"body":"know it's like new or something,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1900.39,"endTime":1901.905,"body":"or a lot of moving pieces. So"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1900.39,"endTime":1901.905,"body":"change the rule, you know? Based"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1901.905,"endTime":1903.42,"body":"on that."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1903.589,"endTime":1905.93,"body":"Yeah. And they,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1903.589,"endTime":1905.93,"body":"they're, they're really aware of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1905.93,"endTime":1910.91,"body":"like, skill level and expertise"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1905.93,"endTime":1910.91,"body":"with the different, with"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1911.18,"endTime":1915.17,"body":"different tools and stuff. So if"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1911.18,"endTime":1915.17,"body":"they're bringing me on to a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1915.17,"endTime":1920.779,"body":"project that uses you know, like"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1915.17,"endTime":1920.779,"body":"a legacy build that they know, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1920.779,"endTime":1923.539,"body":"haven't really seen a whole lot,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1920.779,"endTime":1923.539,"body":"then, then that's when they'll"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1923.539,"endTime":1928.73,"body":"say, hey, your, your windows 15"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1923.539,"endTime":1928.73,"body":"minutes for this, or if they're"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1928.73,"endTime":1932.059,"body":"moving, in some cases, even some"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1928.73,"endTime":1932.059,"body":"of the more experienced devs on"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1932.059,"endTime":1935.509,"body":"to something where it's a little"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1932.059,"endTime":1935.509,"body":"more intricate UI work, where"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1935.509,"endTime":1938.63,"body":"they're mostly, you know, data"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1935.509,"endTime":1938.63,"body":"backend stuff like, hey, okay,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1938.63,"endTime":1942.589,"body":"well, now your windows 10"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1938.63,"endTime":1942.589,"body":"minutes, and met, but mine will"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1942.589,"endTime":1945.619,"body":"still be the full hour so that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1942.589,"endTime":1945.619,"body":"they're, they're really aware of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1945.619,"endTime":1949.97,"body":"like where everyone's at? And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1945.619,"endTime":1949.97,"body":"like, adjusting their windows"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1949.97,"endTime":1950.539,"body":"accordingly."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1951.98,"endTime":1954.38,"body":"That's really cool to"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1951.98,"endTime":1954.38,"body":"hear. I feel like asking"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1954.38,"endTime":1958.369,"body":"questions is almost a skill to"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1954.38,"endTime":1958.369,"body":"learn as well. Sort of similar"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1958.369,"endTime":1960.664,"body":"to googling (laugh) is a skill"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1958.369,"endTime":1960.664,"body":"as a developer, you know? It"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1960.664,"endTime":1962.959,"body":"sounds,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1963.65,"endTime":1966.89,"body":"everybody who is been a"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1963.65,"endTime":1966.89,"body":"developer for long enough knows"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1966.89,"endTime":1969.23,"body":"what that means, like, knows"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1966.89,"endTime":1969.23,"body":"what a person means when they"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1969.23,"endTime":1971.509,"body":"say that googling is a skill,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1969.23,"endTime":1971.509,"body":"and you have to learn how to"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1971.509,"endTime":1975.38,"body":"google. Do you feel like you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1971.509,"endTime":1975.38,"body":"have become better at asking"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1975.38,"endTime":1979.13,"body":"questions? Once like, especially"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1975.38,"endTime":1979.13,"body":"once you start working with"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1979.16,"endTime":1982.43,"body":"maybe a company that value that,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1979.16,"endTime":1982.43,"body":"you know, value that"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":1982.94,"endTime":1983.63,"body":"interaction?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1984.23,"endTime":1987.529,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1984.23,"endTime":1987.529,"body":"And, and I would even say, I got"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1987.529,"endTime":1990.44,"body":"better at asking questions, even"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1987.529,"endTime":1990.44,"body":"while I was in that environment."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1991.4,"endTime":1994.775,"body":"Because uh... Well first, I want"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1991.4,"endTime":1994.775,"body":"to say, like me and that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1994.775,"endTime":1998.15,"body":"developer,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1998.96,"endTime":2004.359,"body":"we, it was a really strange"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":1998.96,"endTime":2004.359,"body":"relationship. Like, every, every"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2004.359,"endTime":2007.269,"body":"Friday, we would go grab lunch"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2004.359,"endTime":2007.269,"body":"together, we were best buds. And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2007.269,"endTime":2009.204,"body":"we liked the same music. We were"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2007.269,"endTime":2009.204,"body":"both guitarist, and we would"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2009.204,"endTime":2011.139,"body":"sit,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2011.2,"endTime":2015.549,"body":"we would sit there, you know, we"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2011.2,"endTime":2015.549,"body":"shared an office. It feels weird"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2015.549,"endTime":2017.724,"body":"to say that I shared a room with"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2015.549,"endTime":2017.724,"body":"anyone right now (laugh). But"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2017.724,"endTime":2019.899,"body":"you know, the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2019.9,"endTime":2021.819,"body":"entire day, we would just sit"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2019.9,"endTime":2021.819,"body":"there and talk back and forth"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2021.819,"endTime":2027.279,"body":"like it was, we really were just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2021.819,"endTime":2027.279,"body":"friends, friends inside, inside"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2027.279,"endTime":2030.91,"body":"the company. But when it, when"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2027.279,"endTime":2030.91,"body":"it came to that, that, that was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2030.91,"endTime":2033.67,"body":"like, that was the only point of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2030.91,"endTime":2033.67,"body":"friction in that relationship."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2033.67,"endTime":2035.829,"body":"Which was, which was really"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2033.67,"endTime":2035.829,"body":"strange to me. But I think it's,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2036.67,"endTime":2038.92,"body":"the only thing I can chalk it up"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2036.67,"endTime":2038.92,"body":"to is that that's just how he"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2038.92,"endTime":2042.039,"body":"was, that was the company"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2038.92,"endTime":2042.039,"body":"culture. He was, he was trained"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2042.039,"endTime":2045.91,"body":"in and brought up in himself. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2042.039,"endTime":2045.91,"body":"that's the only way he knows to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2045.91,"endTime":2054.01,"body":"try to help others learn. Um,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2045.91,"endTime":2054.01,"body":"but yeah, I think even in that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2054.01,"endTime":2057.039,"body":"environment, I think I got"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2054.01,"endTime":2057.039,"body":"better at asking questions,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2057.039,"endTime":2061.179,"body":"because I would, I would ask"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2057.039,"endTime":2061.179,"body":"something and his response"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2061.179,"endTime":2065.079,"body":"would be like, well, what is,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2061.179,"endTime":2065.079,"body":"what is x mean? What is y mean?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2066.4,"endTime":2068.245,"body":"I would use the wrong words all"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2066.4,"endTime":2068.245,"body":"the time, which is very"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2068.245,"endTime":2070.09,"body":"frustrating."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2070.119,"endTime":2071.349,"body":"Can you give an example"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2070.119,"endTime":2071.349,"body":"of that?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2071.92,"endTime":2075.76,"body":"So like, I would"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2071.92,"endTime":2075.76,"body":"say something like, you know,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2075.76,"endTime":2078.67,"body":"the this, I'm passing this"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2075.76,"endTime":2078.67,"body":"argument, but it's not coming"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2078.67,"endTime":2083.889,"body":"out the right way, when what I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2078.67,"endTime":2083.889,"body":"meant was the method. But I was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2083.889,"endTime":2086.53,"body":"using the word argument and his"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2083.889,"endTime":2086.53,"body":"response to be like, well,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2086.559,"endTime":2088.539,"body":"obviously, that's not gonna"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2086.559,"endTime":2088.539,"body":"work. You don't need an argument"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2088.539,"endTime":2091.134,"body":"there. That's the, I'd be"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2088.539,"endTime":2091.134,"body":"pointing at it on the screen"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2091.134,"endTime":2093.729,"body":"like, that, right"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2093.73,"endTime":2096.639,"body":"there. That's what I'm trying to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2093.73,"endTime":2096.639,"body":"do. He's like, what? That's not"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2096.639,"endTime":2099.129,"body":"an argument. I'm like, okay."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2096.639,"endTime":2099.129,"body":"Fair enough. So (laugh), like"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2099.129,"endTime":2101.619,"body":"that kind of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2101.619,"endTime":2102.07,"body":"stuff."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2102.519,"endTime":2102.969,"body":"(laugh) Yeah."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2103.36,"endTime":2105.94,"body":"Yeah. You"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2103.36,"endTime":2105.94,"body":"know, we also see like the issue"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2105.94,"endTime":2111.19,"body":"with entry level devs and the"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2105.94,"endTime":2111.19,"body":"problem of comfort level with"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2111.19,"endTime":2114.579,"body":"whoever they're working with."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2111.19,"endTime":2114.579,"body":"And I have a lot of feelings"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2114.579,"endTime":2117.82,"body":"about that. But one of them also"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2114.579,"endTime":2117.82,"body":"is that not everybody is meant"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2117.82,"endTime":2121.21,"body":"to be a mentor, right? You know,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2117.82,"endTime":2121.21,"body":"some people have like a natural"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2121.21,"endTime":2124.539,"body":"ability, some people can have"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2121.21,"endTime":2124.539,"body":"training and get good at it. But"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2124.539,"endTime":2128.38,"body":"some people, you know, they"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2124.539,"endTime":2128.38,"body":"don't desire it, or they feel"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2128.38,"endTime":2131.38,"body":"like it takes away from their"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2128.38,"endTime":2131.38,"body":"experience. And so they're"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2131.38,"endTime":2136.42,"body":"aggravated by it. But a company"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2131.38,"endTime":2136.42,"body":"not only has to make a space"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2136.539,"endTime":2140.86,"body":"welcoming for new developers,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2136.539,"endTime":2140.86,"body":"but it also has to support the"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2140.889,"endTime":2145.0,"body":"upper level devs, who are"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2140.889,"endTime":2145.0,"body":"providing the mentorship and the"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2145.0,"endTime":2146.845,"body":"guidance and making sure that,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2145.0,"endTime":2146.845,"body":"you know, that culture shows"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2146.845,"endTime":2148.69,"body":"that"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2148.69,"endTime":2150.639,"body":"how you treat people and talk to"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2148.69,"endTime":2150.639,"body":"them."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2152.579,"endTime":2154.349,"body":"Yeah. That's the,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2152.579,"endTime":2154.349,"body":"um, so, one of, Sean, the guy"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2154.349,"endTime":2156.119,"body":"that I mentioned"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2156.119,"endTime":2160.289,"body":"earlier. He was always really"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2156.119,"endTime":2160.289,"body":"good at, if I ever came to him"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2160.289,"endTime":2165.03,"body":"with a question, he was, his"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2160.289,"endTime":2165.03,"body":"response was always, you know,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2165.15,"endTime":2168.48,"body":"well, let's look at it together."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2165.15,"endTime":2168.48,"body":"Or, you know, let's talk me"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2168.48,"endTime":2170.76,"body":"through the steps you're trying"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2168.48,"endTime":2170.76,"body":"to do and let's see if we can"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2170.76,"endTime":2174.869,"body":"find the hang up there. So I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2170.76,"endTime":2174.869,"body":"think he's one of those people"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2174.869,"endTime":2177.044,"body":"that just naturally has like,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2174.869,"endTime":2177.044,"body":"well I mean, he's, I know he's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2177.044,"endTime":2179.219,"body":"been a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2179.219,"endTime":2182.07,"body":"guitar teacher for a while. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2179.219,"endTime":2182.07,"body":"maybe he's just developed those"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2182.07,"endTime":2182.82,"body":"teaching skills."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2183.599,"endTime":2188.639,"body":"Yeah. Going back to"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2183.599,"endTime":2188.639,"body":"having a company support the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2188.67,"endTime":2192.239,"body":"senior devs in those roles, I"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2188.67,"endTime":2192.239,"body":"feel like that's an important"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2192.239,"endTime":2199.32,"body":"thing. I guess tying it back to"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2192.239,"endTime":2199.32,"body":"the framing of making it a rule,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2199.32,"endTime":2202.769,"body":"like having the rule of the one"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2199.32,"endTime":2202.769,"body":"hour thing, for instance, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2203.19,"endTime":2205.545,"body":"That gives the younger"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2203.19,"endTime":2205.545,"body":"developer, younger, the, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2205.545,"endTime":2207.9,"body":"know, early"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2207.9,"endTime":2213.179,"body":"career, newer developer a"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2207.9,"endTime":2213.179,"body":"guideline to follow, right? But"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2213.179,"endTime":2217.59,"body":"it also implies that the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2213.179,"endTime":2217.59,"body":"question should be asked, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2217.59,"endTime":2220.32,"body":"know, and that, and that the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2217.59,"endTime":2220.32,"body":"question also should be, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2220.32,"endTime":2225.059,"body":"know, answered or whatever. So,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2220.32,"endTime":2225.059,"body":"again, that has to become, I"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2225.059,"endTime":2227.94,"body":"mean, you can just hope that the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2225.059,"endTime":2227.94,"body":"senior developer in whatever"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2227.94,"endTime":2234.929,"body":"position is good at it and"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2227.94,"endTime":2234.929,"body":"everything, but having it be"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2235.019,"endTime":2237.659,"body":"part of the company culture,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2235.019,"endTime":2237.659,"body":"having it be expected, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2237.659,"endTime":2241.86,"body":"that's part of a developer's"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2237.659,"endTime":2241.86,"body":"role is supporting a junior"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2241.86,"endTime":2244.98,"body":"developer, or however it works"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2241.86,"endTime":2244.98,"body":"out. But that part of the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2244.98,"endTime":2248.039,"body":"developer's job is doing that."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2244.98,"endTime":2248.039,"body":"Not that answering a question,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2248.039,"endTime":2254.01,"body":"or helping a developer through a"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2248.039,"endTime":2254.01,"body":"problem is taking time away from"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2254.01,"endTime":2257.4,"body":"doing your job, right? I feel"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2254.01,"endTime":2257.4,"body":"like that can be something that"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2257.4,"endTime":2261.78,"body":"can come up, right? Where if"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2257.4,"endTime":2261.78,"body":"it's not framed correctly, maybe"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2262.739,"endTime":2266.82,"body":"when you were asking a question,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2262.739,"endTime":2266.82,"body":"he was just feeling like he had"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2266.82,"endTime":2269.55,"body":"stuff to do. And this was"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2266.82,"endTime":2269.55,"body":"getting in the way of doing his"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2269.55,"endTime":2273.539,"body":"stuff or something, you know?"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2269.55,"endTime":2273.539,"body":"And which is not actually"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2273.539,"endTime":2276.0,"body":"correct, right? Like, it's part"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2273.539,"endTime":2276.0,"body":"of his job. I mean, I don't know"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2276.0,"endTime":2277.305,"body":"what the exact situation was"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2276.0,"endTime":2277.305,"body":"there. But like, it should be"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2277.305,"endTime":2278.61,"body":"part of..."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2278.909,"endTime":2281.01,"body":"There was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2278.909,"endTime":2281.01,"body":"definitely a lot a lot of moving"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2281.01,"endTime":2285.63,"body":"projects with only one"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2281.01,"endTime":2285.63,"body":"experienced and one learning"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2285.719,"endTime":2286.349,"body":"developer."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2287.139,"endTime":2290.949,"body":"Right. Right. Right."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2287.139,"endTime":2290.949,"body":"You know, and not having it"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2293.17,"endTime":2296.98,"body":"explicit, is a recipe for that"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2293.17,"endTime":2296.98,"body":"sort of thing to happen, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2298.059,"endTime":2301.0,"body":"know? You could maybe have be"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2298.059,"endTime":2301.0,"body":"lucky. That's what I mean,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2301.0,"endTime":2303.355,"body":"like, depending on just hoping"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2301.0,"endTime":2303.355,"body":"(laugh), hoping that it works"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2303.355,"endTime":2305.71,"body":"out. It"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2305.71,"endTime":2308.8,"body":"doesn't, that doesn't seem like"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2305.71,"endTime":2308.8,"body":"the right call. And hiring"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2309.55,"endTime":2314.23,"body":"junior developers is important,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2309.55,"endTime":2314.23,"body":"but they need like, the people"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2314.23,"endTime":2315.64,"body":"hiring them need to be, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2314.23,"endTime":2315.64,"body":"know, prepared, right? Need to"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2315.64,"endTime":2317.05,"body":"be"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2317.44,"endTime":2321.55,"body":"prepared to support them, but"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2317.44,"endTime":2321.55,"body":"also prepared to, you know, have"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2321.55,"endTime":2323.005,"body":"a plan for the senior developers"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2321.55,"endTime":2323.005,"body":"too. Because it's hard. It's"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2323.005,"endTime":2324.46,"body":"also"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2324.46,"endTime":2331.51,"body":"another whole skill to learn."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2324.46,"endTime":2331.51,"body":"And, you know, having some"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2331.51,"endTime":2334.389,"body":"guidelines like that, I feel"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2331.51,"endTime":2334.389,"body":"like is such a good, such a good"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2334.599,"endTime":2337.48,"body":"thing to, and sort of almost"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2334.599,"endTime":2337.48,"body":"easy thing to pull off, right?"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2337.51,"endTime":2339.489,"body":"Like an easy way to really"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2337.51,"endTime":2339.489,"body":"improve the situation is just"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2339.489,"endTime":2341.349,"body":"like, this is how it works. Ask"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2339.489,"endTime":2341.349,"body":"a question, you know? (laugh)"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2341.349,"endTime":2343.209,"body":"Like, ask"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2343.21,"endTime":2346.239,"body":"a question after an hour, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2343.21,"endTime":2346.239,"body":"know? Answer the question after,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2346.3,"endTime":2348.46,"body":"you know, that when the junior"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2346.3,"endTime":2348.46,"body":"developer helps like it, or"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2348.46,"endTime":2351.909,"body":"asks, you know? I just like"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2348.46,"endTime":2351.909,"body":"that. I like the clarity of"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2351.909,"endTime":2352.539,"body":"that, you know? I think that's"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2351.909,"endTime":2352.539,"body":"really cool."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2352.0,"endTime":2355.3,"body":"Yeah. And that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2352.0,"endTime":2355.3,"body":"actually reminds me one, one"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2355.3,"endTime":2359.019,"body":"thing before I knew about the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2355.3,"endTime":2359.019,"body":"one hour rule, one thing Sean"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2359.019,"endTime":2362.59,"body":"always did to me that I didn't"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2359.019,"endTime":2362.59,"body":"know until I, you know, months"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2362.59,"endTime":2366.55,"body":"and months later, is that when I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2362.59,"endTime":2366.55,"body":"would ask him a question, he"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2366.55,"endTime":2368.8,"body":"would, he would, he would set"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2366.55,"endTime":2368.8,"body":"like a timer, like he'll reply"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2368.8,"endTime":2371.05,"body":"within"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2371.05,"endTime":2375.909,"body":"one hour if he doesn't hear back"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2371.05,"endTime":2375.909,"body":"from me. And I didn't know"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2375.909,"endTime":2378.25,"body":"that was the thing. So like, I,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2375.909,"endTime":2378.25,"body":"I just asked him a question, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2378.25,"endTime":2380.98,"body":"keep trying to work on it. And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2378.25,"endTime":2380.98,"body":"then there were a lot of times"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2380.98,"endTime":2383.44,"body":"where like, oh, nevermind. Got"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2380.98,"endTime":2383.44,"body":"it. And then like, at, what, I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2383.44,"endTime":2385.9,"body":"think it"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2385.9,"endTime":2389.559,"body":"was after I'd left the contract"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2385.9,"endTime":2389.559,"body":"role with him, he's like, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2389.559,"endTime":2392.679,"body":"I used to give you like an hour"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2389.559,"endTime":2392.679,"body":"anytime you ask a question and"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2392.71,"endTime":2395.59,"body":"towards the end you got to where"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2392.71,"endTime":2395.59,"body":"you were responding back within"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2395.59,"endTime":2400.57,"body":"like 10 minutes that nevermind,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2395.59,"endTime":2400.57,"body":"you found the answer. But"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2402.55,"endTime":2406.329,"body":"touching back on what you were"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2402.55,"endTime":2406.329,"body":"saying about companies needing"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2406.329,"endTime":2409.57,"body":"to, you know, like proactively"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2406.329,"endTime":2409.57,"body":"support junior developers."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2409.57,"endTime":2413.619,"body":"That's one of the things we're"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2409.57,"endTime":2413.619,"body":"doing on Protege. So all of our,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2414.13,"endTime":2418.989,"body":"all the listings there are"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2414.13,"endTime":2418.989,"body":"curated and like, approved by"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2418.989,"endTime":2423.4,"body":"us. That's one thing, when, when"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2418.989,"endTime":2423.4,"body":"a company lists with us, one"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2423.4,"endTime":2429.46,"body":"thing we gotta do, one thing we"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2423.4,"endTime":2429.46,"body":"do is, you know, first we read"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2429.46,"endTime":2431.469,"body":"through the listing and make"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2429.46,"endTime":2431.469,"body":"sure it kind of lines up with,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2432.01,"endTime":2434.26,"body":"with the goals we have for"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2432.01,"endTime":2434.26,"body":"Protege. But then we also kind"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2434.26,"endTime":2437.889,"body":"of like dig into the company's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2434.26,"endTime":2437.889,"body":"website, and you know, maybe"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2437.889,"endTime":2441.13,"body":"their LinkedIn to try and get an"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2437.889,"endTime":2441.13,"body":"idea of the company culture"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2441.13,"endTime":2445.869,"body":"like. Are, are they posting this"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2441.13,"endTime":2445.869,"body":"role because they just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2445.869,"endTime":2447.849,"body":"want to pay someone cheap? Or"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2445.869,"endTime":2447.849,"body":"are they posting this role"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2447.849,"endTime":2450.309,"body":"because they genuinely want to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2447.849,"endTime":2450.309,"body":"find someone to build them up"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2450.309,"endTime":2456.55,"body":"into the best version that they"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2450.309,"endTime":2456.55,"body":"can be? And we try to, we try to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2456.55,"endTime":2460.989,"body":"make sure we have a good idea"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2456.55,"endTime":2460.989,"body":"of, of, of the answer to that."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2461.8,"endTime":2462.969,"body":"For, for every listing."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2463.57,"endTime":2466.03,"body":"That's really cool. I"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2463.57,"endTime":2466.03,"body":"mean, and that's like, I feel"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2466.03,"endTime":2469.96,"body":"like one of, one of the things"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2466.03,"endTime":2469.96,"body":"that makes Protege, you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2469.96,"endTime":2475.809,"body":"special is the curation and the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2469.96,"endTime":2475.809,"body":"sort of insight into the, the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2475.809,"endTime":2478.719,"body":"junior developer mind, if you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2475.809,"endTime":2478.719,"body":"will (laugh), you know? It's,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2478.719,"endTime":2481.629,"body":"like you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2481.63,"endTime":2486.19,"body":"said, it's not just a, I don't"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2481.63,"endTime":2486.19,"body":"know, collection of, of things"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2486.19,"endTime":2489.13,"body":"that people want to find cheap"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2486.19,"endTime":2489.13,"body":"worker, you know, something like"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2489.13,"endTime":2489.849,"body":"that, right?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2490.449,"endTime":2490.96,"body":"Yeah. I'm a,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2491.23,"endTime":2491.829,"body":"It's really cool."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2492.519,"endTime":2494.559,"body":"I will always"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2492.519,"endTime":2494.559,"body":"refer to myself as perpetually,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2494.59,"endTime":2498.489,"body":"perpetually junior developer. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2494.59,"endTime":2498.489,"body":"hopefully, I will always be able"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2498.489,"endTime":2502.57,"body":"to keep that mindset. But we"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2498.489,"endTime":2502.57,"body":"have, I was actually just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2502.57,"endTime":2504.639,"body":"talking to some people in the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2502.57,"endTime":2504.639,"body":"Virtual Coffee group not too"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2504.639,"endTime":2509.619,"body":"long ago about, about some tools"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2504.639,"endTime":2509.619,"body":"and features we can add, to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2509.619,"endTime":2513.76,"body":"hopefully help empower both"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2509.619,"endTime":2513.76,"body":"sides of the process in our"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2513.82,"endTime":2515.019,"body":"interface to build."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2515.829,"endTime":2517.629,"body":"So okay."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2515.829,"endTime":2517.629,"body":"So, if you had a magic wand, and"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2517.629,"endTime":2519.429,"body":"you"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2519.429,"endTime":2521.739,"body":"could get everything you want"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2519.429,"endTime":2521.739,"body":"for Protege, what does it look"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2521.739,"endTime":2522.099,"body":"like?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2522.789,"endTime":2524.304,"body":"If I get"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2522.789,"endTime":2524.304,"body":"everything I want, in terms of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2524.304,"endTime":2525.819,"body":"features or"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2525.82,"endTime":2526.48,"body":"success?"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2527.019,"endTime":2529.09,"body":"Whatever"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2527.019,"endTime":2529.09,"body":"you want. Let's do it all."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2529.09,"endTime":2530.829,"body":"You've got a magic wand. It's"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2529.09,"endTime":2530.829,"body":"your choice."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2530.949,"endTime":2533.094,"body":"If I had a magic"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2530.949,"endTime":2533.094,"body":"wand, there, there'd be accounts"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2533.094,"endTime":2535.239,"body":"for"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2535.239,"endTime":2539.829,"body":"both candidates and companies,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2535.239,"endTime":2539.829,"body":"there'd be, there'd be tools on"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2539.829,"endTime":2546.67,"body":"both ends to do both empower and"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2539.829,"endTime":2546.67,"body":"protect both sides. I don't"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2546.67,"endTime":2548.349,"body":"really feel like the companies"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2546.67,"endTime":2548.349,"body":"would really need much"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2548.409,"endTime":2552.969,"body":"protection. But in some cases,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2548.409,"endTime":2552.969,"body":"like maybe the candidates do,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2552.969,"endTime":2559.389,"body":"especially from, you know, like"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2552.969,"endTime":2559.389,"body":"ageism, or, or something like"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2559.389,"endTime":2563.289,"body":"that. Yeah, so some, some tools"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2559.389,"endTime":2563.289,"body":"around like empowering"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2563.289,"endTime":2565.659,"body":"candidates against"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2563.289,"endTime":2565.659,"body":"discrimination. So like, maybe"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2565.659,"endTime":2570.369,"body":"there, maybe only like their"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2565.659,"endTime":2570.369,"body":"work history and like, some kind"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2570.369,"endTime":2574.63,"body":"of like generic questions they"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2570.369,"endTime":2574.63,"body":"answered are available. And the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2574.63,"endTime":2579.099,"body":"company can't really see what"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2574.63,"endTime":2579.099,"body":"their you know, name, name,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2579.099,"endTime":2583.15,"body":"gender, age, or location or"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2579.099,"endTime":2583.15,"body":"anything like that is until, you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2583.15,"endTime":2586.42,"body":"know, they schedule an interview"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2583.15,"endTime":2586.42,"body":"with them and have something"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2586.42,"endTime":2591.099,"body":"kinda like on the books or"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2586.42,"endTime":2591.099,"body":"something like that. Or even,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2591.13,"endTime":2594.94,"body":"even a tool to where maybe"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2591.13,"endTime":2594.94,"body":"candidates can say like, you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2594.94,"endTime":2598.3,"body":"know, I'm in this time zone, but"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2594.94,"endTime":2598.3,"body":"I'm willing to work in up to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2598.3,"endTime":2601.48,"body":"these are you knows different"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2598.3,"endTime":2601.48,"body":"stuff like that. I haven't"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2601.48,"endTime":2606.25,"body":"looked at the, like the company"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2601.48,"endTime":2606.25,"body":"side of a lot of the job board"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2606.25,"endTime":2609.88,"body":"competitors, which I don't"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2606.25,"endTime":2609.88,"body":"really consider them"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2609.88,"endTime":2613.15,"body":"competitors. Because like, they,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2609.88,"endTime":2613.15,"body":"they have their niche. They're"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2613.15,"endTime":2615.25,"body":"doing their thing, we're, we're"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2613.15,"endTime":2615.25,"body":"trying to solve a completely"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2615.25,"endTime":2618.219,"body":"different problem. So we'd"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2615.25,"endTime":2618.219,"body":"really just like all the tools"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2618.219,"endTime":2620.559,"body":"for everyone (laugh). And that's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2618.219,"endTime":2620.559,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2621.4,"endTime":2624.429,"body":"All right,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2621.4,"endTime":2624.429,"body":"excellent. I mean, it is so hard"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2624.429,"endTime":2628.84,"body":"to search for a job as an entry"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2624.429,"endTime":2628.84,"body":"level or junior developer,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2628.9,"endTime":2631.269,"body":"because they don't make it"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2628.9,"endTime":2631.269,"body":"clear. Or you do have those"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2631.269,"endTime":2634.75,"body":"problems where they're like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2631.269,"endTime":2634.75,"body":"yes, we want an entry level"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2634.75,"endTime":2638.71,"body":"developer, but you have to know"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2634.75,"endTime":2638.71,"body":"all of these things just because"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2638.86,"endTime":2642.909,"body":"they want to get you to do work"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2638.86,"endTime":2642.909,"body":"for less money. And that's such"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2642.909,"endTime":2645.639,"body":"a problem. And we see people"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2642.909,"endTime":2645.639,"body":"over and over going into those"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2645.639,"endTime":2650.65,"body":"environments and just being, you"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2645.639,"endTime":2650.65,"body":"know, totally frustrated, and"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2650.679,"endTime":2653.53,"body":"it's affecting their health"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2650.679,"endTime":2653.53,"body":"because it's such a terrible"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2653.53,"endTime":2659.17,"body":"place to work. But then it's so"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2653.53,"endTime":2659.17,"body":"hard to find another job. But"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2659.17,"endTime":2661.96,"body":"it's jus, I don't know. It's"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2659.17,"endTime":2661.96,"body":"just this, this huge problem."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2663.159,"endTime":2667.358,"body":"Yeah. Ideally, we"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2663.159,"endTime":2667.358,"body":"want to build a network of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2667.358,"endTime":2671.259,"body":"companies that we know without a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2667.358,"endTime":2671.259,"body":"shadow of a doubt, like just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2671.438,"endTime":2674.949,"body":"support juniors, like from the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2671.438,"endTime":2674.949,"body":"ground up in every direction."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2676.059,"endTime":2679.958,"body":"And that's, that's really what"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2676.059,"endTime":2679.958,"body":"we want for it is just, oh,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2679.958,"endTime":2682.059,"body":"you're, you're a new candidate,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2679.958,"endTime":2682.059,"body":"you're looking for a job, okay."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2682.059,"endTime":2686.048,"body":"Well, we know these 15 guys, or,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2682.059,"endTime":2686.048,"body":"you know, these 15 companies"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2686.048,"endTime":2690.159,"body":"are, are hiring and we have a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2686.048,"endTime":2690.159,"body":"good working relationship with"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2690.159,"endTime":2693.458,"body":"all of them. And we know"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2690.159,"endTime":2693.458,"body":"regardless of where you end up,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2693.909,"endTime":2695.289,"body":"any of them are going to take"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2693.909,"endTime":2695.289,"body":"care of you."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2696.199,"endTime":2698.63,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2696.199,"endTime":2698.63,"body":"that's so awesome. And it's nice"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2698.63,"endTime":2702.739,"body":"to have connections with"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2698.63,"endTime":2702.739,"body":"communities where you can see"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2702.949,"endTime":2705.739,"body":"junior developers who need jobs,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2702.949,"endTime":2705.739,"body":"and you know that you can vouch"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2705.739,"endTime":2709.46,"body":"for them too, right? Like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2705.739,"endTime":2709.46,"body":"there's a difference. You'll get"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2709.46,"endTime":2712.159,"body":"the, I'll get those Twitter"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2709.46,"endTime":2712.159,"body":"messages like, hey, I saw you"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2712.159,"endTime":2715.369,"body":"asked about your friend wanting"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2712.159,"endTime":2715.369,"body":"a dotnet job. I want one too."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2715.369,"endTime":2719.36,"body":"Can you recommend me next? Like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2715.369,"endTime":2719.36,"body":"no (laugh), I don't know you."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2720.679,"endTime":2722.524,"body":"(laugh) I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2720.679,"endTime":2722.524,"body":"actually just had a, I guess was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2722.524,"endTime":2724.369,"body":"kind of a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2724.369,"endTime":2730.75,"body":"screening call last week with a"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2724.369,"endTime":2730.75,"body":"company that they just"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2727.78,"endTime":2735.489,"body":"like, they hit me up on Twitter,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2727.78,"endTime":2735.489,"body":"like, out of nowhere. And I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2730.75,"endTime":2739.15,"body":"spent like the last 10 minutes"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2730.75,"endTime":2739.15,"body":"of that interview, like talking"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2735.489,"endTime":2742.78,"body":"someone up from Virtual Coffee,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2735.489,"endTime":2742.78,"body":"because that referred them to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2739.15,"endTime":2743.275,"body":"apply to the application. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2739.15,"endTime":2743.275,"body":"like, the lady I was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2743.275,"endTime":2747.4,"body":"interviewing"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2742.809,"endTime":2749.409,"body":"with, she's like, okay, she was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2742.809,"endTime":2749.409,"body":"about to do like her"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2747.4,"endTime":2753.159,"body":"little goodbye speech. And I was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2747.4,"endTime":2753.159,"body":"like, wait, before you go. Let"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2749.409,"endTime":2755.409,"body":"me tell you about this person."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2749.409,"endTime":2755.409,"body":"And I was like, they do this,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2753.159,"endTime":2759.309,"body":"they do this, they have this"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2753.159,"endTime":2759.309,"body":"experience. Look at their"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2755.409,"endTime":2759.309,"body":"application. Forget about mine."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2759.369,"endTime":2759.94,"body":"Nice."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2762.789,"endTime":2764.53,"body":"Okay, so"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2762.789,"endTime":2764.53,"body":"another thing I want to talk"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2764.53,"endTime":2768.159,"body":"about, because you are just"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2764.53,"endTime":2768.159,"body":"doing like stacks on stacks of"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2768.159,"endTime":2772.21,"body":"things. Okay, so you're building"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2768.159,"endTime":2772.21,"body":"a career, you're building a"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2772.239,"endTime":2777.309,"body":"community slash movement. And"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2772.239,"endTime":2777.309,"body":"it's an also an open source"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2777.309,"endTime":2780.369,"body":"project, and you're streaming"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2777.309,"endTime":2780.369,"body":"some of this. So you're like,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2780.489,"endTime":2783.249,"body":"okay, let me make this even more"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2780.489,"endTime":2783.249,"body":"difficult (laugh). So I'm going"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2783.249,"endTime":2786.009,"body":"to add"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2786.01,"endTime":2788.8,"body":"the open source maintainer"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2786.01,"endTime":2788.8,"body":"thing, and I'm going to stream"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2788.8,"endTime":2794.59,"body":"it. So what was the idea behind"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2788.8,"endTime":2794.59,"body":"adding those components? And,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2794.86,"endTime":2797.86,"body":"you know, I, both I'm interested"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2794.86,"endTime":2797.86,"body":"in like, how has that been"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2797.86,"endTime":2801.88,"body":"challenging? But also like, how"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":2797.86,"endTime":2801.88,"body":"has that helped you as well?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2802.409,"endTime":2805.05,"body":"Well, we decided"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2802.409,"endTime":2805.05,"body":"to make an open source, because"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2805.05,"endTime":2809.61,"body":"we wanted a way... Well, one of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2805.05,"endTime":2809.61,"body":"the questions we kept asking"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2809.61,"endTime":2813.69,"body":"ourselves early on was like,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2809.61,"endTime":2813.69,"body":"what can we do to let the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2813.69,"endTime":2815.849,"body":"companies know that the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2813.69,"endTime":2815.849,"body":"candidates they're considering"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2815.849,"endTime":2821.699,"body":"here are, you know, worth, worth"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2815.849,"endTime":2821.699,"body":"the hire, and one of the ways"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2821.699,"endTime":2826.65,"body":"we thought we can do that was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2821.699,"endTime":2826.65,"body":"make it an open source project"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2826.65,"endTime":2829.44,"body":"to where those candidates can"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2826.65,"endTime":2829.44,"body":"actually contribute to the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2829.44,"endTime":2833.519,"body":"platform itself, you know, we,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2829.44,"endTime":2833.519,"body":"we display anyone's who's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2833.789,"endTime":2838.65,"body":"contributed to the project is on"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2833.789,"endTime":2838.65,"body":"our contributors page. And the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2838.65,"endTime":2842.519,"body":"idea behind that was that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2838.65,"endTime":2842.519,"body":"companies could, ideally in our"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2842.519,"endTime":2845.639,"body":"heads is that played out,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2842.519,"endTime":2845.639,"body":"companies come here, they, they"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2845.639,"endTime":2848.909,"body":"want to post a job. And then"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2845.639,"endTime":2848.909,"body":"they see it on the contributors"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2848.909,"endTime":2852.239,"body":"page that, oh, so there's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2848.909,"endTime":2852.239,"body":"actually six applicants here"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2852.239,"endTime":2855.63,"body":"that have actively helped to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2852.239,"endTime":2855.63,"body":"build the platform I'm listing"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2855.63,"endTime":2858.719,"body":"this job on, you know? Maybe,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2855.63,"endTime":2858.719,"body":"maybe that'll help give them"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2858.719,"endTime":2862.44,"body":"some preference or something."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2858.719,"endTime":2862.44,"body":"And even if it doesn't, then,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2862.71,"endTime":2866.579,"body":"you know, we're doing our best"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2862.71,"endTime":2866.579,"body":"to, to help junior developers,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2866.579,"endTime":2869.519,"body":"so even if it doesn't help in"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2866.579,"endTime":2869.519,"body":"that regard, it gives them the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2869.519,"endTime":2875.369,"body":"opportunity to work on a real"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2869.519,"endTime":2875.369,"body":"world app that they can add to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2875.369,"endTime":2878.82,"body":"their resume. I mean, even if"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2875.369,"endTime":2878.82,"body":"it's just, you know, I think"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2878.82,"endTime":2881.61,"body":"there's been some contributions"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2878.82,"endTime":2881.61,"body":"that were just accessibility"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2881.61,"endTime":2886.139,"body":"fixes. But, you know, that may"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2881.61,"endTime":2886.139,"body":"have just been, you know, from"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2886.139,"endTime":2887.459,"body":"code perspective, all they did"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2886.139,"endTime":2887.459,"body":"was changed the Tailwind class,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2887.459,"endTime":2888.779,"body":"but,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2889.11,"endTime":2893.909,"body":"you know, they also set up the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2889.11,"endTime":2893.909,"body":"project locally, they also, they"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2893.909,"endTime":2896.67,"body":"also, you know, at least have an"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2893.909,"endTime":2896.67,"body":"understanding of Git and how"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2896.67,"endTime":2901.92,"body":"that whole process works. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2896.67,"endTime":2901.92,"body":"that was, that was a lot of the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2901.92,"endTime":2906.63,"body":"reasons why we decided to do"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2901.92,"endTime":2906.63,"body":"that. I decided to stream it,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2906.659,"endTime":2913.44,"body":"because... Partly because I was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2906.659,"endTime":2913.44,"body":"unemployed and bored, partly"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2913.44,"endTime":2917.61,"body":"because I wanted to force myself"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2913.44,"endTime":2917.61,"body":"into some accountability. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2917.61,"endTime":2921.15,"body":"like, now, there's a lot of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2917.61,"endTime":2921.15,"body":"people out there that know this"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2921.15,"endTime":2927.869,"body":"is a thing, so I don't want to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2921.15,"endTime":2927.869,"body":"say they're depending on me, but"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2927.9,"endTime":2930.465,"body":"they know it's a thing. And"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2927.9,"endTime":2930.465,"body":"if... I'd feel really bad if I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2930.465,"endTime":2933.03,"body":"started"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2933.03,"endTime":2935.099,"body":"building this thing that was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2933.03,"endTime":2935.099,"body":"gonna help the community and"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2935.099,"endTime":2939.0,"body":"then just like, let it go. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2935.099,"endTime":2939.0,"body":"now I have all these people that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2939.0,"endTime":2941.55,"body":"know it's a thing and they can"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2939.0,"endTime":2941.55,"body":"just say, hey, how's, how's that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2941.55,"endTime":2946.199,"body":"going? And my response can never"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2941.55,"endTime":2946.199,"body":"be, oh, I turned it off. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2946.199,"endTime":2947.88,"body":"that, that's, that's never gonna"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2946.199,"endTime":2947.88,"body":"be a thing."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2948.78,"endTime":2951.78,"body":"I like that idea of the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2948.78,"endTime":2951.78,"body":"streaming for, for"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2951.78,"endTime":2956.099,"body":"accountability, you know? I"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2951.78,"endTime":2956.099,"body":"mean, the side project issue,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2956.13,"endTime":2959.309,"body":"you know, of abandoning in or"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2956.13,"endTime":2959.309,"body":"not, or whatever, and you're"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2959.309,"endTime":2961.44,"body":"right. You're, you already have,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2959.309,"endTime":2961.44,"body":"you have an audience of, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2961.44,"endTime":2965.82,"body":"know, you have people coming in,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2961.44,"endTime":2965.82,"body":"but that the, the streaming, I"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2965.82,"endTime":2970.739,"body":"feel like is, is a interesting"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2965.82,"endTime":2970.739,"body":"bit to add, just for like the"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2970.739,"endTime":2972.269,"body":"accountability, part of it, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2970.739,"endTime":2972.269,"body":"know? I think that's really"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":2972.269,"endTime":2973.799,"body":"cool."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2974.639,"endTime":2976.409,"body":"Yeah, and"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2974.639,"endTime":2976.409,"body":"there's, there's actually parts"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2976.409,"endTime":2979.26,"body":"of the application now that"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2976.409,"endTime":2979.26,"body":"wouldn't exist if it wouldn't"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2979.26,"endTime":2982.829,"body":"have been for, for streaming"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2979.26,"endTime":2982.829,"body":"because I'd hit a bug or get"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2982.829,"endTime":2984.84,"body":"hung up on something that I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2982.829,"endTime":2984.84,"body":"probably would have never found,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2984.84,"endTime":2990.389,"body":"but there have been, there been"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2984.84,"endTime":2990.389,"body":"people in the chat that were,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2990.42,"endTime":2993.42,"body":"you know, helping me debug some"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2990.42,"endTime":2993.42,"body":"stuff. And if you look on the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2993.449,"endTime":2999.15,"body":"contributors page, the last"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2993.449,"endTime":2999.15,"body":"three entries on it, it actually"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2999.15,"endTime":3002.15,"body":"just says special commit. Those"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":2999.15,"endTime":3002.15,"body":"are there because those are,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3002.21,"endTime":3005.269,"body":"those are three people that were"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3002.21,"endTime":3005.269,"body":"consistently there for, I think"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3005.269,"endTime":3007.34,"body":"the first two months, I was"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3005.269,"endTime":3007.34,"body":"working on building a stream to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3007.34,"endTime":3012.409,"body":"pretty much every day. So those"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3007.34,"endTime":3012.409,"body":"three people were there for"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3013.01,"endTime":3017.179,"body":"probably 85% of that streaming"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3013.01,"endTime":3017.179,"body":"process. And we're doing a lot"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3017.179,"endTime":3019.519,"body":"of like, you know, coaching or"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3017.179,"endTime":3019.519,"body":"problem solving with me through"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3019.519,"endTime":3021.859,"body":"the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3021.86,"endTime":3026.69,"body":"chat. So that's what, that's why"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3021.86,"endTime":3026.69,"body":"we put them up there. Yeah, and"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3026.69,"endTime":3030.199,"body":"we've had, we haven't really"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3026.69,"endTime":3030.199,"body":"done much marketing for Protege."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3030.199,"endTime":3034.67,"body":"I feel, I feel weird trying to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3030.199,"endTime":3034.67,"body":"market a thing I built, but it's"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3034.699,"endTime":3035.734,"body":"kind of, kind of through"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3034.699,"endTime":3035.734,"body":"Twitter, and through streaming,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3035.734,"endTime":3036.769,"body":"and"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3036.769,"endTime":3040.34,"body":"through a couple of other"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3036.769,"endTime":3040.34,"body":"communities, we, we've somehow"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3040.34,"endTime":3045.679,"body":"managed to, we average around"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3040.34,"endTime":3045.679,"body":"400 users per month, which, you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3045.679,"endTime":3049.789,"body":"know, in the, in the larger"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3045.679,"endTime":3049.789,"body":"scale of Google Analytics"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3049.789,"endTime":3053.119,"body":"probably isn't a whole lot. But"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3049.789,"endTime":3053.119,"body":"for, for something I started"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3053.119,"endTime":3056.869,"body":"building out of nowhere last"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3053.119,"endTime":3056.869,"body":"year with no marketing, I think"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3056.869,"endTime":3061.34,"body":"that's pretty good numbers. So"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3056.869,"endTime":3061.34,"body":"we're really, we have a phase"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3061.34,"endTime":3063.86,"body":"two, we're kind of like ramping"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3061.34,"endTime":3063.86,"body":"up for now, which is part of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3063.92,"endTime":3070.07,"body":"next, the next migration as part"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3063.92,"endTime":3070.07,"body":"of that. So we want, we want to"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3070.07,"endTime":3074.389,"body":"get those numbers up not because"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3070.07,"endTime":3074.389,"body":"we want, you know, good"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3074.539,"endTime":3080.36,"body":"analytic points, or whatever the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3074.539,"endTime":3080.36,"body":"business side of that is, but if"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3080.36,"endTime":3083.0,"body":"we can get that number up, then"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3080.36,"endTime":3083.0,"body":"that's more people that are,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3083.719,"endTime":3086.42,"body":"that's just more people we're"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3083.719,"endTime":3086.42,"body":"helping or, you know, maybe it"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3086.809,"endTime":3090.71,"body":"at least giving hope that you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3086.809,"endTime":3090.71,"body":"know, someone's out there doing"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3090.71,"endTime":3093.019,"body":"something on, on the behalf of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3090.71,"endTime":3093.019,"body":"them."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3094.53,"endTime":3097.71,"body":"Absolutely. And, you"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3094.53,"endTime":3097.71,"body":"know, the bigger community gets"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3097.739,"endTime":3102.449,"body":"like around that or audience or"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3097.739,"endTime":3102.449,"body":"whatever, you know, the more,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3102.48,"endTime":3105.119,"body":"it's sort of exponentially"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3102.48,"endTime":3105.119,"body":"increases the exposure without"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3105.51,"endTime":3110.76,"body":"even doing ads, or you know,"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3105.51,"endTime":3110.76,"body":"anything specific did grow"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3110.76,"endTime":3113.4,"body":"it, you know, yeah. That's"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3110.76,"endTime":3113.4,"body":"really cool."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3114.449,"endTime":3114.78,"body":"All right,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3114.449,"endTime":3114.78,"body":"Drew,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3115.199,"endTime":3118.739,"body":"thanks for being here with us."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3115.199,"endTime":3118.739,"body":"We really enjoyed having you."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3118.8,"endTime":3121.739,"body":"And congratulations on"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3118.8,"endTime":3121.739,"body":"everything that you've done with"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3121.739,"endTime":3125.369,"body":"Protege and for your one year,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3121.739,"endTime":3125.369,"body":"anniversary, or birthday, or"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3125.369,"endTime":3129.0,"body":"whatever you want to call it"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3125.369,"endTime":3129.0,"body":"going up. So where can our"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3129.0,"endTime":3129.9,"body":"listeners find you?"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3131.67,"endTime":3136.409,"body":"You can find me"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3131.67,"endTime":3136.409,"body":"on Twitter @drewclemcr8,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3136.409,"endTime":3138.764,"body":"drew-clem-c-r-8, because you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3136.409,"endTime":3138.764,"body":"know, all the good handles are"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3138.764,"endTime":3141.119,"body":"taken."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3142.23,"endTime":3146.159,"body":"You can find me, I haven't been"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3142.23,"endTime":3146.159,"body":"streaming a lot lately, because"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3146.159,"endTime":3151.679,"body":"of, you know, work and two kids."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3146.159,"endTime":3151.679,"body":"But I'm on Twitch at"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3151.71,"endTime":3156.719,"body":"twitch.tv/ducky_87. I used to do"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3151.71,"endTime":3156.719,"body":"some gaming"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3156.719,"endTime":3159.869,"body":"streaming like, four years ago,"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3156.719,"endTime":3159.869,"body":"and I just never changed the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3159.869,"endTime":3166.559,"body":"handle. And now just kind of"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3159.869,"endTime":3166.559,"body":"like it, so... And you can also"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3166.559,"endTime":3171.119,"body":"find me, you can find me in the"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3166.559,"endTime":3171.119,"body":"Virtual Coffee sessions. Do you"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3171.119,"endTime":3173.76,"body":"ever want to pop in and join one"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3171.119,"endTime":3173.76,"body":"of those? Usually on Tuesdays. I"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3173.76,"endTime":3175.44,"body":"can't make, I usually can't make"},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3173.76,"endTime":3175.44,"body":"Thursdays."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3176.28,"endTime":3178.679,"body":"Yeah. And"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3176.28,"endTime":3178.679,"body":"also there's some open issues on"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3178.679,"endTime":3182.429,"body":"Protege. So if you're interested"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3178.679,"endTime":3182.429,"body":"in contributing, it's a great"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3182.429,"endTime":3185.73,"body":"project. It's got a great"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3182.429,"endTime":3185.73,"body":"community behind it. And there's"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3185.73,"endTime":3189.389,"body":"lots of people there too,"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3185.73,"endTime":3189.389,"body":"willing to help and answer"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3189.389,"endTime":3193.889,"body":"questions. So we're very glad"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3189.389,"endTime":3193.889,"body":"that you came here on this"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3193.889,"endTime":3196.26,"body":"podcast and that you've been"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3193.889,"endTime":3196.26,"body":"working on this project. So"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3196.289,"endTime":3197.909,"body":"thanks, Drew."},{"speaker":"Drew Clements","startTime":3197.909,"endTime":3198.96,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3198.96,"endTime":3199.5,"body":"Thanks, Drew."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3203.44,"endTime":3205.329,"body":"Thank you"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3203.44,"endTime":3205.329,"body":"for listening to this episode of"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3205.329,"endTime":3209.53,"body":"the Virtual Coffee podcast. This"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3205.329,"endTime":3209.53,"body":"episode was produced by Dan Ott"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3209.53,"endTime":3213.73,"body":"and Bekah Hawrot Weigel, and"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3209.53,"endTime":3213.73,"body":"edited by Dan Ott. If you have"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3213.73,"endTime":3215.335,"body":"questions or comments, you can"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3213.73,"endTime":3215.335,"body":"hit us up on Twitter"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3215.335,"endTime":3216.94,"body":"@VirtualCoffeeIO."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3216.94,"endTime":3221.889,"body":"Or you can email us at"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3216.94,"endTime":3221.889,"body":"podcast@virtualcoffee.io."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3222.909,"endTime":3225.519,"body":"You can find the show notes."},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3222.909,"endTime":3225.519,"body":"Plus you can sign up for our"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3225.519,"endTime":3228.579,"body":"newsletter to find out what"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3225.519,"endTime":3228.579,"body":"Virtual Coffee has been up to on"},{"speaker":"Bekah Hawrot Weigel","startTime":3228.579,"endTime":3230.829,"body":"our website at virtualcoffee.io."},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3233.159,"endTime":3235.858,"body":"Please subscribe to our"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3233.159,"endTime":3235.858,"body":"podcast and be sure to leave us"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3235.858,"endTime":3239.068,"body":"a review. Thanks for listening"},{"speaker":"Dan Ott","startTime":3235.858,"endTime":3239.068,"body":"and we'll see you next week."}]}